A Terrifyingly Unchecked 7 Minute Launch Window.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: watchitburn

There are inherent risks, that is true. You can mitigate them by having no one in sole command of anything, and everything done by the peoples will, or not at all. That would be much better, especially where something like this is concerned.

But if it was up to "the people's will" I think there's a good chance that Afghanistan would have been glowing in the dark by Sept 13th 2001.

Additionally, it is the people's will that decides who has this responsibility.

So again, I think it comes down to accepting the inherent risk of having a human in charge.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus
The President needs the Secretary of Defense's concurrence to launch.

There's that ... and also no 'Staff Sergeant' types involved in the launch process.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

In the radio lad episode it was a former secretary of defense saying he wasn't involved specifically for the purpose of the moral quandary that comes with ending the species.

They didn't want anyone who could say no..

originally posted by: JoshuaCox
In radio lad episode it was a former secretary of defense saying he wasn't involved specifically for the purpose of the moral quandary that comes with ending the species.

They didn't want anyone who could say no..

But there are people who can say no. The Vice President, among others, can find him unfit and have him removed.

a reply to: Snarl

No he doesn't..

They were interviewing a former secretary of defense.

With a 7 min launch window there is no time. It had to be streamlined more than that.

a reply to: watchitburn

Yes, but why one person?

Also, if the people were in charge, they never would have believed that Afghanistan was a genuine threat or a genuine target, because they would have been in control over whether or not they were propagandised at to that effect. Most people, even really thick people, will not ask to be BS'd like that.

a reply to: JoshuaCox

except at least in ACC I was taught from the word go to ignore unlawful orders, if we are not on a wartime footing (see Def Con stages) an order to launch would be unlawful.

we are currently at Def Con level 5, there are software packages that would have to be loaded (depending on who the target is), because no matter what some may think we just dont launch them and let them fall willy nilly.

If this was still the cold war, the wall was still up.. yea 7 mins order to launch easy... now we are fighting multiple groups from around the globe... we do not just have the evil empire to launch on.

originally posted by: Irishhaf
There are safe guards..

Subs... you think sub captains are not tuned in to whats going on in the world, they get an order to launch and we were not on a wartime footing I bet they say no.

Bombers, takes days of preparation to get nukes ready, uploaded and launched. (I know this for a fact from my military time)

Silo's (this I admit to having the least amount of knowledge on) but based off what I know in the Navy, and USAF, I am going to wager you need to have a software package uploaded before the missiles can be launched.

I feel pretty safe in saying that unless we are already on a wartime footing (see Def Con 1 for example) there will be no launch in 7 minutes.

With a WAG, that is part of the reason for the Def Con system 3 you set up to get nuke ready, 2 nukes are uploaded and ready to go, 1 time to end the world.

Except for the very first statement , every single line of this is wrong...
Yes , there are safeguards
I would edit out the entire post other than that line,.
Peace

a reply to: Gothmog

Really... Ill play.. explain how the part on Bombers is wrong?

I ask because the majority of the last 20 years of my adult life has been spent in ACC, on heavies.

eta:I will freely admit to speculation on the Silos, and the subs... based partly off conversations at the VFW, and some reading of declassified documents.

originally posted by: JoshuaCox
They were interviewing a former secretary of defense.

Alright. Which one?

With a 7 min launch window

It actually requires much less time than that ... and I mean a Lot less. But, your strike package suffers, the odds of success are radically diminished, and the chance for MAD goes to about a hundred.

Did the old SecDef allude to that as well?

And to put your mind at ease, SecDef Mattis is behaving like a good old Soldier because Trump hasn't tried to shove him around. He ain't approving any errant launch orders ... and Pence is dying to be the POTUS.

a reply to: TrueBrit

If that is true then it's only because Hillary lost. The lady literally had persecutory paranoid delusions. She literally thought she had been attacked by snipers. Who knows what someone like that would do if they thought there were assassins out to get her again.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

With the greatest possible respect, she was, and remains utterly irrelevant.

The point is that nuclear weapons being launched on the say so of one person, or a non representative minority of persons (i.e. a government) is a crappy way to decide whether or not to launch.

a reply to: Snarl

Here is the episode

www.radiolab.org...

a reply to: TrueBrit

I agree, but when you disparage someone when it has no bearing on the OP expect to be challenged.

Now imagine there is an actual crisis and the chain of command is broken and they wont launch when the President says so because they need to confirm with a bunch of other people first and the US is gone soon after.

The weapons don't matter if the system to deliver them doesn't work.

a reply to: JoshuaCox

Do people think Trump would have to call missile silos one by one?

Who do you think would be called to launch say 12 missiles? Some low level officer in a metal box? OR a high level officer/s in command of several launch options who can coordinate an attack?

There is no red button.

originally posted by: tadaman
There is no red button.

The Football is a very real device.

And ... I'll just stop right there. :-)

a reply to: JoshuaCox

Considering the many nut cases and egomaniacs that have ruled over nuclear capable nations I can only believe a higher power has prevented them launching. When a leader becomes ill or senile I can imagine them (someone like Trump) thinking I can change the who world before I go! Take out NK and I will be remembered forever! It has not happened just as the sun and the asteroids have not taken us yet...when it is time.

See it all as a big diversion, the real reason why nuclear weapons would be launched is when the operatives or whoever makes the final call has absolutely no options left. In fact, it might be there's some place in the world where a group of people live almost completely cutoff from the outside world who might last like decades in case of occupation. When they decide the American Spirit is gone and the dream has ended they might launch. All the public knows is what is known about it like movies and a lot of hogwash.

a reply to: JoshuaCox

Hysterical much?

There is a tendency on the part of a lot of people to assume that poor and low-ranking people are stupid and senseless simply because of their position in the hierarchy.

The folks on the button are investigated and vetted.

The real problem with "The Button" is the antiquated software running the system and the aging missiles at the sharp end of it.

Well, except for one thing...

Armageddon is bad for business as a general rule. Last time I checked anyway. War, not so much, but Armageddon, definitely...and that is exactly what would happen.