A Reason for Faith in Jesus Christ

Understand Jesus and complete His circle of joy and shared mutual glorification in His triumph where it could be said that the apparent weakness of God was stronger than all the strength of "mighty" men of renown.

Consider how Jesus punk'd them all in such a way that they were cut to the heart and brought to their knees by inflicting upon them just the right kind of pain capable of winning the repentance of an evil and wicked heart. "Oh what did we do?!"

Consider also the everlasting joy and freedom of the resurrected life on the other side of the ordeal that was a necessary suffering for the sake of love and goodness and everything that makes life worthwhile.

Consider the boundaries of His logic formed by a boundless love that's capable of carrying the weight of it all even in the face of great hardship, pain, sorrow, suffering and anguish.

There is a multifaceted, indestructible diamond at the heart of it.

This may sound strange or unusual, but with a newfound understanding of the basis of this Great Work can be seen the greatest practical joke ever perpetrated, in a plot and a plan that was hatched from the very origin of the creation capable of anticipating the worst of human nature as fallen creatures and putting us back into our rightful place in the grand scheme of things as children of a loving God, standing next to the Godhead, hand in hand, in partnership (as it was intended).

There is a resolution to the problem of evil. Few understand it, but it's one that we are not incapable of grasping because in the consideration and contemplation we are also informed by a Spirit of Truth and Life and infinite intelligence that is also the very same love of God that informed the mind, heart, and infallible logic of Jesus, who's loving gesture and loving hand cannot be ignored and, as the one loving gesture capable of offering solace and consolation, is capable of simultaneously lifting us out of the pit and literally restoring our very joy and humor in the process, even as a joke at the expense of all our prior ignorance and absurdity.

To really understand it and come to grips with it and to take it and accept it, all we need to is have the courage to perhaps shed a tear or two or even a whole bowl of tears if need be (someone once said it's stored up in heaven in the form of joy), and then to actually get it, get that we are met where we are at and accepted as we are, while being urgently invited to leave everything we held dear and all our attachments behind.

It's not for the faint of heart or the timid or the "wise and knowledgeable", but what I'm suggesting here in no uncertain terms is that it DOES lend itself to the faculty of a type of reason in the form of the only true knowledge that there is; the knowledge of personal experience.

That it's so intimate, and so heavy handed and uncompromising, might make us shy away, but it's reasonableness, and it's rationale and logic cannot really be denied.

Yet the gesture remains, and the invitation, extended, and the rock of all ages remains, unmovable, indomitable, and so there's a loving humor to it, that makes of a compelling argument, an irresistible inclination, and that's all He requires (a mere inkling and faith the size of a tiny mustard seed).

It's really quite humorous and very very well done.

I can see why C.S. Lewis was so compelled by it after he took another look at the urging of his friend, J.R. Tolkien.

It defies traditional human reasoning in it's sheer genius and has the fingerprints of God written all over it, and if so I say that God is a God of playful humor, mirth and charm, and irony.

Oh it might take them a couple thousand years and untold death and destruction but eventually we'd be sure to get it, the communication from on high.

There is a reason for faith and in the final analysis, it's the only reasonable position to take in light of what's been clearly communicated about what amounts to some sort of divine romance! A comingling, and even a new creation, and a partnership. It's a family affair, that's what Christianity communicates to us, that the highest framework is some sort of table fellowship.

That's crazy, if Christianity is all true at the most fundamental level, which it most certainly appears to be.

Worthy is the lamb of our consideration and re-consideration and recognition (re cognition).

Blessed are those who laugh, but for all the right reasons.

Jesus, not again...

a reply to: AnkhMorpork

Did you know him? the OP reads like you did

Or are you just basing your high praise and BS on text you have read? text as in a novel / book / fairy tale / fantasy / choose your own genre and insert it.

a reply to: AnkhMorpork

You should rename this thread...

Replace "Jesus" with Christianity...

Or Paulianity

*shrug*

And strangely, it doesn't "sell" very well.. lol

Most will have none of it and even if there were a hand of friendship and everlasting joy and good-natured love and mirth, humor and charm extended to them from as if on high through the person of Jesus son of God, they would slap it away as if insulted!

Leave me to my "stuff", what's with this kingdom of heaven business anyway? I don't need or want a hand or a leg up, I'll bootstrap myself and engineer my own salvation, even if it means as the price losing my own sense of playful mirth and irony in the process. You won't make no smiling Christian out of me, no sir.

To each their own.

But oh what a missed opportunity...

I think the problem is that the solution presents itself in our blind spot, or it couldn't be a gleeful epiphany to begin with.

