Why Would We Kneel During the National Anthem? (And the Missed Warning.)

a reply to: reldra

They were demonized because they couldn't agree on what the problem was, how to fix it.. oh and some of them received a good deal of money from donations and it got spent... never saw on what, Oh and lets not forget about the businesses that lost their butts during this...

I remember as a young man during Regan that many people were screaming about out of control govt spending that got crushed by the 80's greed is good movement.

I also remember people talking about stock market issues leading up to the dot com bubble bursting.. and anyone that tried to interfere with the making of money got pushed aside or crushed.

If Occupy had gotten a real structure so they could present things in an organized way coherent way, rather than the everything in a committee every one gets a voice BS, and every opinion matters... even though it cluttered the message then they would have gotten a lot more support... and possibly even changed things.

As for the Anthem... kneel.. dont kneel.. its your right... if your an entertainer, (sports actor etc) then expect some repercussions... there is no violation of the 1st if I dont tune in to watch a san fran game because of kapernik etc... the 1st protects you from the Fed... not the repercussions of other people (within the boundaries of the law).

I see the left trying vary hard to justify these disrespectful actions.
Some rich over payed sub par athlete making as stand where none is needed?
How ignorant can you be?

I see the comparisons used to the black power salute used in 1968 Olympics. The comparison is so far off base it's not even funny. He should show some respect for the system/nation that allows him to make millions of his (sub par)abilities. The fact this waste of oxygen is still being discussed shows who far America has fallen. No longer are we a nation of critical thinking individuals working as a cohesive unite to be the absolute best we can be.

We are a nation of entitled weak willed and weak morals. Where we praise people who piss on the flag and spit at the police. But when SHTF these very people will hide behind the flag and police for safety.

Two of the better leftist arguments I've heard recently.
"America was never great!"
"Don't violate my 1st amendment right!".

"Die cops!"
"But protect my rights!"

a reply to: JAY1980

Frankly, the notion of being asked to stand/kneel/do anything during any ceremony flies in the face of what it means to be American.

I can respect things, and do it in my own way. I don't have to say "Your Majesty" and bow. I am free to move and free to speak. And my failure to do so in no way makes me any less American, or any less subject to the protection of my individual rights.

This "no real Scotsman" fallacy you have going on in your post is silly and frustrating. It seems that to be a "real American" nowadays, I have to forget what really being American is all about and cede my individuality to a tyranny of the majority.

Disgusting. Absolutely disgusting.

To anyone who really feels this is an issue, I suggest you actually start from the beginning all over again. Because Kaepernick, as big of a jerk as he is, is as American as any of us. And while I may or may not agree with him, thank God he is free to make his gesture.

ETA: i forgot to point out, a nation of "weak willed' individuals would trip over themselves trying to make the tyrannical majority happy. It seems to me that standing out of duty while some song plays is more a display of a weak will than choosing to not stand for something.

Jesus, its like 1984 in here. Where exercising your right to protest makes you weak willed, but joining in with the crowd makes you a rugged individualist.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: Nucleardoom

No need to have that image of animals in the street....you have the broad brush to stand in for you.

Why are "black people" killing each other? I know why....and its a pretty obvious problem with a not so simple solution.

At the end of the day, its human behavior. And human behavior is both predictable and controllable.

That broad brush you speak of does a pretty good job of painting the news nearly every night with violent black crime.

Do I believe all blacks behave in this manner? Of course not, but the SJW's on this site would love to make you believe that.

It's damn ridiculous when you spotlight a very real and widespread problem within the black community and people just try and make excuses for their actions.

You get back to me after seeing video after video of black on black violent crime and tell me I'm using a brush.

I could claim you're the one here trying your best to use that brush as a broom frantically trying to sweep this inconvenient truth under the rug.

originally posted by: Nucleardoom

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Nucleardoom

This is an old, tired, debunked stance that some people cling to simply because they want to. When arguments and proof are presented you close your eyes and plug your ears. You make a deliberate choice to maintain your image of 'animals' running wild in the street shooting, beating and robbing each other.

