The Vertical Plane by Ken Webster - Is this proof of Time manipulation and travel or just a story?

Loving the thread........ This is ATS..

I wonder if 2019 is CERN a couple years from now?

That's all I got.....

Back to lurking I go

What the heck I read up to page 7 before I realized it is 2109 rather then 2019....

Oops

a reply to: GoShredAK

Glad you are enjoying it Shred. It's my current opinion that 2109 doesn't denote a year or place in time at all, but rather it has another significance. I think it is the same as calling them self 3, but in a coded way. This would make sense considering we also have an actor calling them self "One"

Engi-
Ok I will go ahead and buy the book. I do have prime but it seems to complicated to link our accounts and what not.

a reply to: sputniksteve

I don't know how complicated it is to do that, I've never actually done it. My wife tried to lend me a book one time and I was never able to see it. So maybe it's not as straightforward as it seems it should be.

originally posted by: wtbengineer
a reply to: sputniksteve

I don't know how complicated it is to do that, I've never actually done it. My wife tried to lend me a book one time and I was never able to see it. So maybe it's not as straightforward as it seems it should be.

I have done it with my aunt and father before, and pretty sure it requires us to link our accounts. While I have a toooon of great books I don't know that you necessarily want to waste your link to me just for this one book. If you let me know what kind of stuff you like to read for fun I can let you know if you may be interested in what I have to offer. Regardless of whether or not a purchase Chronicles even.

I have tons of really good Sci Fi, Lots of detective novels, many of the Lee Child "Jack Reacher" books, really so many and such a broad range I can't even list them all here. In any case I greatly appreciate the offer but don't mind just buying it myself. I really want to get the other 2 from the suggested reading a couple pages back. An Experiment with time and A sideways look at time, neither of which I was able to find at Half Price Books. I am not even sure if Kindle has them for offer yet.

Off topic, how great is Amazon Unlimited?! I don't currently have a sub for it, only Prime, but if you aren't familiar with Unlimited it is worth far more than the cost to subscribe to it. I have discovered so many great authors and books that I normally wouldn't have bothered to read. Reading is hands down my favorite and cherished past time. I don't know what I would do with my life if I couldn't read. Where the Red Fern grows is what started my obsession at 14 years old. My 3 month old nephew had just passed away from S.I.D.S. and I was lost and hurting bad, when someone gave me that book. I had never bothered to read for pleasure before that book but it changed my life. I have read it a million times since, and while I can barely make it through the first chapter without breaking down in tears it will forever be one of if not my favorites.

a reply to: sputniksteve

Sounds like you do have a lot of books. I have more books to read than time to read them myself. I've always loved to read too, but since I went back to college to get my engineering degree 10 years ago all that forced reading made me kind of loath it. I still like to read stuff that catches my interest, but sometimes it's really hard to focus. Work has only made it worse. I have to read rule books all the time and Orders and other publications that we put out. It's really boring stuff written mostly by lawyers and it makes me hate reading sometimes. At least I feel like I need a break.

For me it was a paperback book I got in elementary school at a book fair or something called Runaway Robot. I think it was written in the '60s. That was the first thing I ever read that just sucked me in and caused me to really experience what was written on the pages. My wife found that book for me and bought it after I told her about it. Sweet thing to do I thought, though I'll never read that book again.

Good morning y'all. I woke up from a repeating dream Indisnt understand this morning with a thought. I think we can all agree and basically understand that that there is a lot of data and information whether it be sensory or not, that we are processing and collecting that we aren't aware of.

What if dreams are a way of parsing or presenting this irreconcilable information to ourselves? I don't just mean our subconscious talking to our conscious, but the brain itself trying to make sense of stuff it doesn't know how to process. Presenting that information in metaphor or analogy.

