Hours Before VP Debate, Trump Melts Down And Blames Hillary Clinton For His Tax Cheating

a reply to: Konduit

Which means she can avoid paying 700k in taxes this year.

1) Only if she has long term capital gains against which to apply the long term capital loss. And only $3,000 of it per year. It will not affect any other income she has. She still must pay taxes on that.


2) Even if and when she writes it all off, the amount in tax "savings" would be the capital gains tax rate (now 20%) multiplied by the difference, not 700k. In other words, the most she can save per year is $600 because of that loss.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

The property taxes on one of his buildings alone is probably astronomical.

Ironically, Trump's very first project:

Politico - Trump and the Artifice of the Deal (2016):

When a reporter asked Trump why the city handed him a 40-year abatement, he replied, “Because I didn’t ask for 50.” By 1976, the $4-million-a-year abatement (it would grow progressively more valuable) was his. But even once he got the tax break, Trump still needed actual money to buy and renovate the thing. His financial broker went hunting for lenders on Wall Street and had come up empty. Fred Trump, once again, wound up doing the heavy lifting. There was of course the famous million-dollar loan.

Because that wasn't enough so he had the books cooked on the same property to cheat on his taxes:

LA Times - Trump has thrived with government's generosity (2011)

That revelation came shortly before Trump and his partners shortchanged the public coffers, according to the city audit. Trump asked his accountants in 1987 to retroactively change the Grand Hyatt's accounting policy to lower its tax bill, according to an accountant's letter uncovered in the audit. When tax receipts from the Grand Hyatt plummeted to $667,000 from $3.7 million the year before, the city budget director asked Auditor General Burstein to review the hotel's financial records. Burstein said the Grand Hyatt, through "aberrant" accounting practices, had understated its profits by $5 million and shorted the city by $2,870,259 in taxes.

He's suing D.C. over the tax rate on the Old Post Office right now.

Those are only a few examples but I think its safe to say that he's not above getting out of paying property taxes through tactics that include outright deception. Anyone who owned those properties would be subject to taxes. If the person who developed/owned them wasn't a tax cheat, the public wouldn't be getting ripped off.

As for his personal taxes:

If Trump claimed donations to his own charity to receive deductions and then used that money to pay off Pam Bondi, to pay off lawsuits against his businesses and to buy portraits of himself to hang in his golf club — that's not only self-dealing, it's tax evasion.

The most real thing coming out of this election cycle is that so many people have little or no idea of how the US government functions.

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
Tax dodging? Paying what one is legally required is not considered tax dodging in any country, state, province, or local municipalities.

Except he's preaching how people should pay their fair share.....

Is everyone just ignoring this or?

Do you guys ever get tired of carrying his water

Exactly. If they don't have a problem with a billionaire using the system to avoid paying taxes, how can they turn around and claim they're against people on Welfare who "use the system" to avoid paying taxes? Their claims of being against "moochers" have lost all credibility since being a "moocher" is also legal, just like what Trump did. (For the record, I don't consider being on public assistance programs as being a "moocher". I'm just pointing out their previous arguments.)

If it's just a matter of what's "legal" and what's "illegal", then they should quit complaining about NAFTA, outsourcing jobs, using tax shelters, accepting campaign contributions from special interest groups, accepting funding from people like George Soros, getting their marching orders and bills written by lobbyists, etc. Because all of those things are also legal.

originally posted by: Byrd
There's a video out there of an Arizona rally where Trump puts the blame on Clinton for not changing the laws when she was in Congress. "why didn't she change those laws so I couldn't use them?" He asks.

Donald Trump has a new excuse for why he didn’t pay taxes for decades. At a rally in Arizona, Trump claimed that his tax dodging is all Hillary Clinton’s fault.

Trump has no real idea how the system works.

This thread should be in the HOAX bin. Trump did not cheat on his taxes he simply used the existing tax laws. Most of his platform is based on NOT raising taxes but simply changing the tax laws that allows major decreases in taxes. Everyone will pay their fair share of taxes at last. I remember him explaining this in his early rallies.

STM

NVM

I hope Trump changes a few other tax laws such as helping those within your own community directly.

I have a pretty decent income and when I talk to my CPA about me claiming deductions he just laughs at me. He says I would have to donate a percentage to approved charities to claim any deductions. I tell him about helping in my community, paying rent or electric bills or buying christmas presents for a grandmother to give her grandkids or medical expenses I give directly to the family that needs them, etc, etc.

He says it only counts if you give it to a charity that is approved. Yeah, right, the charities that use most for administration costs, my contributions go directly to the situation and I walk it through myself to make sure.

We really do need to over-haul the tax code, make it real and fair for once,

STM

a reply to: Mandroid7

Trump used the available tax laws. If she didn't like them, she should have changed them.