Why do you do this?

Well...I live near Milwaukee and I will usually tune into the local evening news. On nearly any given evening on the newscast there are multiple shootings being reported and guess what? 95% of the time it's black on black crime. I'm sorry but I just don't see anywhere near as many news stories detailing white on white violent crime. We just had a guy sentenced recently who shot up the wrong house killing a 5 year old girl who was sitting on her grandfathers lap on the couch in their living room. The three scumbags involved were black but in this case the victim wasn't.

5 year old Laylah Petersen

I don't need to "maintain an image of 'animals' running wild in the street shooting, beating and robbing each other" when Chicago alone provides all the proof needed to for anyone to realize this is a big problem. It's bad enough I avoid Milwaukee as much as possible and only head into the city if I absolutely have to rather than possibly being caught in the crossfire of some 2 bit gangland style shoot-em-up.

That's why I do it.

Hey there! I live north of Downtown off of MLK Drive in Milwaukee, in the Harambee neighborhood. On a Thursday night in mid-late September, Palmer Street (one block from me) was closed off and I heard the choppers overhead. Turns out a man was shot and killed and another injured. This was ONE BLOCK from my house, at around 4pm.

Fast forward about 5 days, and there's a shooting at Holton and Chambers. About 6 blocks from me. Again at around 4:30pm.

When you live around black people and take public transportation, you know how the VAST MAJORITY of black people act. There really are no exceptions. Even a lady who looks middle-aged, dressed nicely, seemingly just a nice woman, is listening to that godawful violent rap music on her headphones (I know the differences and when I can hear nigga nigga nigga and tinny beats, I know that's not church music she's listening to).) They will talk nice to your face (like our neighbors across the street talking about how they hate the thump cars, etc..) but when a thump car rolls up, who is out there talking with the miscreant at 7:00am? Yep, sweet-as-pie auntie looking woman is just as much a thug in mentality as the dude driving that ridiculously-lifted car assaulting the block with window- and bone-rattling bass. AT 7:00 AM ffs!!

Just today on the bus poor kid was wailing, mom got him out of the stroller - but no calm words, no love - just STOP IT, SHUT UP and IMMA BEAT YOU WHEN WE GET HOME. If we weren't on the bus that bitch would have smacked that kid. Not a singe black "parent" (usually a teenager with attitude) I see EVER interacts with their kids. They are always on their phones. Popping out kids to get a paycheck.

I am getting too old for this #. Roommate just paid last mortgage payment, hoping to convince him we need to MOVE. NOW. NORTH. PLEASE!!!

Stay safe, fellow Wisconsinite!

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: slider1982

That is a giant load of doo-doo.

originally posted by: Hazardous1408

Yes it is.

No flag has been outlawed in Britain.

This guy often speaks on British politics all the way from Indonesia or wherever he is.
Often doo-doo.

I think you're wrong on this which is incredible since you live there:

St. George flag ban

originally posted by: Nucleardoom

That broad brush you speak of does a pretty good job of painting the news nearly every night with violent black crime.

Do I believe all blacks behave in this manner? Of course not, but the SJW's on this site would love to make you believe that.

SJW's....what a dumb label we have come up with. Im shaking my head and wagging my finger in the general direction of Americans on the internet.

Weak minded people are made to believe things. So i expect weak minded people to take what is fashionable and make it part of their mental information processing grid. The reality: black people were herded into ghettos to live with our felons, rapists, and mental patients. You can be certain that doing that kind of stuff will be disastrous. Worse: the US did its damnedest to make being black illegal, but creating laws meant to target minorities. So once you have the ghettos full of the black population, you strip the men away and put them in prison. You can see where this is going....

....so when you talk "black on black crime", just remember: that is exactly how Uncle Sam wants it. And he spent a ton of money making it happen. And by "money" i mean "tax dollars". You know, the same tax dollars that people sit around bitching about being given away for free housing? LOL, Uncle Sam is slick as hell, killing 2 birds with 1 stone that way. Using tax dollars to pigeonhole an entire race (without the need for Jim Crow) while at the same time fomenting racial tension over that "free housing".

