The NBA is full of stubborn idiots..

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

discovermagazine.com...


Discover magazine also did an article explaining the physics of it all and how it is testablly better.

a reply to: JoshuaCox

That doesn't mean squat. You really don't understand do you? Basketball is more than a freethrow shot. People are not going to sacrifice their muslce memory or consistency with their form for few % when they are all already pretty consistent with their %. You could make the argument for Shaq and Wilt, and that's about it.

Doesn't change the fact that your title is dumb and your OP is filled with ignorance.

Always thought Rick Barry was cool even with the underhanded free throw, cant remember if any of his sons that played college and NBA did that as well. I don't think they did.

Only way for it to have a considerable impact would be for a coach to make the players shooting 70% or under switch. You need your whole team shooting them under handed or at least the ones with poor percentages.

a reply to: putnam6

One is in college now using it.

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

Except math and science says it is a more efficient shot with a higher success rate...

a reply to: JoshuaCox

Then maybe atheletes should be mathematicians, and mathematicians should be atheletes?

Seriously Joshua just stop lol.

I only took offense because I'm a huge sports fan and clearly you are not. I have no problem with you presenting facts and in factual manner without your own ignorant projections.

Basketball is a lot more than some percentages at the freethrow line.

originally posted by: HawkeyeNation
Shaq's legacy is great but it would be even greater had he been able to make FT's. The traditional over hand shot for him did not work well because I believe he was never trained to shoot anywhere outside of 7 feet. He was always bigger and stronger so he just overpowered everyone. Also shooting a basketball is probably like me shooting with a softball. Very awkward.

In clutch free throw situation, Shaq would not have been in any position to get the ball anyhow, even in college.

Clutch situation see the ball going to guards or power forwards who are expected to have good outside the paint shots which is where your free throw is. They're the ones who will have the high free throw percentages.

originally posted by: Mikehawk
a reply to: JoshuaCox

Nothing beats proper footing, perfect form and over hand follow through with one hand.

LOL maybe Shaq should have tried underhand though, he tried everything else!

Wave bye to the ball...

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

Are you done with being an aggressive dunce? Or are all sports fans just like you.

He brought up a valid point.

Sorry is the nba rounders or netball?

a reply to: TheLotLizard

No I'm not done, so go back and read his title, then read his OP, realize it's filled with ignorance, and then have yourself a good day.

a reply to: TheLotLizard

Par for the course.. just ignore him if he isn't actually adding any counterpoints..

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

"Everyone is wrong but me..always!"

""Rick Barry is wrong, wilt chamberlain is wrong, discover magazine is wrong! Only I am ever right!!"


"I know all those fancy smansy math guys can actually prove it, but me knowledgehunter knows better!!"


Lol...just lol..

a reply to: JoshuaCox

Where did I say you're wrong? I said your title is dumb and your OP is filled with ignorant projections.

Which is absolutely true. Sorry Joshua, but between you and me, our relationship is no secret so I will continue to hold you accountable when necessary, and I expect the same from you. No hard feelings.

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

So I'm right about the underhand shot being far more efficient..

And I'm wrong about a couple of the "meaningless " other stats I threw out..

But the fact that 99% of the NBA is literally doing it wrong and knows they are wrong .. doesn't make them stubborn idiots?!?!

Isn't intentionally doing things the less efficient way, when you know better, literally the definition of being a stubborn idiot???

a reply to: JoshuaCox

Technically the best way to run is barefeet, how come Olympic athletes don't run barefoot?

I told you so many times, basketball is much more than a freethrow shot.

Muscle memory, repetition, consistency.

These players literally take over 10000 freethrow shots in their lives, and over 10000 regulars shots. And they are doing just fine. There is no freethrow problem in the NBA.

So no they are not stubborn idiots.

Joshua, stop.

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

I'm guessing that there is a reason none run bare foot.. foot protection.. will the olympics let you run bare foot??


Your acting like I EVER said that free throws were all of basket ball... like some one great at free throws but bad at the rest of basketball could still make the team..

Which I never said..


What I specifically said was the guys who's main negative is free throws, and all the guys who are just about good enough to play in the NBA (aka those on the bubble) , what the hell are they thinking...


If Shaq isn't a hall of famer, would an 80%+ free throw percent have put him over the edge.. for example..

Or what about whatever random AAA college center who is ALMOST good enough , but can't throw a free throw..

That has to effect 1000's of people who have played ball..

