Loud Bangs heard in Manchester UK

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: UKTruth

because being compassionate is a sign of weakness to your enemies ,

well that just goes to show the mentality of our species
when being compassionate is a weakness

and being evil and creating terror and causing death is a strength

It baffles me that you would be pointing the finger at the British govt after a radical islamic terrorist blows up kids.
There is no excuse at all, no matter the history of conflict and oppression throughout our history, for what happened last night.
Your solution of saying sorry and giving our enemies gifts in the hope they might stop killing us is tragic.

Link to English translation of ISIS claim here

Twitter

originally posted by: Koka
Unsure as to whether anyone has mentioned this in the last 48 pages, but apparently there were terrorist drills taking place in the Arndale Centre last week. Using actors, 21 packages were left in various areas of the shopping centre. None of the staff were made aware that it was a drill, and they were questioned/debriefed after the event. This was a large scale drill with nothing reported in the MSM.
?

another coincidence.

originally posted by: Whereismypassword

originally posted by: SprocketUK
a reply to: paraphi

how long did it take to grt rid of Abu Hamza?
Too bloody long.

people like that need a swift trial followed by execution and, all those who supported and sheltered them need to be taken out of our society.

keep killing the hate preachers and demolishing the mosques they preach at and we will be in a much better place.

not pc, not remotely protecting free speech, but we are in a war and the enemy needs shutting up.

Bad idea on demolishing the mosques I'm pretty certain our security services have their men in place to gather information that has prevented many attacks we have never heard about

The way we currently deal with this, yes, you are right.

I am proposing a change in tack though.
A war of extermination. We kind of already are really, if you think of it, because these filth wont ever stop until the whole world is the "right kind" of Muslim.

Its about time we started rounding up those who really wish us harm and sending them off to meet their maker.

The sooner we rid the world of this enemy, the sooner we can get down to rolling back the police state with all the cameras, ID cards and other restrictions on individual freedom that are a direct result of stuff like this.

a reply to: auroraaus

Ok...

There is a difference between something being home made, and something being home made to a common or garden, internet researched recipe.

A person who has access to the correct chemical compounds or the knowledge of how to make SEVERAL different explosive compounds, taught to them in person by an experienced technician, is a very different beast than someone who merely looked up some data on the net, and cobbled together a barely passable explosive.

The explosive devices they create will be different too. An experienced maker can create very neat packages of explosives, which perform extremely effectively in their application, repeatably. A relative moron with a cookbook and access to the chemicals necessary, could create a massive blast, or a bomb that will not detonate, with very little clue as to which it is going to be, until they attempt detonation.

a reply to: sapien82

Who needs to travel in time, how about our governments just say , right we are not going to interfere anymore and we aren't selling weapons anymore ....

I think everyone recognises that 'our' policies in the Middle East have contributed to the complete screw up the whole region seems to be.
But none of that would have been possible without existing tribal and religious differences that go back literally over a thousand years ago.

and we apologise for all the # we have done to your country and your people
and hope that you can forgive our actions against you

Not in my frigging name!
I've done absolutely nothing to them, and I'd have a guess that neither did any of those children who were inexcusably murdered last night.
I sure as hell won't beg 'forgiveness' to those subhuman scumbags.

we apologise and help with aid
and thats it

Like #e we do!
Don't you DARE to assume to apologise in my name!!

that is a small start towards healing what we have done , sorry what we have allowed our governments to do in our name

I am in no way a supporter of our current government, our electoral and political systems or the vast majority of career orientated amoral politicians that infest our political world at present or the morally corrupt system they prop up and support.
But, and this is a massive BUT - at the core of all of the ME's problems and its exportation of terrorism is Islam and disputes between its various schisms and it's interaction with 'non-believers' who they view as inferior and are duty bound to either convert or eliminate.

There is a diametric difference between the concept of freedom of choice and belief and that of the all encompassing, intolerant dictates of radical Islam.
By their very natures it is impossible for the two viewpoints to co-exist for any substantial length of time.

I'm sorry but your moral indignation and self-hatred would be better served if it was directed towards the perpetrators of this horrific act and if you showed just a little bit of compassion towards the victims and their families.

originally posted by: Koka
Unsure as to whether anyone has mentioned this in the last 48 pages, but apparently there were terrorist drills taking place in the Arndale Centre last week. Using actors, 21 packages were left in various areas of the shopping centre. None of the staff were made aware that it was a drill, and they were questioned/debriefed after the event. This was a large scale drill with nothing reported in the MSM.

I have also been made aware, as of today, that staff members from the Arndale are being questioned further about the drill.

Why would they need to question people further about a staged event/drill that used actors?