Wow, I never considered the actual meaning of the phrase "make sense". I always assumed it meant make "rational" but it seems more likely it means to turn information into something that our senses can use.

a reply to: sputniksteve

I would very mucH like to know Gary Rowe's opinion on ufos?
Come on, I don't think he wood mind. ask him about the MIBs he encountered, when they were trying to take the metal off him, from that (crash).
i am only so curious because the 21o9 groupe seemed almost impressed of him didnt they?

a reply to: LukasWainman

I'm not in a position to speculate what he thinks, neither would I even consider breaking his confidents if I was in a position. He has been a UFOLOGISTS since the 70's at least by his own account so we can all assume he has an interest at least.

I am not at all familiar with a crash he was involved in, metal, or an encounter with MIBs, sorry Lukas.

I am not entirely sure they were impressed, but they certainly did show interest and seem to depend on him to some degree from what we gather from the book. I do have much further insight but I am not at liberty. I take pretty serious the agreement Inhave made with the people I discuss things with in private, if for no other reason than to continue to learn more from them.

There are days when my desire to know the answers to all of these questions is overwhelming. Today is one of those days.

a reply to: sputniksteve

Hey Steve, been meaning to get back here to discuss. I am just not going to be able to get through that book. I give up. I've moved on to another one that holds more interest for me. For me, that book is fiction. If you or anyone else finds meaning in it then I am happy for you but I just can't get past the hangups I already talked about.

What I really want is to read is The Vertical Plane but I guess that'll never happen. If I could just find an e-copy somewhere I'd like to discuss that with you - although I guess you've moved past that one now haven't you? I don't know, I just have my own ideas about these kinds of things that I'd like to be able to contemplate side by side with his story and kind of mentally compare notes with it.

Hope you have a great day!

a reply to: wtbengineer

Who knows man, I wouldn't ever say never though. I haven't moved past it necessarily, I just don't believe I can gain anything from it at this very moment. It seems much of it is metaphor as far as the knowledge to be gained. Beyond that I don't believe there is any certain key waiting to be unlocked or found from its text, but I could certainly be wrong.

I loaned my copy to a family member but once it is returned to me I would be willing to send it to you if you would assure me of its return. We can talk privately about it once I get it back in my possession. I'm not sure it will be as satisfying as you suspect though, but I totally get your desire to read it anyway.

I have been fascinated with Cortez and Montezuma for a couple years now. I haven't ever really looked too deeply into what Montezuma was doing in Mexico until very recently, but the discovery that he was supposedly communicating with a demonic humming bird while using copious amounts of psychedelic mushrooms originally really piqued my interest in the topic. The human sacrifice on an industrial scale was disturbing but fascinating to me when taken into account of a psychedelic trip. I will spare you all the boring and unnecessary details of some of my own experiences with substances and why I gave it any thought at all, but something had been nagging me that what Montezuma was doing had a more profound effect than just getting high and killing people.

Even if we ignore the psychedelic aspect of the human sacrifice, it's mind boggling to imagine the raw psychic and emotional torment and torture that individuals were put under during these blood lettings. I have read descriptions of sacrificial temples with lines of people in all 4 directions extending for miles, all in a procession to have a priest cut their heart out while alive. I don't know if those types of events can happen in a vacuum or not, but my guess is NO.

I don't bring any of this up in order to depress anyone or try and connect it to TVP or the events that have proceeded but I find it very interesting that Cortez went to war with Montezuma in Thomas's lifetime, 1519. I personally have a hard time picturing Thomas's world, but this helps me put it in perspective a little bit.

Hope everyone had a good weekend, and has a better upcoming week. If you are looking for something new to listen to, Graham Hankocks appearances on Joe Rogan Experience podcast are pretty fun to listen to, his earliest ones especially. Even if you aren't into alternative history or psychedelic drugs at all the conversations are really entertaining and can be quite enlightening.

For the record I haven't used any psychedelic drugs in quite a long time, and don't suggest that anyone does irresponsibly. I don't want anyone (lets be real no one is really reading anymore) to think I am being coy and suggesting they do.

a reply to: sputniksteve

I guess I would expect the reading of The Vertical Plane to be somewhat of a letdown for me if it were to actually happen. At any rate I don't want you to lend it to me, I will wait and see if it becomes available again. The post you made below the one I am replying to right now has really piqued my interest, especially the part about psychedelic mushrooms and Montezuma. I never really delved into that history enough to know about that connection but I might have to now.

