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The Vertical Plane by Ken Webster - Is this proof of Time manipulation and travel or just a story?

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posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 03:13 PM

originally posted by: luciferslight
Like a switch of information from 2109 to 1500 to 1986? So the future goes to the past in order to communicate with the present?

Is that like Daisy Chaining information across time? This is making me think things that are crazy and conspiratorial and I am honest to god embarrassed to even suggest it as a fun idea.

posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 03:31 PM
Either this book is wholly fabricated but cleverly used names of real people who are in cahoots for the longest games of long games or This book is fabricated but without the knowledge of real people who participated and recorded and tested things who still believe what they experienced happened or This happened and was recorded and experienced by multiple people who are still alive and stick to their story but are in no rush to promote or do anything about it because they know inevitability when they see it or ?

I can't figure out if it is time to walk away from the computer or time to really dig in or if it makes any difference.

posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 03:51 PM

The source of communication started out being an early word processor for the couple in 1986 (Ken and Deb) and a "light box" that dictates speech for (Lucas) in the past. Later on in the book other characters enter and claim to be from different times as well, 2109 in particular.

Same general rhetorical tool John Titor used. In the case of Titor it was the circa 1971 "IBM 5100" he traveled back in time to find. The "light box" that Lucas used Circa 1500 predates Isaac Newton and the publishing of "Opticks" by 200 years. The 'man from Lucania' would more likely be a Leonardo da Vinci reference or at least something from the Renaissance.

posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 04:17 PM

originally posted by: sputniksteve
Let me spit ball for a second. In order to physically time travel you must basically switch places simultaneously with someone else. Like preserving balance on a scale.

If sleeping is Physically time traveling then maybe it requires doing it while sleeping and taking the place of another dreaming person. If the consequence or result of not doing it correctly is somehow kicking the original out while you take the place and when you leave they return but have a copy how could that be done while sleeping? When Deb would travel in her sleep, or sleep so that words could be passed or items then they are obviously connected. But when Deb first traveled she manifested in the fireplace I believe and was able to communicate with Lukas. So does that hurt my current line of thought or help it?

Let me go really far out on a limb because it came to me for some reason but how could this be related to dying? Would dying and reincarnating later be time travel if you remembered your first life? Was someones place taken when one died and another was born? In a linear world it wouldn't make sense that the person whose life is switched in the future would then live in the past except we don't live in a linear reality so it's doable theoretically maybe considering this is all fake. If you were dying and people were beckoning you to come to them would they have incentive to help you if they worked for a time travel corporation and needed to insert someone where you were?

I don't know

this would make sense where does all the energy left in our footprint go after we die? it cant just dissipate every movement leaves a foot print but what we call a point in time isn't a point in time but something else. time after all is a concept created by man. this is why they maybe could pass back in time during sleep as they had no concept of time binding them to restriction.

posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 11:59 PM
a reply to: skynet2015

That reminds me of serialism. Have you read John William Dunne's "An Experiment With Time"?

Snippet of Serialism theory copied from Wiki;
The theory resolves the issue by proposing a higher dimension of Time, t2, in which our consciousness experiences its travelling along the timeline in t1. The physical brain itself inhabits only t1, requiring a second level of mind to inhabit t2 and it is at this level that the observer experiences consciousness.

But Dunne found that his logic led to a similar difficulty with t2 in that the passage between successive events in t2 was not included in the model. This led to an even higher t3 in which a third-level observer could experience not just the mass of events in t2 but the passage of those experiences in t2, and so on in the infinite regress of time dimensions and observers which gives the theory its name.

Dunne suggested that when we die, it is only our physical selves in t1 who die and that our higher selves are outside of mundane time. Our conscious selves therefore have no mechanism to die in the same kind of way and are effectively immortal.[1] At the end of the chain he proposed a "superlative general observer, the fount of all ... consciousness"

Is 2109's understanding of time the same as Serialism?

posted on Jul, 15 2017 @ 12:05 AM
a reply to: Cauliflower

Nah, John Titor, apparently, needed the IBM 5100 to fix a computer bug similar to the Y2K bug. Not to communicate across dimensions.

