Russians Who Met With Trump Jr Also Met With Rohrabacher

originally posted by: seeker1963
a reply to: theantediluvian

Let's look at the ethics of Rico Hines the so called author of this piece shall we?

Early on Thursday, The Daily Beast published an article by London editor Nico Hines in which he "reported" on his use of Grindr at the 2016 Rio Olympics. Hines is a straight man, and the article is an unethical mess. 
Hines, who is married with children, included the heights, weights and countries of origin of several athletes whom he arranged dates with in the piece. That he saw this as no big deal is a huge problem and shows that he is blind to his own privilege by writing it. 
Putting an Olympian's stats next to their country of origin endangers the well-being of that person, especially when one athlete was from Central Asia, a region in which LGBT people are "marginalized, criminalized, and are exposed to high levels of violence, harassment and discrimination," according to one U.S. congressman's testimony.

Source


Yea, this guy sounds like a really reliable source for this type of information......


Try harder Ante

Step One: Fake news
Step Two: discredit the source.
Now on to step three...

a reply to: Sillyolme

How does that address what I said? My post had to do with how he tried to word it as if they followed some Russian guys orders...when in reality he was requested...a word synonymous with ask not tell or order...which is a pretty dishonest way to put it. Of course for you that's par for the course...

a reply to: theantediluvian

I'm not super familiar with this maginski act and its history so it wouldn't be easy for me to form an opinion on that yet. It could be that he was trying to work on easing tensions between us and Russia which I am all for. Right now we are in a game of tit for tat with them...a game we started albeit to stem the spread of communisim, which I don't think was our place to decide for others. Or it could be that the act is appropriate and necessary in which case he still has a right to disagree with it and do whatever he needs to as a politician to change it. If what info the Russians gave him was factual then how is it a bad thing that he brought it back to legislation? What really gets me is how all of a sudden people think our politicians should be in some kind of bubble where they don't interact in the way politics is played just because some people look at a nation as the enemy. I think politics is a dirty underhanded dishonest game and despise it, but that doesn't mean that to play in the game you don't have to play it the way its played.

In short I'm conflicted and without the proper background I would have a hard time forming my own opinions about his actions.

Wording things the way you did is just as dishonest as the alleged propaganda you wrote about...and that's what I wanted to point out in my post...which is a contribution to the thread.

The Atlantic is reporting on this as well and naming at least one source:

Russian Anti-Sanctions Campaign Turned to California Congressman

One of the officials on the ground, Alamanda Gribbin, an embassy control officer, said she had seen the document given to Rohrabacher before, according to one of the sources. The document is marked “confidential” at the top and is full of accusations against Sergei Magnitsky, the Russian lawyer who died in prison in 2009 and for whom the act is named, and Bill Browder, the Hermitage Capital CEO for whom Magnitsky worked and who has been one of the key people behind the legislation.

State was “really concerned” about whom Rohrabacher was meeting with, another source with knowledge of the trip said. “They were under the impression they were FSB agents.”

Rohrabacher aide Paul Behrends, this source said, “was telling people they were from the prosecutors’ office in Moscow.” The FT reported that the person who gave Rohrabacher the document was Viktor Grin, a top aide to Yuri Chaika, the Russian prosecutor general with whom Veselnitskaya, the lawyer in the Trump Tower meeting, told the Wall Street Journal she was in contact.

One of the sources familiar with the trip said that neither Rohrabacher nor Behrends appeared to take the warning seriously and said it was Behrends who was setting up the meetings.

“Paul was present as the on-the-scene coordinator for Rep. Rohrabacher, nothing more,” said Ken Grubbs, Rohrabacher’s press secretary. Grubbs said that Behrends “almost certainly was at the congressman's side” for the meeting.

Grubbs did not dispute that a warning had been given, but said the conversation with the prosecutors had been “nothing substantive.”

a reply to: theantediluvian


Why and how would an Equal Opportunity Employment officer at the DoS be privy to this information?

