Help...04 pt turbo. high pitch, loud, deafening noise at 2krpm and under....Help

i know i know.....its a pt. they suck. theyre garbage...lets just get that out of the way because my wife loves this car and i am left scratching my head.
i am not a novice to repairing cars but i can not figure this out.

so about 2 weeks ago my wife called me and said the car is making a high pitch squeal. i was at work and i automatically thought what everyone would. a belt/pulley/tensioner....figured no big deal....

it is definitely not that....about 3 seconds after i start the car the noise starts. it is not a whine really. i would call it a whistle....a crazy loud, high pitched whistle...at 2k rpms it goes away....it it does not get louder as i speed up or slow down.
when i turn the car off the noise persists for about 2 seconds but it gets gradually quieter...

because of that i started to think a vacuum leak maybe. seemed reasonable. like it was sucking atmosphere in.....
i cant find a leak but the noise is so loud that as soon as i open the hood i cant even pinpoint a general area of the car it is coming from....
it does NOT sound like a belt
tensioner
pulley
turbo

those are all distinct sounds and this is all together different....

i googled it and went to some pt forums and a lot of people said they had the problem(though described the noise a bit different) and they replaced their intake manifold gasket and it fixed it.

i replaced the upper intake yesterday but it is still doing it. i thought i had it because i could see the slightest bit of saturation where the upper meets the lower. i mean i had to put my finger nail where the surfaces meet and it was just the ever so small bit...not a leak or a drop.

i pulled it apart and installed the new one and the problem was still there.
i drove it to my buds house for a sec and on the way home it stopped.
thought i was golden. didnt make sense but i figured maybe the gasket has to seat or something.

a couple hours after that my wife went to the grocery store and on the way home it started making the noise again.

let me also say the car is running fine. every so often there is the slightest flutter. last a micro second. i can see it drop a 10th of a point on my wide band then it is fine again.
the check engine light is on but it is always on. i dont have a cat on it and the o2 sensor is not hooked up. ive had the car for almost 2 years and the light has been on the entire time.
only difference is now it blinks. not all the time. it will be solid then go to blinking.

last time it did that it quit on me and i had to get a computer for it and it cost me a grand.

i have the lower intake manifold gasket that i am going to replace but i am not looking forward to it. the upper only took me about 40 minutes and thats cause i was letting my daughter 'help' me.
much more stuff has to come off to get the lower off. i called the shop to get an estimate(this is how i gauge how long it might take) and they quoted me at $380.
so that means its a few hour job....
im not going to replace it today cause it looks like rain but i think next weekend i will tear it down.

lets say that does not work do you have any ideas?
ever heard of this problem before with a pt or any other car.

i worked at a chain type repair shop when i was younger and i worked at a dodge/chrysler dealer and i have never heard a car make this noise before.

i noticed my K and N filter was pretty dirty so even though i knew it was a long shot i figured that whistle might be coming from the fact it cant breathe. i soaked it with the cleaner, rinsed it, oiled it , put it back on the car and no difference.

i am at a loss so any help is much appreciated.

thank you

a reply to: TinySickTears

Try using a water hose to isolate the place .

a reply to: TinySickTears


Ummm...have you checked for a leak in the intercooler...?

If it persists after you shut it down then it must be a pressure issue...perhaps your waste gate on the turbo is malfunctioning and you've got over pressure issues in the intercooler...




YouSir

here is a 10 second clip i just took with my phone



MUCH louder when the hood is open

originally posted by: YouSir
a reply to: TinySickTears


Ummm...have you checked for a leak in the intercooler...?

If it persists after you shut it down then it must be a pressure issue...perhaps your waste gate on the turbo is malfunctioning and you've got over pressure issues in the intercooler...

YouSir

car does not have an intercooler on it

think it could still be a pressure issue with the turbo?

1. You aren't a race driver, hopefully you are aware.
2. City streets aren't race tracks
3. Because of 1 and 2 you don't need a turbo.
4. If you don't know how to fix it and have to ask on a conspiracy forum, take it to a mechanic before you break somethings.

My .02.

originally posted by: hombero
1. You aren't a race driver, hopefully you are aware.
2. City streets aren't race tracks
3. Because of 1 and 2 you don't need a turbo.
4. If you don't know how to fix it and have to ask on a conspiracy forum, take it to a mechanic before you break somethings.

My .02.

well thanks for that bit of wisdom.

a reply to: TinySickTears




Ummm...I checked online...your inter cooler is in front of the radiator...it looks like another radiator...you should have three radiator looking cooling devices stacked one in front of the other...closest to the engine is the coolant radiator...then the evap radiator for the A/C system...then closest to the front the inter cooler...

Follow the out flow hose...intake side not exhaust...it will lead forward to the inter cooler...then from the inter cooler to the intake manifold...