If literally all the math and data say that is ABSOLUTELY the more efficient shot in that situation.. then people who truly care about their craft and pocketbook should be doing it that way..

Obviously..

a reply to: JoshuaCox

Incorrect again.

Take the best 100 players of all time, none shoot underhand.

Here's another stat for you. The greatest shooters of all time shoot 50/40/90% -fieldgoal/3pt/freethrow.

There is something called a "stroke" which is the final motion of your shooting form right before you release the ball. The best shooters in history have the best and most CONSISTENT stroke, (which comes from muscle memory, which comes from repetition, which came from their 20000 shots in the gym when nobody was watching). This stroke translates all over the court, not just the freethrow line. Hence the 50/40/90. I'm not sure how much more I can empathize the importance of muscle memory in basketball, and all sports for that matter. Again, the greatest SHOOTERS in history, all better than Rick Barry at basketball - which is more important than being just a good freethrow shooter - all shoot regular form.

And like I said, you could make the argument for Shaq and Wilt - the 2 worst freethrow shooters of all time - and that's about it. Everyone else shoots between 80-90 percent. Why would they need to sacrifice everything else for potentially a few more percentages?

Shaq made the hall of fame because he was the most dominant force in the NBA, maybe ever. Not because of his free throws, if he was on the bubble and his hall of fame was questionable, his freethrow would NOT take him over the bump. Same goes for Wilt.

And I can guarantee you no "AAA" (btw not even a real league, that's hockey and baseball) player would've made it over the hump if they decided to shoot underhand.

And to your final point, it is ABSOLUTEY NOT more efficient for everyone. There is something called comfort. If you took the best shooters right now, and made them shoot underhand, they would completely suck at it, on top of ruining their regular shot, so why would they? You basically have no knowledge of the sport, read some articles and rushed to make a thread so you could espouse your hate for the NBA. I get it, but your OP and title fails in more places than one.

What if I called you a racist? I wouldn't be too far off with my assertion compared to yours.





ETA: and let me just clarify my issue, I have no problem with you sharing your article and speaking on freethrows, but you went so far as to say everyone in the NBA is stubborn (no they aren't), everyone is an idiot (no they aren't), everyone is doing it wrong (no they aren't) and so on. You added a bunch of other nonsense on top of that too. I could've atleast respected your opinion if you had some knowledge of the game past the article you read, which you clearly don't..

a reply to: JoshuaCox

Another point I want to add to give you some perspective.

The average freethrow attempts in the league per player, if you take away the top 10, are like ONE per game. Maybe less, if you want to google it you can, but ONE a game .. I repeat, ONE..

From the 1st IIRC (about 9-10 attempts a game) to the 10th (about 5 attempts).

The rest of the league average is about ONE.

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

That's the point...

Even though every inch of math and science says shooting free throws underhanded has a far better success rate.. people still do it the less efficient (aka wrong ) way..

Also know as stubborn idiot like...


Even the guys with a 90% rate, you have to assume could get that up to 95% if they were shooting in a more efficient manner.


It is the same as someone who insists on holding their gun sideways like a Hollywood gangsta..

Sure they might can train themselves to be very accurate sideways shooting, but they will never be as good as they could be if they used the correct form.

The Shaq thing was an example..

About your stoke comment..

Wilt chaimberlin went from a 49% rate (overhanded) to an 80% rate underhanded, and had arguably the greatest game in history.. then swapped back because he felt like a sissy and dropped right back dien to 40%..and he would happily admit he was wrong for it.

So..

A) they should have been building the muscle memory for the correct way to shoot a free throw..

B) depending on their age , would still be able to retrain their muscles to do it the right way..


When approaching the rim from an overhand free throw shot.. you are coming straight at the rim.. you only have about an inch circumference around the ball as your margins of error..

When doing the same underhanded, you are approaching the rim from the top.. meaning you more than double the margins for error..

That's math.. ain't no beating math lol..

I have very little knowledge of the sport, well as much as any average American layperson. I am taking the word of wilt chamberlain, rick Barry and discover magazine.. because they use math to prove it..

Where the hell you got racist from I have no idea.. none of the present whit players do it either right??

So that is a stretch....or I guess you purposely trying to weave that in...

And yes I sti would refer to anyone doing something with the stakes that high a stubborn idiot for not being as efficient as humanly possible.. including myself.. because no one is above being a stubborn idiot about something.