It's damn ridiculous when you spotlight a very real and widespread problem within the black community and people just try and make excuses for their actions.

You get back to me after seeing video after video of black on black violent crime and tell me I'm using a brush.

I could claim you're the one here trying your best to use that brush as a broom frantically trying to sweep this inconvenient truth under the rug.

The only inconvenient truth here is the complete lack of thought put into your position.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan

The only inconvenient truth here is the complete lack of thought put into your position.

Well here's a thought: are you and I responsible for those clowns pulling the trigger?

It matters not how bad your situation is: YOU STILL HAVE THE CHOICE TO NOT COMMIT THE CRIME.

I see you like to try and pour on the white guilt real thick just like the MSM.

I can see they were obviously very successful with their propaganda agenda, because you blindly parrot their narrative.

I think you may need to reevaluate your position. Not because of a lack of thought put into it but rather a complete lack of any individual thought regarding the issue.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

SJW's....what a dumb label we have come up with

No more dumb than 'gun violence,one percent,mass shooting,climate change' and the rest of political neologism's. We hear every day.

After all we live in a 'democracy' where TWO sides get to make up words.

IMO.

a reply to: Nucleardoom

With even a basic understanding of psychology, its plain to see that people living in ghettos are set up to fail by the people who run those ghettos: the government.

Yes, we all have a choice to not commit crime. HOwever, that presupposes that everyone sees "crime" in the same way. Imagine you live in a housing project where felons bully everyone else. Morality, in that case, begins to take on a slightly different form.

There's a reason people don't like to raise their famiies around felons, child molesters, and mental patients. But in ghettos, we concentrate those populations, and then mix in some regular folks just trying to raise a family.

I doubt you will bother reading this, but it will help apply some context to a way of thinking that may be foreign to you, but that is rather commonplace:

Poor people don't plan long term, we'll just get our hearts broken"

So, as a nation we can continue to try to beat that same mule repeatedly and hope that it moves. Or we can realize that its dead, and look for something different. Using the logic you are using over the prior 130 years has gotten us in this boat. I propose we actually sit and think about it for awhile, and admit that what we've done has failed so bad that its bringing the entire country to its knees.

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

SJW's....what a dumb label we have come up with

No more dumb than 'gun violence,one percent,mass shooting,climate change' and the rest of political neologism's. We hear every day.

After all we live in a 'democracy' where TWO sides get to make up words.

IMO.

You may be right. "Gun violence" has to be the stupidest term I have ever heard in my life. Its a trick of statistics and nothing more.

But "SJW"....once you apply the label, people quit actually discussing the traits. So we end up with the stupidity we see today where you have various people congregate to call each other snowflakes as insults. Every time I see it my soul dies a little.

a reply to: thegeneraldisarray

I'd star your post 10 times if I could. It's easy to try and discredit how bad the situation really is when you're not seeing it firsthand, choose to completely ignore it, or you live in a rural area. Thanks for contributing your input as it gives a little inside perspective of the reality out there right now on the streets of our large cites. It's not good and only getting worse. I wouldn't even consider raising a family in many parts of Milwaukee as it's just too toxic of an environment for kids. Like you stated in your post, you need to trust your gut and move out now.
Stay safe on the mean streets of brew town fellow cheese head.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

But "SJW"....once you apply the label, people quit actually discussing the traits.

As they should because JUSTICE is suppose to be blind.

Not by selectively pandering to (insert whoever is being oppressed by y because z says so)

If people want honest conversations.

They should begin and end with honesty.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: Nucleardoom

With even a basic understanding of psychology, its plain to see that people living in ghettos are set up to fail by the people who run those ghettos: the government.

Yes, we all have a choice to not commit crime. HOwever, that presupposes that everyone sees "crime" in the same way. Imagine you live in a housing project where felons bully everyone else. Morality, in that case, begins to take on a slightly different form.