I'm still reading anything and everything that's posted in this thread, you can count on that. Sorry I haven't posted much myself, I've been soaking it all in and letting it ferment. I'm going to send you a PM though, some things I'd like to discuss with you in private.

I like Joe Rogan, thanks for the suggestion about the Graham Hancock interviews I'll have to go back and listen to some of them.

If we know that time exists like a Vertical Plane, or rather all moments stacked on top of each other; might they still be differentiated by a "then, now, and when"?

Obviously this is true for consciousness because that is precisely how we view time. Is it possible this happens on a more fundamental and objective level as well?

I don't know precisely what I am trying to say or suggest, I feel like it's on the tip of my tongue.

Part way through reading this thread, so don't know if anyone before has suggested this.

It sounds like someone from somewhere stumbled upon a machine that can communicate between worlds. They may not be knowledgeable on how the machine works. For instance 2109 might be a dial setting.

There was work done in England in the 1950's on a camera that could photograph some wierd things.

Ruth Drown and George Delaware are two names that explored this.

Here is a starter link:. Radionics

I used to own Delaware originals, and build some of these "black boxes" for myself. They are tricky to use yet easy to build.

Radionics is probably still being researched and used in private engineering hands. It's that sorta thing.

a reply to: sputniksteve

Steve! How have you not put the puzzle pieces together yet?! it's staring you right in the face!

Silent World=Very Very high on the electromagnetic spectrum (above gamma rays) there are life forms and entire worlds of pure energy, this is their world.

We feed off a NEET energy you have not heard of Why did Montezuma sacrifice so many people? There's an energy our scientists haven't discovered in our blood, these electromagnetic creatures feed off it, as well as waves from our minds. Remember they had more power when Debbie was around? You gotta understand, it wasn't just the Aztecs who sacrificed, it was every single religion on earth, from the Celts, Vikings, Berbers, Sumerians, Hurrians, Phoenicians you name it. Salvador Freixedo does a good job explaing why the Aztecs sacrificed so much to Huitzilopochtli. (Huitzilipochtli was described as a sun, a bright light in the sky. UFO comes to mind here.)

They exist OUTSIDE of our time, all our time has already happened from where they are standing. They can see all the possibilities, change things and do what they like, we are limited by our senses.

Do you really think it's just a metaphor?
So many people can't see this as a possibility, and dismiss it like an out there theory and don't take time to study every religion and paranormal event with this explanation in mind. Even our own evolution, where's the missing link? It's these creatures from the silent world! They genetically engineered us, they are the fallen angels, the shapeshifing gods-Zeus, Odhin and Indra.
i'm starting to think humans were designed that way-maybe the experiments were designed to have little understanding of the real world around them. How convenient.

a reply to: sputniksteve

i dont know why people still call it poltergeist activity, surely we should be calling it something cooler like, "there's a glitch in the matrix" or something, anyway here is another good source explaining the story www.unexplained-mysteries.com... ... also for me if there wasn't a living CNS on this planet there would be NO poltergeist activity NADA. everything can be explained by the collective unconscious and the CNS...IMO

originally posted by: CromCruachh
a reply to: sputniksteve

Steve! How have you not put the puzzle pieces together yet?! it's staring you right in the face!

Silent World=Very Very high on the electromagnetic spectrum (above gamma rays) there are life forms and entire worlds of pure energy, this is their world.

We feed off a NEET energy you have not heard of Why did Montezuma sacrifice so many people? There's an energy our scientists haven't discovered in our blood, these electromagnetic creatures feed off it, as well as waves from our minds. Remember they had more power when Debbie was around? You gotta understand, it wasn't just the Aztecs who sacrificed, it was every single religion on earth, from the Celts, Vikings, Berbers, Sumerians, Hurrians, Phoenicians you name it. Salvador Freixedo does a good job explaing why the Aztecs sacrificed so much to Huitzilopochtli. (Huitzilipochtli was described as a sun, a bright light in the sky. UFO comes to mind here.)