Embassy Control Officer doesn't even come up on a search on the internet! roflmao

a reply to: RickyD

I can try to give you the brief rundown. This might be deemed the "Western perspective" if you favor the Russian interpretation of things.

Magnitsky was a lawyer/auditor for a firm in Russia. He was hired by an American ex-pat, Bill Browder, who had been expelled from Russia as a "national threat" having been denied reentry in 2005 and having had his visa annulled. Browder, it should be noted, was also a vocal critic of corrupt Russian officials.

In 2007, the HCM offices were raided as were those of Magnitsky's employer, Firestone Duncan. The allegation was tax evasion and tax fraud.

According to what Sergei Magnitsky uncovered, Russian organized crime was essentially given material seized by the authorities and used it to forge a change of ownership of 3 of the businesses owned by HCM with cooperation by corrupt officials. They were then able to claim $230 million in tax rebates from the businesses.

Magnitsky was arrested and imprisoned for more than a year. During his time in prison, he developed serious medical issues which weren't treated and died. Evidence showed that he had been beaten shortly before his death.

The "Magnitsky Act" (Russia and Moldova Jackson-Vanik Repeal and Sergei Magnitsky Rule of Law Accountability Act of 2012) essentially sanctions 44 Russians and was passed in 2012 following years of outrage in the international community.

Within days of this, the Russian State Duma responded with their own act preventing Americans from adopting Russian children. (which is where this "adoption" horses# comes from)

Where the company Prezevon — Natalia Veselnitskaya's client — comes into the picture is that they were being investigated for being a front to launder millions of dollars from this scheme, including purchases of high value NY real estate. This was a case that was being prosecuted by Preet Bharara and has since been settled by the Acting U.S. attorney for the Southern District, Joon Kim. The official line (which could be true) is that the case wasn't a "slam dunk."

Natalia Veselnitskaya has not only been involved in defending Prezevon but in trying to foist an actual "Russian narrative" that Magnitsky and Browder were the real criminals and to lobby to have the act repealed. She was a principal in the development of the film which Rohrabacher was trying to promote. She also has some sham human rights organization.

I'm sure I'm leaving things out, it's a pretty involved topic which is why it will be largely avoided by a most people.

a reply to: RickyD

Wording things the way you did is just as dishonest as the alleged propaganda you wrote about...and that's what I wanted to point out in my post...which is a contribution to the thread.

You're welcome to your opinion as I am to mine. I don't see it as dishonest at all. I fully believe, based on the sequence of events, that Rohrabacher is a Kremlin stooge. That's my opinion and I never claimed otherwise. It also appears to be an opinion shared to some extent by his own GOP peers in Congress though they claim to have been "joking."

a reply to: theantediluvian

Yea that sounds like something I would have to take a few days to study to actually be comfortable stating an opinion on. Things get very murky when going back and forth about legalities and such concerning countries like Russia due to the high amount of corrupt activity, not unlike us here in the states lol...go figure.

What I will opine on is how the tit for tat we play back and forth is really very counter productive to a peaceful world and at this point it has been going on for so long I don't feel it matters anymore who started it and who's winning, I just think it needs to be gotten past. Imagine if we found ourselves in a position that we could actually work with one of the worlds superpowers rather than against them. I think that would be best for the people of the nations involved. In fact maybe if we were able to spend less time playing games with Russia we could focus our energy and resources a lot more on China, which I see as a much much bigger threat to the US. Not only can they actually really effect our economy but they now are pushing hard and fast to be able to project force on the level of the US. If we allow that they will eventually out match us in sheer manpower which is not good at all.

a reply to: theantediluvian

Forgive me for being plebian, but wtf does this have to do with Trump? Am I missing something here? Was something illegal done? If so I don't believe it's in the OP.