Common sense would tell you they wanted feedback, results, information from the people that didn't know that drill was happening.

The whole purpose for drilling or practice in anything is to get as much information as possible so when a real scenario happens muscle memory kicks in and decisions can be made quickly.

originally posted by: SprocketUK

originally posted by: Whereismypassword

originally posted by: SprocketUK
a reply to: paraphi

how long did it take to grt rid of Abu Hamza?
Too bloody long.

people like that need a swift trial followed by execution and, all those who supported and sheltered them need to be taken out of our society.

keep killing the hate preachers and demolishing the mosques they preach at and we will be in a much better place.

not pc, not remotely protecting free speech, but we are in a war and the enemy needs shutting up.

Bad idea on demolishing the mosques I'm pretty certain our security services have their men in place to gather information that has prevented many attacks we have never heard about

The sooner we rid the world of this enemy, the sooner we can get down to rolling back the police state with all the cameras, ID cards and other restrictions on individual freedom that are a direct result of stuff like this.

Very good point. The defeat of radical islamic terrorism will remove the excuses that govt's have for the kind of surveillance we already have in place.

a reply to: UKTruth

Ok so we shouldnt blame our own government who are implicit in the whole debacle
they created this environment for us.

and for those who financed this operation, created the bombs and planted them are all guilty and deserve to be imprisoned for life
no parole.
Death is too good for these scum, no matter what terror group they belong to

but to say that we cant point the finger at a government we are supposed to trust and look to for protection
as they do nothing but convince that we should rely on them every day and in every way.

So why not point the finger at them , after all they dragged us into this quagmire


I think that you have misunderstood the direction of my apologies , I said we should apologise to any country we have been and destroyed in the middle east etc and apologise to their people.

I didnt say apologise to the terror groups , why would we apologise to them , they kill people and dont deserve to be a part of humanity.

and for the record our government are pretty good at giving our "enemies" gifts
in the form of military hardware

a reply to: opethPA

Common sense would be to do get feedback after the drill, which actually occurred.

What I am asking is why they would deem it important to question people about a drill, from a week ago, the day after an actual event takes place?

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: auroraaus

Ok...

There is a difference between something being home made, and something being home made to a common or garden, internet researched recipe.

A person who has access to the correct chemical compounds or the knowledge of how to make SEVERAL different explosive compounds, taught to them in person by an experienced technician, is a very different beast than someone who merely looked up some data on the net, and cobbled together a barely passable explosive.

The explosive devices they create will be different too. An experienced maker can create very neat packages of explosives, which perform extremely effectively in their application, repeatably. A relative moron with a cookbook and access to the chemicals necessary, could create a massive blast, or a bomb that will not detonate, with very little clue as to which it is going to be, until they attempt detonation.

Hello Mr True Brit

It's heading towards silly o'clock for me!

I took it to mean either an individual who had the device made from someone else or an individual who made it themselves from manuals/internets.

But fair point for home made as in made at home from teaching/experience from some other person previously.

Also Hi

So we saw a video of a FULLY masked man, pronouncing Allah Akbar wrong, (at least for my ears) holding up a hand written piece of paper with Manchester and the date on it and Bang! Proof it was ISIS.

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: UKTruth

Ok so we shouldnt blame our own government who are implicit in the whole debacle
they created this environment for us.

and for those who financed this operation, created the bombs and planted them are all guilty and deserve to be imprisoned for life
no parole.
Death is too good for these scum, no matter what terror group they belong to

but to say that we cant point the finger at a government we are supposed to trust and look to for protection
as they do nothing but convince that we should rely on them every day and in every way.

So why not point the finger at them , after all they dragged us into this quagmire


I think that you have misunderstood the direction of my apologies , I said we should apologise to any country we have been and destroyed in the middle east etc and apologise to their people.

I didnt say apologise to the terror groups , why would we apologise to them , they kill people and dont deserve to be a part of humanity.

and for the record our government are pretty good at giving our "enemies" gifts
in the form of military hardware

Look, there is a 'deeper' and far more complicated issue at play. I agree with you on that.
But right now, it frankly pisses me off that we keep appeasing and excusing such atrocities by finding historical reasons to justify why some dickhead islamic extremist blows up kids.

a reply to: Freeborn

I think you have also misunderstood the direction of any apology , I never said apologies to the terror groups
they wont listen , but to the nations we have wronged.

Iraq, Syria, Afghanistan , and so on

and why wouldnt you be a part of it , were you not voting in the UK during the iraq war , were you not a part of this society that allowed our invasion to happen ?
just because you dont support our current government or those before doesnt mean you cant be held responsible you just like me and everyone else has allowed it to happen , we stood idly by and watched as we invaded iraq and afghanistan etc

who has self hatred ? because I want to chastise my government for committing crimes in my name as I done nothing to prevent them taking over , apart from voting and marching but what does that really achieve ?