Didn't they discover the guy who pretended to be John Titor was just a computer technician or something? (I believe the titor story to be a hoax)

posted on Jul, 15 2017 @ 12:19 AM
a reply to: sputniksteve

Maybe "one", the figure who appeared to Lukas and gave him the light box, was the one who initiated the experiment. Then 2109 got involved later on, and tried to prevent the experiment from taking place or 2109 tried to minimize the effects of the communication. So if that is true, you have two different factions involved between Lukas and K.D.P.

Then the poltergeist was just K.D.P's "thought" energy causing havoc like a tornado. Remember 2109 said the poltergeist doesn't have a consciousness, and mimics the viewers/P.G creators mind?

When One appeared to Lukas in the green light, he said "don't be afraid", didn't he? That's something UFOnaughts say, e.g Indrid Cold, and angels of the bible say. "Don't be afraid, we mean you no harm."

Anyway, i'm just thinking out loud here, hopefully i didn't go on too many tangents.

And John Dee was alive the same time as Lukas wasn't he? John Dee purportedly created some type of computer and contacted some corporeal beings too. What a coincidence it's the same time as Lukas!

posted on Jul, 15 2017 @ 08:42 AM

originally posted by: PheonixReborn

originally posted by: Bluesma
I find this story fascinating and have tried in vain to get my hands on a cop of that book.

Anyone have one to sell??

You can download it here:

Careful, though as you need to register for a 'free trial' with the site to get the download.

Crap. I fell for it. I signed up for a "free trial". Now there is no access to anything, links don't exist, and I have given my card info. I am usually more careful that. I have the feeling I am screwed.

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 11:42 AM
All right I am going to go out on a limb again and share an idea I just had. I was reading an AMA by the author of the Drake equation and I ran across a link that explained data storage using DNA strands. Then right away I stumbled on an answer by Prof. Drake asking about the intentions or reasons for the Plaque and Record that were sent out on a satellite with information about Humans and Earth and coupons for 2 free pizza parties. The answer to me at least is chilling for some reason I can't seem to explain; A reason those were sent were as timeless testament to our place in this unknown Universe. Long after you and I are dead, after the earth and Sun have decomposed and died out, a Satellite will be flying through space documenting that "Human was here". A transfer of information between civilizations or species over time and distance scales we cannot even begin to comprehend, which should be both useful and understandable to anyone able to grab it. Think about that.

I am almost 40 years old. I can remember most of that almost 40 years. First memories somewhere around the early 80's. To **me** that seems like eternity and it feels consistent and natural. I don't actually know that though, maybe it isn't what I think. Maybe 2 billion years in the future some weirdo tribe of Space Freaks is tutting around in their Cosmic Yachts watching Astral Olympics when they pick up a signal of an unknown meteor close by. They go and check it out only to find our little time capsule. Through some technology advanced enough to be indistinguishable from Black Majic Wizardry they sample our existence in order to check us out, or daisy chain trying to check or talk to "someone" else but we are aware only that something is going on and they are light beings living in a Tachyon reality.

Just a weird idea is all.

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 12:23 PM
Allright I have been looking forward to this point in my DB creation. Here is an anomaly message from 2109 that was "most likely" not supposed to go to 1985, or maybe we were just thrown a bone? In any case, here it is.

"213,978,8]: Irrecoverable
State: Reason for your pretext
State: What 'prerequisite' you intend
State: Logical explanation for intrusive behaviour upon 1985: This is not your concern
Request: 62]:plot.chan.[452.95]
Request: Answer immediately:fed. Awaiting resons for delay"

Now 2109 says they are some kind of light being or some other, Etheral and infinite or something it seems. However that looks really damn Human to me. As a matter of fact all of the language 2109 uses looks really Human to me. I mean it is English, sometimes with a ESL type mispelling, sometimes with a completely normal Human mistake, but almost never what you would consider a complete perfect sentence or paragraph. One time they even started a paragraph with "Dig" in the affirmative. Like Ken asked do you dig? They replied "Dig" without missing a beat. They are obviously impressive but that is spectacular even.