Is there some law broken or is this just more Russia collusion porn for the chronically desperate mental masturbaters?

a reply to: Ksihkehe

What it has to do with Donald Trump Jr, Paul Manafort and Jared Kushner is that the same Russian lawyer and her suspected former Soviet counterintelligence cohort that they met with in June of last year were meeting with and by all accounts, working with, Rep. Rohrabacher and his chief of staff and in the same time frame.

In fact, it would appear that in April of 2016, Rohrabacher received a document from the same Moscow prosecutor's office that was the purported source of the information and documents that Donald Trump Jr was promised by the Agalarov emissary in their email exchange.

Aside from tending to paint Rohrabacher as a Kremlin shill, it also sheds further light on what this crew was up to at that time. It also adds credence to the claim that Veselnitskaya was working for the Kremlin.

It also doesn't bode well at all for the "it was all a conspiracy by (somebody, anybody) to frame Donald Trump Jr." nonsense that is being promoted by dubious right-wing sources.

And I have news for those who think that punishment of elected officials is governed simply by "did he do something illegal?"

First and foremost, Congress determines what constitutes "high crimes and misdemeanors" when it comes to impeachment and there's no requirement for a law to be broken for Congress to censure or even expel Rohrabacher from Congress (that would require a two-thirds majority vote). Everything that is immoral or unethical isn't illegal and everything illegal isn't immoral or unethical.

originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: Ksihkehe

What it has to do with Donald Trump Jr, Paul Manafort and Jared Kushner is that the same Russian lawyer and her suspected former Soviet counterintelligence cohort that they met with in June of last year were meeting with and by all accounts, working with, Rep. Rohrabacher and his chief of staff and in the same time frame.

In fact, it would appear that in April of 2016, Rohrabacher received a document from the same Moscow prosecutor's office that was the purported source of the information and documents that Donald Trump Jr was promised by the Agalarov emissary in their email exchange.

Aside from tending to paint Rohrabacher as a Kremlin shill, it also sheds further light on what this crew was up to at that time. It also adds credence to the claim that Veselnitskaya was working for the Kremlin.

It also doesn't bode well at all for the "it was all a conspiracy by (somebody, anybody) to frame Donald Trump Jr." nonsense that is being promoted by dubious right-wing sources.

And I have news for those who think that punishment of elected officials is governed simply by "did he do something illegal?"

First and foremost, Congress determines what constitutes "high crimes and misdemeanors" when it comes to impeachment and there's no requirement for a law to be broken for Congress to censure or even expel Rohrabacher from Congress (that would require a two-thirds majority vote). Everything that is immoral or unethical isn't illegal and everything illegal isn't immoral or unethical.

That's a whole lot of text to basically say 'shill!' and then offer some pipedream about getting 2/3 to vote to impeach.

So the answer was yes. Yes this is Russia collusion porn.

a reply to: Ksihkehe

Actually, when it comes to Rohrabacher, it would be expulsion. I don't know why you'd think it was a "pipedream." It's a rarity but it's happened twice in modern times. Traficant in 2000-something and Michael Myers in the 80's after his conviction following the Abscam sting.

Are you refuting some aspect of the reporting or did you just drop by to make irrelevant, dismissive comments based on your own personal lack of concern?

Assuming that every word in OP is true, what is wrong with it? What would be the proper way for Russia to plea their case against the Magnitsky Act?

originally posted by: seeker1963
a reply to: theantediluvian


Why and how would an Equal Opportunity Employment officer at the DoS be privy to this information?

Embassy Control Officer doesn't even come up on a search on the internet! roflmao

They have visitor control officers they check visas can contact FBI to verify identities. And handle schedules and document requests for senior staff. If a document goes through the embassy a control officer has seen it.

originally posted by: jaccceee
Assuming that every word in OP is true, what is wrong with it? What would be the proper way for Russia to plea their case against the Magnitsky Act?

Pretty much the way they describe they set up a meeting talk then investigate.

People may find this interesting it at least shows there is some truth to the story.

www.theatlantic.com...