Why do you assume I havent shown compassion towards the victims families ?
just because I havent said as much in this thread , I am devoid of compassion because I complain about our government policy and how it has affect in this situation , I am without compassion and you talk to me about assumption

Sorry I didnt know I was apologising in your name when I was speaking hypothetically about our government making public apologies to their governments to try and make some start in fixing all of this , have we apologised yet (probably not because we think we are always right)
dont DARE assume I was hahaha

originally posted by: Koka
a reply to: opethPA

Common sense would be to do get feedback after the drill, which actually occurred.

What I am asking is why they would deem it important to question people about a drill, from a week ago, the day after an actual event takes place?

Good investigative work.

Did you notice anyone out of place , did anyone say anything unexpected during the drill?

What source did you read they are being questioned about the drill now?

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: Freeborn

...

and why wouldnt you be a part of it , were you not voting in the UK during the iraq war , were you not a part of this society that allowed our invasion to happen ?
just because you dont support our current government or those before doesnt mean you cant be held responsible you just like me and everyone else has allowed it to happen , we stood idly by and watched as we invaded iraq and afghanistan etc

...

Sorry but with that logic we could also paint all Muslims (not actively fighting against ISIS) in Afghanistan etc as terrorists and inhuman scum. And I'm sure we can both agree that's complete and utter nonsense. You say that marching and protesting isn't enough, so does that mean you are suggesting unless someone violently opposed those invasions they are partly to blame?

Because we have to apply that logic to both sides if that is the case.


And aside from that issue...disgusting as the death of any child is. There's a difference between a child hit in the crossfire of battle and a child specifically targeted to have maximum effect. The former NEVER provides even the smallest amount of excuse for the latter.

a reply to: sapien82

Unfortunately that is very real,there has always been people,and will always be,who see compassion and kindness as weakness,even idiocy.Looks to me like Europe has been more than compassionate.And now they are getting their rewards from the diabolical psycho's who hid among the millions of ME refugees.I am so sick at heart about what happened in Manchester,so bitterly sad..i honestly don't think there is even a solution to this horrible mess.People in Europe are in for a hard few years i think.

But i cannot leave unsaid..i don't even want to imagine how many ME kids have been killed and maimed by Western interference and attacks.Always the young and innocent have to lose their lives or have their lives ruined,because of the effed-upness of adults who should know better.Who should Never make a decision that will cause the slaughter of the young and innocent.Whose priority should be to shelter and safeguard their most precious asset,their young,their offspring.Jesus ANIMALS are so much better at this even,than the human race

a reply to: sapien82

That's all well and good....but other than 'voting and marching' practically what could any of us have done?

Take some sort of direct action?

Exactly WHAT are you advocating here?

I don't want ANYONE, be it government or an individual, to apologise for me.
If I did something then I did it, I take responsibility for it and I'll #ing apologise - I neither need nor want anyone else to assume to do so.

As for your apparent lack of compassion for the victims; what do you expect?
You are so frigging quick to offer up apologies for 'OUR' actions yet display a complete lack of compassion or empathy for the victims and their families.
Where's the condemnation of the piece of crap who did this?


Self-hatred.
I used that phrase on purpose - you appear to be so quick to criticise anything British yet reluctant to show the same level of indignation to those who choose to attack or criticise anything British - don't you think its reasonable that people would assume there is at least a little measure of self-hatred, considering you are British, in your postings.

a reply to: umbr360

well arent all muslims complicit in the acts of terror carried out in the name of their religion if they stand idly by and watch as sinners besmirch the name of their lord by committing acts of violence which are unsanctioned , illegal , and unholy .
Surely they also have to shoulder some of the responsibility?

Well arent we all guilty of doing nothing as we watch the world burn ?

Neither are excused , the fact that we wage war and children and women die , culture is lost , genetic variation is lost and for what , for the benefit of a small few for one generation or less ?

im sure we are all in agreement that killing of innocents is wrong and there is no debate on that subject , so lets put an end to it and force our governments to stop selling and producing weapons
isnt it about time we took over and told them NO

we dont want psychopaths and sociopaths running our planet into dust

Surely we are all to blame for everything that is wrong with society because we arent doing anything to fix it , acht its someone elses problem , I didnt do it , so im not fixing it , we are all burying our heads in the sand
lets just hope it all goes away because it has nothing to do with me , my home and family are fine so Im not bothered about what happens elsewhere , until its right on your doorstep and too late .

Unless of course I am wrong in which case , so be it .