They exist OUTSIDE of our time, all our time has already happened from where they are standing. They can see all the possibilities, change things and do what they like, we are limited by our senses.

Do you really think it's just a metaphor?
So many people can't see this as a possibility, and dismiss it like an out there theory and don't take time to study every religion and paranormal event with this explanation in mind. Even our own evolution, where's the missing link? It's these creatures from the silent world! They genetically engineered us, they are the fallen angels, the shapeshifing gods-Zeus, Odhin and Indra.
i'm starting to think humans were designed that way-maybe the experiments were designed to have little understanding of the real world around them. How convenient.

Don't think it hasn't crossed my mind. It seems to validate some of what I experienced in denver but I was lead to believe that isnt correct, or rather never told I was right at least.

I consider it possibly, but it doesn't jive with everything else completely. Some of that is public knowledge and much is not. At any rate I can't imagine why they chose the who and when that they did in order to try and inform humanity as a whole.

One thing I have realized for absolute certain, is that this entire experience was about and for Gary Rowe. All the things that seemed to be unrelated, were actually quite related. The way it was written was clever to hide that fact, but make no mistake.

The thing that doesn't make sense, is that the things that make him quite unique, don't mean that he is one of a kind. That isn't to say there are millions of folks like him walking the earth, but there have been plenty before him. Maybe I am just dismissing all the evidence that came before TVP I don't know.

Either way it's nice to hear from you and have you share a similar opinion. I don't think it's nearly cut and dry done but I think it is the right track at least. Actually the more I type and think on it, the more I can make it make everything make sense.

a reply to: sputniksteve

Thanks, good to see the thread still going
I don't really know anything about Gary Rowe, there isn't exactly much on the internet. What makes him unique? (I don't mean to be nosey, i'm just interested since he's a part of TVP that's all.)

I'm convinced in the ultra terrestrial explanation for TVP, since it seems to fit perfectly and it matches with my own experiences.
I didn't think it was them wanting to inform humanity as a whole, just that they had their own reasons for manipulating certain events and people, of which we probably can't comprehend.

Do you have any knowledge you could share which suggests another theory?
Remember that floating star thing we were talkin about before, have you had any other experiences like that? I don't expect you to answer, i'm asking because i've had a few more experiences like that and wanted to see if you had too. And i'm not nuts btw, I normally wouldn't tell my paranormal experiences to anyone but since im anonymous on here the possible ridicule doesn't matter!

a reply to: CromCruachh

There is nothing about him online, which is by design. I know many things, but am not at liberty to discuss them unfortunately. Believe me when I say there is nothing I would rather do though. I'm somewhat confident that at some point I be able to discuss these things but that is just based on my intuition. I don't see it as being mosey at all, and I hope you don't think this is me trying to gate keep or something. I have been asked specifically to remain quite.

I agree 100% on the "Ultra terrestrial" hypothesis though, that's a VERY apt term to use. I do take it for granted that they meant for all of humanity to be clued in though, I take 2109 at their word on that at least. As I thought about my last post, the things shared in TVP aren't unique to that book, just maybe a different format than before. That doesn't mean it is just for "our" benefit though, it seems to be just as much for theirs if you are right on the "neet" energy.

My life has continued to get more and more different. Exponentially. I have been pointed in a bit of a new direction for the time being, as there are many things I need to learn before a clear picture can be painted. It's quite frustrating sometimes honestly. Unfortunately that all falls under the NDA aspect of my discussions. I wish it didn't, but at the same time the things I have tried to share have been ignored or disbelieved so I have come to the point that I understand it is best for myself to remain quite. That part is hard for me, as I looooove to talk! I don't mean to say people online or on ATS don't believe me, but rather the people in my life. The things I have discussed online though are always honest and earnest. I may not always be right about why or how something happens, but I am always telling the truth from my perspective.

I have seen things be a certain way, and then be completely different, and it seems few notice or believe me.