I think it all boils down to a matter of trust and where you can place it.

If you really believe the bible, read Deuteronomy 5: 7-11; and I'm paraphrasing, do not place ANYTHING before God. Not in heaven or on earth or below the earth, cause if you do, you and at least five to six of your future generations will be cursed for blasphemy. If you believe you have to first believe in christ to get to heaven as it is written in the new testament, well, it ain't gonna happen.

Sorry...

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: AnkhMorpork

You should rename this thread...

Replace "Jesus" with Christianity...

Or Paulianity

*shrug*

It's really Paulianity.

originally posted by: NightFlight
If you really believe the bible, read Deuteronomy 5: 7-11; and I'm paraphrasing, do not place ANYTHING before God. Not in heaven or on earth or below the earth, cause if you do, you and at least five to six of your future generations will be cursed for blasphemy. If you believe you have to first believe in christ to get to heaven as it is written in the new testament, well, it ain't gonna happen.

Sorry...

RE: "do not place ANYTHING before God"

What if you put Jesus before God?

It seems to me people idol worship the words of the Bible more than they have authentic piety.

A beautiful and deep meditation, Ankh. The Rock that moveth not.

a reply to: AnkhMorpork

I've never been very impressed by apologetics. Arguing from a biblical standpoint is great to bolster believers beliefs, but does little for those who are skeptical and adhere to a different worldview.

a reply to: swedy13

That's why I tried to reframe it and cast it in a different light, for consideration.

If a type of mirth starts to form and rise up from within born of a certain knowingness that I call the humor of true understanding, then it will have served it's purpose, but it, the consideration and contemplation can't be approached from the POV that holds to any sort of apriori bias or worse some sort of contemptuous bias prior to investigation, which is a surefire recipe to remain willfully blind to the possibility.

I'll think and ponder over this and come back with a new set of distinctions that might be helpful for consideration and comprehension.

a reply to: AnkhMorpork

Well, one of my goals has been to figure out how to consolidate Christianity and science.

I see Christianity as a positive force in terms of the culture it produces, at least in modern times, and I view the teachings of Jesus as principles that are true for the conscious domain (of humans, not animals - ie our basic biological tenets).

The problem is that to produce a Christian culture people have to truly believe, and I think that carries some negative consequences as well, especially around critical thinking and personal guidance. Maybe not, this is anecdotal but I grew up a staunch Christian, my family is all very deeply Christian, and I see that the reliance on a supernatural force can have an impact on reasoning.

I don't think science has all the answers. Not even close. It's constantly changing and evolving, oftentimes in ways that might support religion. But I don't see any type of compatibility and am sadly unconvinced as of yet that the deepest claims are legitimate when faced with modern science.

I'd love to see it take a step back and work on the cultural aspects first, then approach science through a modern perspective.

The works of people like Graham Norton seem to confirm a lot of biblical records, but even that can be explained through anthropology. The real key is the supernatural claims, which are unprovable scientifically at this point, unsupported by modern evidence, easily explained by mental states (as can be found through psychedelics, which people assert may have been the source for several records), church history (which had often modified the record to suit political purposes), etc...

I'd love for it to be real. Or maybe not, depending on which version of God is actually real, since there seem to be a lot of variations in the bible. The New testament God seems mostly ok (not 100%), the old testament God was a monster.

originally posted by: The GUT
A beautiful and deep meditation, Ankh.

The Rock that moveth not.

One who understood. I hope it gave you a GUT laugh. Rock of reason and logic, but even still people will go to any lengths to avoid it or try to raise up a strawman in opposition, just to avoid the loving implication of it's uncompromising nature.

Defend! Defend against the reasonableness of it, as we proceed to dash ourselves to pieces at it's feet lest we turn, and be healed, and know that we are also beloved of God as children of God, both human and divine (even though we might fail to express it properly or with grace, tact and balancing).

So it's not only an immovable rock, but also a hand of friendship and a heart of love that isn't really the least bit unreasonable, however unreasonably reasonable it might be.

How we contend with it, well there it is, in the from of either a double-bind or in the truth that sets us free, even free for the sake of freedom to freely love as we are loved.

This is not Paulianism, but simple pragmatism.

originally posted by: corblimeyguvnor
a reply to: AnkhMorpork

Did you know him? the OP reads like you did

Or are you just basing your high praise and BS on text you have read? text as in a novel / book / fairy tale / fantasy / choose your own genre and insert it.

I used to look at it that way, until it came to life and proved itself out through testing, which in my experience is always a two way street so when on the testing ground, it could very well drive a weak-minded person insane, and the strong-willed to open rebellion.

It's absolutely hilarious, the rock that moveth not.