We already know that 2109 who ever they are has manipulated all of the communications that have taken place between 1985 and 1546. I have already expressed my opinion that they are obviously the reason for all of the confusion. I am suggesting at this point in time that all of this is just a ruse to cover their tracks and not make them culpable for F'ing up the "time line".

I suspect that 2109 are just average Human beings a little less than a century from us. Hell for that matter, there are people alive for both of these events and frankly according to the Internet articles I read we could achieve double the life expectancy due to medical advancement so we could still be alive in 2109. They know that it will go down in history from 1985 perspective because they are even then writing that history in 2109 so they are first hand witnesses to it. It may not be written until 2109 for that matter, just because it says they will go down in History doesn't mean it will happen prior to 2109.

Maybe they are lying, maybe about all of it, it is their experiment and they are actively participating in said experiment. Maybe 1985 was a proof of concept for a 2109 Tech start up while "one" was a prerequisite for getting 1546 a computer in a way that wouldn't totally blow his mind. You know what I am saying? Regardless of the time they are putting everything in a context and way that the resident of their perspective time frame can relate to it and not necessarily have the "future" changed by the act.


All off that is still true however the history books will reflect the true weight of this event prior to 2109 due to the stories exposure in 2017 due to a reintroduction to pop culture through this thread inspiring someone much more intelligent or tuned in than us to connect some dots that were previously unconnectable? It obviously hasn't been my motivation or intention but I have to admit that the possibility has occurred to me.

Don't lose your steam folks, we are just getting started! Still so much more info to come, I mean I have an entire book to cover here!

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 12:44 PM
I just realized something. What does it require for a human being to make a mistake typing? It requires a key board. 2109 are telling us either that they are an ethereal Tachyon being communicating through time but sometimes makes mistakes in translating it's thoughts to words; or ; They are humans being typing on a key board and touch pad making the same fat fingered mistakes that humans make since we started using QWERTY.

Obviously there are other options but I found myself seeing a pattern to some of the spelling mistakes that are made. The pattern being I can sometimes make the same mistake they have made. Interesting.

It's almost like an english that would have txt speak injected into it. Befour, Cheep, words like that make me think it is someone that is poorly educated or just values different parts of a language. I don't know if I am making sense or not.

putting a . after an abbreviate kind of stands out to me as well. It's cool these beings know our language well enough to abbreviate our words and then put the correct symbol next to it to indicate it is an abbreviation. I mean I suppose if you could read and understand all of the English language quickly or instantly you would get all of it and not just part of it. Who knows. Just lobbing cooked pasta in random directions.

This also leaves open the possibility that there is more than 1 individual communicating as 2109, that may make the same mistakes while not making a mistake seen commonly elsewhere.
edit on 7/16/2017 by sputniksteve because: (no reason given)

edit on 7/16/2017 by sputniksteve because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 01:33 PM
No idea what happened here but using it for my next post. Just for the time being here is an off topic observation I just made. Our ancestors will have amazing access to our lives considering our grandchildren who are unborn may be able to follow all of our conversations and thoughts through our screen names and online posts. I have been using this name since early 2000's and documents my habits, attitudes, political beliefs, financial security, etc. for almost half of my life. They may even read this post and realize I am talking to them specifically. I hope I am blowing your mind junior.

This post is now a time capsule for my ancestors and I will leave it. It is 1:38pm on 7/16/2017, and I am sitting at the kitchen table with the boy in the living room. Who knows that boy may be your father, grandfather, it may be you son. Now I am nervous and don't know what to say. I am very happy, our lives are extremely good. I love you and I hope someone will be proud of something I have done. I'll see you all on the flip side.

Be Excellent to each other.
Wyld Stallions!

edit on 7/16/2017 by sputniksteve because: (no reason given)

edit on 7/16/2017 by sputniksteve because: Turned it into a time capsule.