Interesting how Hillary and Pocahontas, er, I mean Elizabeth Warren......etal, (Occupy Wall Street I'm looking at you!) and the Bernie Sanders supporter still living with their parents.....(I saw a "The Chew" episode were a pregnant Daphne Oz talked about how she and her husband were living with her parents, Dr OZ, until they could afford to buy...) (

I digress....

a reply to: Byrd

That's actually a good point Trump made. He had nothing whatsoever to do with the tax laws. He just went by them. Hillary has been a Senator, and as such could easily have introduced legislation to close the very loophole she now berates For following the law.

Every single person reading this has used the tax laws to their advantage. Trump did the same. Why are we blaming him and not the ex-legislator who never even tried to fix the law?

TheRedneck

originally posted by: Mandroid7
Cool story. All emotion aside, that is a legitimate question.

Trump used the available tax laws. If she didn't like them, she should have changed them.

Why didn't you at least link it?

What's ironic, is if he did opt to pay what wasn't owed, it would be spent against the citizens, like every other control effort so far.

Catch22

I don't know if Hillary tried to change them, but MANY people in Congress have. The problem is that all of the Republicans have taken these no tax increase pledges that require them to vote no to anything that would increase taxes. Under the terms of their pledge, removing a tax cut constitutes a tax increase. For this reason, every attempt to fix the law has failed and it can't possibly succeed without a super majority... and even then it might be filibustered into oblivion, as it was in 2008 (R's favored blocking tax reform over the ACA).

originally posted by: TheRedneck
Every single person reading this has used the tax laws to their advantage. Trump did the same. Why are we blaming him and not the ex-legislator who never even tried to fix the law?

I haven't. I actually see it as the right thing to do, to pay what's asked before deductions. Most people don't agree with me, but if we did we would eliminate the deficit.

Anyways, as much as I hate to do this, I'm going to quote myself from a similar thread because it's easier than rewriting it:

...The real problem isn't that what he did is illegal either (though it may have been, we'll have to wait and see). It's that our system is set up on taxing the wealthy, due to income inequality no one else has a large enough share of income to contribute meaningfully to the tax base. When the wealthy dodge their taxes, it multiplies and requires the middle class to pay a much larger share in order to make up the lost income.

Let me explain with some simple numbers. In this sample scenario there's a GDP of $1000 spread among 1000 people, and the percentages roughly correlate to how our current tax base breaks down.
Person #1 makes $350
#2-#5 make $250 ($62.50 each)
#6-#20 make $300 ($20.00 each)
#21-#50 make $99 ($3.30 each)
#51-#100 make $1 ($0.01 each)

When #1 dodges paying his 20%, that's $70 that have to be made up elsewhere in the system.
51 and below simply don't have the assets to tax, 6-20 are upper middle class and where the tax burden then falls. When they have to make up that $70 missing from the system, each ends up paying $2.33 in additional tax, that's an extra 11.67% out of their paychecks.

THAT is the problem with Trump dodging his taxes. It may be legal, but in doing so he is stealing money directly from the people we're most trying to support. The honest hard working people who have seen success.

It might not be correct to say he did or didn't cheat on taxes since he is being audited and very few people (non public) have seen the tax data.

It could be either case. A bit of a case of Schrodinger's tax.

a reply to: Aazadan

Ironically, I think they know that and are just being facetious. It's kind of like poisoning the well then attacking others for not purifying it fast enough.

originally posted by: Aazadan
It may be legal, but in doing so he is stealing money directly from the people we're most trying to support.

You're right, it is legal. If you have a problem with that talk to your congressman, not Trump. He had nothing to do with the laws in place.

STM

originally posted by: seentoomuch
You're right, it is legal. If you have a problem with that talk to your congressman, not Trump. He had nothing to do with the laws in place.

STM

Congress is powerless to change laws as long as the no tax increase pledges are in place. Talking to them can't fix anything.

Furthermore, it's a question of morality. Is it moral for a very wealthy individual to dodge taxes, knowing that much poorer individuals will have to pay them instead? Leaders don't screw over their supporters by doing that.

a reply to: Aazadan

Trump did not dodge his taxes. Dodging implies an illegal or at least sneaky action in order to thwart paying what is owed. That is not what happened. Trump managed his capital within the laws and in an open manner (which is how this was discovered). He calculated the best way to make the most profit legally and took it.

You say you do not take deductions. Fine. I will not call you a liar. I will say, out of everyone I know, everyone I have talked to in over a half-century of talking to people from all walks of life, you are the only person who has ever even hinted at doing such a thing. Most people pay tax preparation fees specifically to pay the least tax possible... that's an entire industry that has grown up over the same thing Trump is lambasted for doing.

You say we could pay off the national debt if everyone followed suit. If that is true, then why do we not remove the deductions from the law? Because only legislators can do that, and they have refused to do so... Clinton, the one who is so worried about the deduction Trump took, was a legislator. Trump has never been a legislator.

Incidentally, by paying more than the law required, standard accounting practice says you have just added to the national debt. You have the right to file an amended return; therefore that overage you payed is owed to you and is therefore a debt carried by the government.

TheRedneck