Healthcare. The problem? Two major parties want it both ways.

We all are well aware of the current healthcare "reform" debacle. How could we not be? That's all we hear in the media with intermittent reference to Russia-Charlie collusion, Korea and Syria.

We've, ATSers, have all seen all the threads about the ACA and what "should" and "shouldn't" be done. What hasn't been discussed is why our policy makers can't come to any viable solution.

What is obvious, on an itemized list of issues, not just on the problem of healthcare "reform," is that both parties and many of their proponents want it both ways.

Democrats basically want universal healthcare paid by tax payers, but they would be staunchly against a flat tax that EVERYONE would have to pay into to fund it.

Republicans want basically a "at will" system where you buy your own insurance, but they don't want wages high enough to where everyone could afford to make the decision to pay bloated health insurance fees.

You see the conundrum? It's like saying, I want a beer but no after taste, or I want to eat an onion but not have onion breath.

I know those are silly analogies, but they're easy to relay. Sue me.

This is a major problem within politics on a great many issues, not just concerning healthcare. Point? Unless there's some flexibility, there's not going to be a viable solution. You can't have it both ways.

a reply to: SpeakerofTruth

Agreed. You are absolutely correct.

Prepare to get hammered from both sides though.

a reply to: SpeakerofTruth

The biggest problem they have is that many countries have universal health care ... and it works.

Whu the hell they can't send a couple of Senators to each of the countries with universal health care ... to have a gander at the system working ... and have a holiday at the same time ... on the tax payers ... is beyond me.

The problem is they have their heads stuck so far up each others butts ... they could not do something meaningful.

The real problem is that your reps take money from the involved corporations ... sorry ... they are just donations ... and this is the real problem.

So ........ fix up the swamp first .... then get great health care.

P

a reply to: pheonix358

Why does the U.S. have to adopt the failed system of Socialist countries? All you need to do is eliminate health insurance companies and prices will come down to affordable levels.

originally posted by: pheonix358
a reply to: SpeakerofTruth

The biggest problem they have is that many countries have universal health care ... and it works.

Since when? Where? How universal?

Answers: Never, nowhere, not at all. Talk to Charlie Gard's parents about how universal their kid's care was.

Sapping people's prosperity for a one-size-fits-all mediocre band-aid is not cost effective.

originally posted by: Teikiatsu

originally posted by: pheonix358
a reply to: SpeakerofTruth

The biggest problem they have is that many countries have universal health care ... and it works.

Since when? Where? How universal?

Answers: Never, nowhere, not at all. Talk to Charlie Gard's parents about how universal their kid's care was.

Sapping people's prosperity for a one-size-fits-all mediocre band-aid is not cost effective.

Why not do some research ... but you would rather just fling some poop.

America yah!

P

a reply to: redhorse

Oh, I already know. Lol, and neither side will ever admit that wanting it both ways is a problem...

It is a constant theme no matter the issue.

Of course, it's probably not so much the common person that needs to understand the problem as it is our so-called "representatives." After all, they're the ones who are supposed to be hammering out a "solution."

a reply to: SpeakerofTruth

I don't see why everyone is complaining.

They wanted government-run healthcare, and that is what they are going to get.

Just to point out that there are those of us who said our government is not equipped to handle it, that our government is filled with inept, cowardly, power-hungry morons.

Hate to be that guy, but we told you so!


(not you, specifically, OP)

a reply to: SpeakerofTruth

Wolf in charge of the hen house would be another analogy that applies.

Too big to fail. New vehicles still cost 30k and we all know how fast they devalue.

Protests from coast to coast over the supposed ineffectiveness of government but some are more than willing to let them handle healthcare. For anyone paying attention, they aren't doing squat about the care but are arguing over who gets to insure and with whoms money.

a reply to: DBCowboy

Well, heh, as a general rule, government operated anything tends to not operate very efficiently.

I just can see how either side could have their way, but not without some flexibility. However, that doesn't seem to even be a consideration in the minds of very many of the representatives from either side. Hence, we have what we have now. It's only going to get worse.

a reply to: SpeakerofTruth

Since OUR government OWNS and ADMINISTERS ObamaCare, OUR government should force lower prices for medical care for ObamaCare health plans.

They force lower medical care prices for their MEDICAID and MEDICARE programs. Why not for their ObamaCare program as well?

originally posted by: Metallicus
a reply to: pheonix358

Why does the U.S. have to adopt the failed system of Socialist countries? All you need to do is eliminate health insurance companies and prices will come down to affordable levels.

I know,, why adopt a system that actually looks after its citizens health, instead of raping their bank accounts if they have one when they get sick.

a reply to: pheonix358

While I can understand your point, even without the involvement of corporations, banks and special interest groups it would still wind up in a stalemate without any flexibility on the issues I mentioned in my OP. If it won't bend, guess what... It breaks.

That's exactly what will wind up happening. It's going to break because neither side is going to agree upon any viable solution because they're not going to flex... Watch and see.

originally posted by: Metallicus
a reply to: pheonix358

Why does the U.S. have to adopt the failed system of Socialist countries? All you need to do is eliminate health insurance companies and prices will come down to affordable levels.

Health Insurance companies are only allowed (by ObamaCare law) to keep 20% of the premium paid. A 20% reduction would help some, but not much, when your family's is $1,500 a month.

a reply to: carewemust

Well, there you go. I don't know how anyone can honestly think that someone making say $2200 a month can afford an $800-900 monthly insurance payment for their family.

That leaves $1300-$1400 a month to survive on. For a family? Really? Hell, it's hard enough for a single person to survive on that, much less a family.

a reply to: SpeakerofTruth


If your income is 2,200 a month and you're a 3 person family, your monthly premium can (by law) be no more than $66.90 a month. Ref: www.abovetopsecret.com...

And your individual deductible is capped at $500 per year. (It' actually $6,000, but your fellow taxpayers cover the difference, if you have medical claims.)

I have some breaking news for members of Congress on both sides of the aisle. Your decisions impact real people. The debate over healthcare should not be driven by politics, but making the most sound decisions that create the greatest positive impact on people's lives.

Republicans and Democrats need to grow up

a reply to: carewemust

Well, I will say one thing about your thread, you pointed out how the middle class is basically getting "the finger..." That has been the case for quite some time in a variety of ways. I don't even know what the "middle class" is anymore.

a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

Well, I am assuming you're referring to prescription costs, doctor fees, et cetera on top of insurance cost... Prescription costs have been an issue for quite some time.

a reply to: SpeakerofTruth


No I am talking about how if you get sick over there you pay through your ass to get better and if you have no money you get what exactly ?


I really do not understand why you guys are so against a universal healthcare, it works it really does, no body gets left out and there is no need to mortgage your house top pay your med bills.