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 02:33 PM
Sorry about my break from reality there. Sometimes this is exciting work. In any case I just wanted to reintroduce a chalking that I mentioned in my very first post. Now that we have discussed quite a few things relating and not relating to this book I would like to see if it means anything different or at all to you:

Unknown Time Traveler-
"The eyes are open yet nothing do you see. The grey retarding mass is your convict. Quietly, alone he sits in the dark waiting for sentence to be passed and demanding through the eyes of the blind of unspoken questions to answers of ethereal kind. The soul he is the traveller. Chain nor bar can hold him to frail flesh. Here is the ruler of time and space. Here is your God." - Unknown Time Traveler.

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 02:48 PM
In one conversation 2109 and Ken are speaking and 2109 used the analogy:

"It is not likely to be "The Dansant" instead of "it's not going to be an easy road" or some variation. Sure as heck isn't a term I was familiar with personally as an American. Who knows if it is significant at all or just another anomaly due to knowing an entire language instead of just part or most of it.

"The Dansant" is French for describing a Tea Dance.

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 03:10 PM
There are a lot of elements in this story to cherry pick from.
If we were to light a lamp in Plato's cave and dance it about, the shadows on the cave walls could be interpreted many different ways. Actually if one is truly free to interpret there can be a detrimental lack of cohesiveness to the communication.

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 03:25 PM

originally posted by: Cauliflower
There are a lot of elements in this story to cherry pick from.
If we were to light a lamp in Plato's cave and dance it about, the shadows on the cave walls could be interpreted many different ways. Actually if one is truly free to interpret there can be a detrimental lack of cohesiveness to the communication.

No doubt, it is extremely rocky ground and each foot needs to be placed delicately and with thought. I am doing my best to give "nothing but the facts" in the database while parsing what I think is "real" and what is "red herring" and formulating a hypothesis or scenarios from that extrapolation. Could be right, could be wrong, could be in between. My intention is to get everyone as familiar with the story as possible, or metaphorically "put the books in the hands of everyone" in order to get different perspectives with full access to start assisting.

Everything up till I am finished is just having fun and keeping the conversation going. Realistically I probably should have done this before I started the thread, and I should have written the whole thread out before I posted anything.

I am telling, this is just getting started. We are still in first gear, tires still spinning looking for a bite of traction. Few more revolutions and it's gonna grab. Just watch.

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 04:21 PM
And the 2109 comments Database is complete! I am considering adjusting it to add a section that lists the question asked along with their statement for ease of use as a 1 stop cheat sheet. That won't be done in any big hurry though as I have my hands full with other aspects of this project. Here is another link just in case you missed the previous ones.

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 05:01 PM
One major element of the story is the "light box" device from circa 1500.
Might be the classic magic square/pizza box from Egypt originating thousands of years BC.
There were undoubtedly Renaissance era examples in the art realm of that.

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 07:50 PM
a reply to: Cauliflower

I suppose it may be. I think we should take them at face value and believe it is actually a computer similar to a modern day one in function at least. While Lukas/Thomas didn't know what one was I am almost positive that is what 2109 actually called it. I won't speculate on Magic square/pizza box because I don't know what they are, but another entity who communicated with another person who eventually got a message to Ken after asking about him was told that others from Lukas' area had seen a light box and that it was documented somewhere in hard copy and that people would eventually find that documentation. For whatever that may be worth.

Wow that was a run on sentence!

I am not as interested or curious or concerned about the light box personally. I perceive it as a small piece of a much larger puzzle. The information given on it is limited, and can't really be fabricated in order to supply for more conjecture. I am much more interested in the being that supplied it to say the least and why. I don't think we are going to forensically track down it's make and model somehow in order to prove anything so I don't give it a lot of thought.

edit on 7/16/2017 by sputniksteve because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 16 2017 @ 08:44 PM
a reply to: Bluesma

I did that too, you can cancel. I forget now how I did it but I cancelled mine. There's a link somewhere, either in the email verification you get from them or on their website.

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