There's a reason people don't like to raise their famiies around felons, child molesters, and mental patients. But in ghettos, we concentrate those populations, and then mix in some regular folks just trying to raise a family.

I doubt you will bother reading this, but it will help apply some context to a way of thinking that may be foreign to you, but that is rather commonplace:

Poor people don't plan long term, we'll just get our hearts broken"

So, as a nation we can continue to try to beat that same mule repeatedly and hope that it moves. Or we can realize that its dead, and look for something different. Using the logic you are using over the prior 130 years has gotten us in this boat. I propose we actually sit and think about it for awhile, and admit that what we've done has failed so bad that its bringing the entire country to its knees.

I can agree with many things you're pointing out. In fact you've raised some very good points regarding how we've arrived at this position in the US. The problem is vast and racism is one of the cornerstones of the problem. How do we "fix" that is the question as it's nearly impossible to change a racist's viewpoint. There is also a cultural divide to overcome as well.

All I can say is the government has it's hands full with this problem and it shares in the responsibility of it's creation, but is not the sole perpetrator of the problem. The black community needs to acknowledge the issue and shoulder some of the blame as well instead of trying to ride on the coattails of injustices due to slavery. It's a real big mess which may not even be fixable in time to avert a civil racial war.

Saying the problem is wanting peace in the world and for there to be love between people?

That is the problem...

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan



....so when you talk "black on black crime", just remember: that is exactly how Uncle Sam wants it. And he spent a ton of money making it happen. And by "money" i mean "tax dollars". You know, the same tax dollars that people sit around bitching about being given away for free housing? LOL, Uncle Sam is slick as hell, killing 2 birds with 1 stone that way. Using tax dollars to pigeonhole an entire race (without the need for Jim Crow) while at the same time fomenting racial tension over that "free housing".

Ok lets say you are right. Then why are these protests against the police? Where are the protests against the current leaders of uncle Sam, you know, people like Obama and Lynch? Why don't we hear how their racists policies are intentionally killing the black community?

Why aren't these protestors screaming when Obama discusses these issues shouting him down as a racists that is continiung policies to purposefully killing black people?

a reply to: Grambler

I can imagine that after 4 or 5 generations of being shuffled into ghettos and being forced to live with the lowest common denominator of mankind, opportunities to really exercise your brainpower begin to become harder to come by.

I can also imagine that trying to educate people in these areas, when its property taxes supporting education, becomes increasingly difficult to the point of impossible.

So asking why people in desperate and miserable situations, who were likely not provided the education the rest of us enjoyed (for all that its really worth) seems to have obvious answers.

ETA: i should add, however, that LEO are the enforcement arm of government. If you want to lash out against government, LEO seems like a good place to start. Its where the rubber meets the road. Its not like they have much access to our elected leaders, afterall.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

We do it for guys like these.



And what they've been willing to do over the course of the centuries to keep this country for us going all the way back to the first ones who took up arms and fought the Revolution.

a reply to: Nucleardoom

The blame on "the black community" seems to be pretty small.

They were a people released from slavery purely out of political expediency. No real plan was given to integration, and their former slavemasters (who already resented having to free them) found themselves under the bootheel of reconstruction and blaming the slaves for it. From this....we end up with Jim Crow. And that is the broken leg that hobbled "the black community" right out of the starting gate.

Sure, we can find disdain for them not limping along faster. But i suppose hope begins to wane as hunger sets in.

a reply to: ketsuko

If im being honest, our soldiers have always been mostly duped into promoting corporate agenda. Maybe WWII vets and what they did for freedom in Europe....but that's just us swooping in to steal the spoils of war after Europe had already obliterated itself.

I have to think pretty hard to find a "just" war. And im not left with much after 1800.

That isn't to denigrate the service of our soldiers. THey believed they were fighting the good fight, and their service is honorable. But if i am to be consistent with myself and my other thoughts, I have to admit that Smedley Butler pretty much laid it out there. And the events in Libya and Egypt only cement that position in my mind.