...on the other side of tears that must be shed and then miraculously removed both at the same time or one after the other as the case may be, because we all are in need of consolation and comforting. which only leads to still more tears both of sadness and regret (but no more bitterness), and once again, of utter hilarity in the joy that transcends the heartache, there ahead of us to always and forever meet us on the way and go with us in spirit and in truth.

It's also terrifying.

Which only makes it all the more humorous at the absurdity of being terrified but for all the wrong reasons and in the process allowing ourselves to lose our own sense of humor (can you imagine? God forbid!) rather than turn and be healed by God.

It is nothing less than the loving hand of God that's more than capable of wiping away the tears from our eyes with a smile, but a knowing smile, borderline mischievous yet without really crossing the line, and simply holding to and speaking from the POV of the rock.

To speak from the rock is to use the Socratic method of teaching, and this is where the question is posed to you, not to convince you of anything in particular, but instead to make the inquiry of the self without which life isn't worth living, and when we arrive don't we find to our dismay that Jesus, and the love of Jesus, had already blazed the trial and was already awaiting with opened arms at a doorway framed by Justice and Mercy to allow for our own death and resurrection, preferably while we are still alive so as to get it over with and begin to enter into eternity with him in that already always state which was our fated destiny from the very origin of creation.

In Christ, we can be at last satiated. It is, He is, the very bread of life, and I am the bride of Christ for better or for or even often for the worst. But he still loves and accepts me, even in spite of myself, and that's funny because God punks us every time, while inviting us into ever greener and ever happier pastures, even if we're old and frail, or fat, in whatever shape or form creed or color, it's the same table, and if Jesus set it, then how could it not welcome one and all as one family who share the same basic ground of being and becoming and the same rock of reason, logic and love.

It find it to be a psychologically compelling argument, no matter how solipsistic it might appear within the context of my background starfield, but if the principal still applies, universally, as it does, then it's a very very VERY big big BIG table, because what is scale when there's a universal principal at heart?

This isn't apologetics. I'm not apologizing for anyone, and none of us really gets off the hook but that's a GOOD thing, particularly if our forgiveness and reintegration (individuation) is the final result, but of a form and function considerably upgraded for the mere contemplation or mere inkling in favor of, because what's real knowledge but the knowledge of personal experience.

It cannot be accessed from the POV of our traditional reasoning, but that doesn't make it any less so or true in our own personal experience.

Once the mind and heart changes its shape it can never go back to it's original configuration, and why would it want to?

"when the hearts of men change, kingdoms WILL change!"
~ John the Baptist

a reply to: AnkhMorpork

Wordy, but I'd agree that God does have a sense of humor!

a reply to: LadyGreenEyes

Almost a wicked sense of humor, without ever actually crossing the line.

Takes a certain level of courage and audacity to get it though, along with a healthy dose of humility where the definition of humility is to know one's self as you truly are.

There's a certain charm to it, that invites us to be more charming, but maybe with less wordiness, thanks for the feedback. I'm bad with run on sentences when I get into that stream of consciousness sharing.

Thank you though for your time and consideration and in particular that you delight in the mirth of the Lord.

I think it's part of what it means to know him.

There's nothing dour or stoic about it, that's the funny thing, so it could very well be that the last laugh is at the expense of many Christians who professed to believe in it if only to somehow keep it at arms length or to defend against it by pretending to own it and dispense it, traversing the seas to win a single convert only to make them twice as fit for hell as they are! (you see, that's FUNNY, Jesus is funny and also grave).

"Religion is a defence against having an authentic spiritual experience." ~ Carl Jung

If somehow, by some quirk, I am a bride of Christ of a sort, then what we're representing and presenting here is a living water that's freely available to any and all who thirst.

It's a non-coercive free invitation or proposition to enter into some sort of participatory eschatology and not by our own doing, even by our own undoing.

"Lord I am undone!"
~ Isaiah, at the vision of the throne of the eternal Godhead, where even the cherubim or angelic beings with many wings had to cover their faces and their feet from the glory of the Lord

Thankfully, God doesn't completely freak us out like that any more, but the image and the allegory still applies.

God is looking for the brokenhearted, and he who's been forgiven more, loves more, and all the workers get equal pay not matter when they started.

While some, to use another analogy rush to the head seats at the table, only to be embarrassingly told before all who are gathered that that place was reserved for another and forced to move further down.

There's just so much irony, humor, mirth and charm in the teachings of Jesus. I love him.

originally posted by: Argentbenign
Jesus, not again...

QFT!
How tedious, the Faithless, once again, needing to defend and feed and 'spread' their belief infection...