F-35s at Red Flag

While I wouldn't cal myself a hater, I do think there was a lot of capability left on the table because of the commonality requirements. Yes, lets use a common engine, avionics, sensors but let the different air arms have their own airframe to best suit their needs.

a reply to: Flipper35

There is to a degree, but if they went full up, bleeding edge, more than they did, they would have hit a bigger wall. So i think the commonality actually saved things to a degree.

They wouldn't have to go full bleeding edge, but the current shape leave a lot of performance behind in the transonic range. Maybe that isn't important any longer.

a reply to: Flipper35

They really don't need the performance though. They're not going to be supersonic much, and they needed the shape for the weapons bays.

a reply to: SpeedFanatic

we can settle this pretty easy. They had the F-22 and F-35 on display side by side at Airfest 2016, which I happened to take pictures of. We even got the pilots to autograph in flight photos for my son. But I have to scan that one.
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The F-35 is smaller, doesn't seem fat at all to me, and I thought is rather nice to look at. I can't understand why people would think they are ugly.

a reply to: worldstarcountry

To me the only real difference in shape is due to the dual vs single engine set up. Considering how much more technology and range is packed into the 35, it's pretty impressive. You can tell they're from the same manufacturer for sure.

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a reply to: blackbird9393

That's the one i posted up there somewhere. More "it did OK but...." that I've come to expect. Tyler is as bad as War Is Boring when it comes to the F-35.

Yes, the ROE is important, but saying that the kill ratio was probably because of other aircraft is like saying "The F-86 had a 12:1 kill ratio in Korea, but there were also F-9s and F-80s there so we don't know its actual kill ratio".

a reply to: Zaphod58

Ha I see your point it's a stupid comparison to try and justify the negative f35 argument. Yes there are problems. Which will take time to work out. However there is clutching and straws and then clutching at straws.

a reply to: blackbird9393

They've got a long way to go still. But if this is what they can do with limited software, and those problems, i can't wait to see what it does when it's fully operational.

a reply to: Zaphod58

I doubt we will ever see it's full potential. It will be too good on a bad day at half power

a reply to: Zaphod58

Oh dear, one Vympel R-77 takes out the AWACS at long range and party over

a reply to: sy.gunson

And you have no idea what the hell you're talking about, again. You really should try some actual research. Stealth has used active, long range, LPI radar for years. Add in the datalinks and their radar covers a larger area than any AWACS can cover, while remaining stealthy.

I've heard a lot of "stealth is dead" crap, but i have to admit, yours takes the cake.

a reply to: Zaphod58

He had to do some real mental gymnastics with that one.

"High mission reliability" I'm paraphrasing this, "could have been used to fudge the numbers" Like mission availability is a bad thing?

100 million dollars a copy... OK, I'd rather that were lower, too. However, unless I'm mistaken, aren't F18's with all the bells and whistles even more? Or at least in the same neighborhood? I seem to recall reading that somewhere...?

108 million per unit w/F18 to United Arab Emirate for a plane that is a generation less capable in every way to the Lightning II, if memory serves...

a reply to: seagull

LRIP 10 was just announced at $96.4M for the A IIRC. List on a Rhino (Super Hornet) is $98M, and some reports put the F-16IQ (Iraq) at over $150M.

The latest 4th Gen are much more capable than the previous versions of the same aircraft, don't get me wrong, but they'll never approach what fifth gen can do. I'd love to see an Eagle with EODAS, MADL, and the rest, but it would be like trying to start a car in 150 degree heat, using a 9 volt battery.

pretty good ratio though I wonder what factors in to all of that.

Unmentioned in this thread about F-35s @ Red Flag is the successful integration of MQ-9 Reapers with F-35's for various strike packages and rescue missions, a first ever in simulated combat.

a reply to: intelgurl

The more that comes out about this plane, the better it gets.

Interesting article about the B-1 at Red Flag. They integrated with the F-35 for the first time at the exercise.

theaviationgeekclub.com...

Is there detailed information available about what the Red Air was comprised of? Photos and videos from this Red Flag suggest Nellis F-16's, Draken A-4's and L-159's... Not necessarily the most challenging opponents. The penetration of advanced ground threats sounds impressive and is certainly encouraging.