Also check the vacuum hose to the waste gate on the turbo for cracks or holes...have someone rev the throttle while your looking at the turbo to see if the waste gate is operating...




YouSir

originally posted by: YouSir
a reply to: TinySickTears




Ummm...I checked online...your inter cooler is in front of the radiator...it looks like another radiator...you should have three radiator looking cooling devices stacked one in front of the other...closest to the engine is the coolant radiator...then the evap radiator for the A/C system...then closest to the front the inter cooler...

Follow the out flow hose...intake side not exhaust...it will lead forward to the inter cooler...then from the inter cooler to the intake manifold...

Also check the vacuum hose to the waste gate on the turbo for cracks or holes...have someone rev the throttle while your looking at the turbo to see if the waste gate is operating...

YouSir

thanks man.
i just ran out to look and sure enough i see the intercooler. it is small man thats why i never noticed it before. thanks for the heads up. i have to run out but once it cools down i will start messing with it.

awesome

a reply to: hombero

Ummm...in order to increase the H/P for smaller 4 cylinder vehicles most manufacturers installed turbo charging...

My 02 SAAB 95 AERO came stock with a 2.3 liter 4 cylinder with a rather fat turbo that stock gives it 250 H/P with 255 lb ft of torque...on a 2.25 inch exhaust system...

My plan is to bore out the engine block...new forged pistons crank etc...install a performance upgraded turbo...welded aluminum inter cooler...3" exhaust front to back...camset...and chipset...Guys all over the world are turning 11 second quarters with these 2.3 liter engines...Fun fun...Oh I also plan to extend my fenders and install 12 inch tires to replace the stock 10 1/2 inch sneakers...

The car came stock with performance suspension/steering...




YouSir

a reply to: TinySickTears


Ummm...your welcome brother...My inter cooler is the same size as my radiator...it's huuuge...


YouSir

My 85 mr2 made that exact sound a year after rebuilding the engine- n/a.

Took forever to find it, that tone sounds like it's coming from nowhere and everywhere at the same time.

It was a vac leak- a hose had been ripped off (probably by me, doing something else) and the air rushing into the metal nipple barb whistled. LOUDLY.

A lot of people say that you can find a vac leak by spraying something like carb cleaner around various places, and when the leak sucks it in, the engine will react. I've never had much luck with that, but for a big leak, a hose works. A good stream of water, when the intake leak sucks it in, you'll know it.
Might not be too safe to do with a turbo, but it's not uncommon for n/a troubleshooting.

a reply to: TinySickTears

Does the pitch change when revving? For sound mind, I would yank the belt off to eliminate pulleys, pumps, belt and alternator.

originally posted by: YouSir
a reply to: TinySickTears


Ummm...your welcome brother...My inter cooler is the same size as my radiator...it's huuuge...

YouSir

its not an intercooler....thought it was at first look but its the ac condenser.
checked my manual. no mention of intercooler....
this has a small metal line going into it.....
maybe the gt has an intercooler. mine is a limited

originally posted by: lordcomac


Took forever to find it, that tone sounds like it's coming from nowhere and everywhere at the same time.

thats exactly it. i cant tell where it is coming from and it is hard to find a vacuum leak when the car is off.
i think i have carb cleaner or starting fluid...i will start chasing hoses...

originally posted by: mtnshredder
a reply to: TinySickTears

Does the pitch change when revving? For sound mind, I would yank the belt off to eliminate pulleys, pumps, belt and alternator.

no. pitch or decibel level does not change when revving. it goes away at about 2100 rpm. the only time it changes is after the key is off then it whines down...even though it is not a whine..a whistle.

its not the pulleys or the belt...that is a very distinct sound and this is different.

the vacuum leak makes the most sense. the intake manifold gasket made sense too. i guess it could be the lower intake but i am not wanting to pull that # apart.

gonna eat a few slices and then go try to chase the hoses and lines

Any play in the turbo impeller shaft? Perhaps the bearing is going out? are there any oil leaks around the turbo seals? I'm not a pro mechanic, but a know a few things.

perhaps crack in the exhaust manifolds?

im gonna go ahead and go with lower intake manifold gasket.

i got some carb and throttle body cleaner.
i was spraying around the vacuum lines trying to find it.

when looking at the motor from the outside, i sprayed some right under the upper rad hose, directly on the left corner of the lower intake manifold where it meets the block. the noise stopped immediately and the idle changed. it came back pretty fast so i sprayed it again and this time it did not go away but the pitch changed.

at least i know what it is.

cant do anything till next weekend.....

thanks for all your help

have you checked the belt. sometimes it´s just the belt making that whining noise. what happens if you give it full throttle and step off the gas under load?

originally posted by: verschickter
have you checked the belt. sometimes it´s just the belt making that whining noise. what happens if you give it full throttle and step off the gas under load?

thanks but it is not the belt.
that makes a very distinct whine. what i am getting is a whistle.

anyway i found where it is coming from