Ahmad Khan Rahami wanted in connection to NYC bombings

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: UKTruth

Trump said that we're letting in people as immigrants that are dangerous ... either because they're rapists, drug dealers and/or terrorists.

Yes or no? Is that the reason for "extreme vetting" or not?

Is his solution to deal with terrorists "waterboarding and worse" or not?

You don't have to like what your man says, but don't misrepresent something we all know to be true.

Post the link that shows Trump saying he wants to waterboard immigrants as part of vetting.
Put up or shut up.

Why don't you post the one where he clarifies that's not what he wants to do?

I mean, he must have said it very clearly, if the two things are separate in his mind, right?

Are you saying Trump has not stated, clearly, that immigration is used to send terrorists, rapists, drug dealers, etc. here?

Are you saying that Trump has not stated, clearly, what he's wiling to do to keep us safe from terrorists?

You do the math.

Ha, so you make a claim on something Trump has never said and think that I have to prove he didn't really mean to say what YOU think! Brilliant.

Trump has said, clearly (and quoted here) that immigration is a national security issue.

Trump has said, clearly that he's glad to use waterboarding and worse in matters of national security.

Trump has made it clear that he views immigration as the source of one of the greatest dangers to our national security: terrorism.

It's not rocket science.

a reply to: Flavian

10th and 13 th century - yes back then Islam was leading in science.

Since then it went all down hill. I mean the Nigerian group "Boko haram" means literally "education is sin". The only kind of education going on is teaching of the Q'ran.

Yes, different schools, different regions, moderates vs extremists and all that.
But: can you name any scientist from a muslim region?
An university from a muslim region which has produced anything in the last decades?
Any inventions apart from IEDs and mortars made from camping gas kegs? (fair enough, that s some McGyver stuff).

Everything slightly remembering of culture, science is utterly destroyed by ISIS. They don t care about anything else than their death cult.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
It's not rocket science.

No, because rocket science actually works.

Whereas what you're doing is throwing three subjects together and linking them in any order that satisfies you.

1) Trump has proposed harsher screening for immigrants. He has no idea how he'd go about it, but that's what he's proposed.

2) He has said that terrorists infiltrate the country as refugees. That might or might not be true, I'm not sure what example he might have in mind. The same thing has been a concern in Europe for a couple of years now.

3) Lastly, Trump has said that he'd use waterboarding on terrorists. I'm not going to comment on the ethics of that, since it's not relevant here, but that isn't fundamentally different from what Bush II did.

These are three separate but intertwined concepts. But together they do not support the proposition that Trump wants to screen immigrants by waterboarding them. That's just silly talk.

Apologies for butting in here, it's just that this thread has got bogged down in a boring circular non-debate based entirely on misunderstandings.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
Trump has said, clearly (and quoted here) that immigration is a national security issue.

Trump has said, clearly that he's glad to use waterboarding and worse in matters of national security.

Trump has made it clear that he views immigration as the source of one of the greatest dangers to our national security: terrorism.

It's not rocket science.

Ah, 1+1=3. That old trick.
Trump has never said that he would use waterboarding or worse on anyone but terrorists, and certainly not as part of immigration screening.
The onus is on you to prove your claim that Trump will use waterboarding and worse as part of his screening tests, which you simply have not done. Mental gymnastics and speculation is worth nothing.
Your claim is absurd.

originally posted by: Flavian
a reply to: poncho1982

I really don't want to accuse you of pushing an agenda or anything - everything media related is tainted by Islamophobia these days.

But if you want a real picture of Islam, look no further than the El Geniza Synagogue in Cairo and the records found there. When "discovered", it contained hundreds of thousands of records of life and daily interactions under the Fatimid Caliphates between the 10th and 13th Centuries, as well as having records dating back far earlier including an original Hebrew text of of the Book of Wisdom by Ben Sira that became Ecclisiastics in the Bible. This period was during the Crusades and yet still paints a life of tolerance and education.

Bottom line, Islam has always been a tolerant religion. A few crazy Imams does not change that. Yes, Islam has problems but this narrative of saying Islam is not tolerant is so far from the truth it is unreal.

You speak as if I don't know about islam.

But alas, I do. Too much in fact.

If you want to look at it through rose colored glasses, that's your choice.

Today is radically different than the 10th-13th centuries.

Key word RADICALLY.

originally posted by: svetlana84
a reply to: Flavian


Yes, different schools, different regions, moderates vs extremists and all that.
But: can you name any scientist from a muslim region?
An university from a muslim region which has produced anything in the last decades?
Any inventions apart from IEDs and mortars made from camping gas kegs? (fair enough, that s some McGyver stuff).

Everything slightly remembering of culture, science is utterly destroyed by ISIS. They don t care about anything else than their death cult.

Ahmed Zewail the Nobel winning Chemist? Omar Yaghi at Berkeley? How about Kerim Kerimov? (he only founded the Soviet Space Programme so probably doesn't count for you all) or then there is Mohammad Salam (Theoretical Physicist and Nobel Winner). I could go on here but i am sure you get the picture........

Saying ISIS or Boko Haram represent Islam is exactly like saying the Westboro Baptists represent Christianity. The reality is all those groups represent only a tiny fraction of their respected religions, warped into something else entirely.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
Trump has made it clear that he views immigration as the source of one of the greatest dangers to our national security: terrorism.

Just how many people in a day, on average, die from terrorism on American soil?

originally posted by: LordAhriman

originally posted by: Gryphon66
Trump has made it clear that he views immigration as the source of one of the greatest dangers to our national security: terrorism.

Just how many people in a day, on average, die from terrorism on American soil?

Differing Statistics and definitions would provide different answers, but in general for the last few years after 2001, the answer seems to be "far less than one" per day, and that's worldwide, not just in the US.

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