Safe School program gays lesbians transgenders bullied

a reply to: jonnywhite

It has nothing to do with conservative right, it has to do with common sense. You're further marking that which is already marked. If you ask for a safe cell in prison you will be marked a bitch worthy of hard abuse when you are released from the "safe space". It's an amplification of the abuse, not a solution.

The problem is cultural, not social. Making it a social issue to be dealt with in a school setting makes no sense.

originally posted by: pl3bscheese
a reply to: jonnywhite

It has nothing to do with conservative right, it has to do with common sense. You're further marking that which is already marked. If you ask for a safe cell in prison you will be marked a bitch worthy of hard abuse when you are released from the "safe space". It's an amplification of the abuse, not a solution.

You highlight for me this isn't about LGBTZ. It's about bullying and the bullied. How does bullying happen? This is where the meat is. Bullies find the vulnerable and they bully. The vulnerable are vulnerable and usually stay that way, unless they figure out how to not be. Either way, focusing only on LGBTZ will be ineffective.

www.latimes.com - Bullying does more long-term mental health harm than abuse, study says ...

The long-term effects of being bullied by other kids are worse than being abused by an adult, new research shows.

Previous studies have shown that children who are abused by adults or victimized by their peers grow up to suffer higher rates of depression, anxiety and suicidal ideation, among other problems. Both are bad, but the researchers wanted to know which was worse.

originally posted by: pl3bscheese
POST REMOVED BY STAFF

I only mentioned the consevative right offhand as being one of those groups who would be especially picky about whatever programs are created to counter LGBTZ being bullied . Then you said any "save places" or further marking are just going to make the bullying worse. All you did was remind me bullying is the central issue.

It's likely any progress to deter LGBTZ being bullied will also deter other bullying. So it's potentially win-win. But it's thorny and I still believe since 94% of the population isn't LGBTZ, it has to be navigated cautiously.

I understand children need to experience some adversity to prepare for being a young adult and entering the real world. A lot of posters are making that argument to support doing essentially nothing. The problem? Studies show how damaging bullying is. I linked it above in my prior post. So doing nothing is hard to do when we're presented with painful reality. It's like leaving a homeless person outside on a cold winter night. It's legal, but it's not easy. And these're childrne, not adults. We have instincts--above and beyond--to protect them. I only hope we don't go too far.

a reply to: Annee

Actually, yes.

Have you no idea what it's like to be a gifted child or have you never had one in your family you had to end up being an advocate for?

When you are above average intelligence and that manifests, the adults around you tend to get very upset and take it out on you (i.e. bully you). I had teachers who bullied me, counselors who would take me into the office and ask me what I was doing wrong ("Why don't they like you?), and administration who would simply refuse to do anything about it because smart kids aren't a problem.

So you really have no clue at all. And it is bullying. It IS the same. You say gay kids can't help it? Well smart kids can't either.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Annee

Actually, yes.

Have you no idea what it's like to be a gifted child or have you never had one in your family you had to end up being an advocate for?

My family? The "useless geniuses". Brilliant minds who can't seem to apply it to everyday living. Seems we have an inherited type of Autism Spectrum. The thinker/philosopher who'd rather drive a bus. My brother was reading the newspaper at age 4. Public school pushed him aside to learn on his own. Private schools at that time rejected him because he would be a distraction. He turned to drugs and alcohol.

No idea what you're talking about

a reply to: Teikiatsu
I disagree, bullying I damaging to victims, its not an island with a bunch of feral children, its a school where abusing your fellow human being should come with strict penalties. That would teach children the kind of demeanour they need in life.

originally posted by: WilsonWilson
a reply to: Teikiatsu
I disagree, bullying I damaging to victims, its not an island with a bunch of feral children, its a school where abusing your fellow human being should come with strict penalties. That would teach children the kind of demeanour they need in life.

There are safe schools in America.

While designed for LGBT, any child who is being bullied can apply.

They are not exclusive to LGBT.

originally posted by: WilsonWilson
a reply to: Teikiatsu
I disagree, bullying I damaging to victims,

It can be, yes.

its not an island with a bunch of feral children,

No, but that is a bunch of hyperbole.

its a school where abusing your fellow human being should come with strict penalties.

Who said a school should let bullies go without penalties? I do take issue with 'strict' though. Sounds like bullying. Probably makes them carry a grudge and want to bully someone even worse in a way they won't get caught.

That would teach children the kind of demeanour they need in life.

Do unto others as you want done unto you. It's an easy lesson. Doesn't need a program.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: WilsonWilson
a reply to: Teikiatsu
I disagree, bullying I damaging to victims, its not an island with a bunch of feral children, its a school where abusing your fellow human being should come with strict penalties. That would teach children the kind of demeanour they need in life.

There are safe schools in America.

While designed for LGBT, any child who is being bullied can apply.

They are not exclusive to LGBT.

Yeah but I'm pretty sure most kids aren't thinking going to 'gay school' is the solution to them being bullied. No offense meant, but that's what teenage me would have thought in that situation.

originally posted by: BelowLowAnnouncement

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: WilsonWilson
a reply to: Teikiatsu
I disagree, bullying I damaging to victims, its not an island with a bunch of feral children, its a school where abusing your fellow human being should come with strict penalties. That would teach children the kind of demeanour they need in life.

There are safe schools in America.

While designed for LGBT, any child who is being bullied can apply.

They are not exclusive to LGBT.

Yeah but I'm pretty sure most kids aren't thinking going to 'gay school' is the solution to them being bullied. No offense meant, but that's what teenage me would have thought in that situation.

I went to school in the 50s/60s when people in general thought bullying was a normal right of passage. Pure ignorance.

IT SUCKED THEN and it still SUCKS.

Got my girls through it without any problem.

My granddaughter took a lot more effort, but now she's strong and self confident.

What person in their right mind would think LGBT teens welcome such abuse? Often from the teachers and other school authorities.

In recent years we've had straight kids bonding with LGBT kids against teachers, principles, coaches, administrators, school districts, and even entire states.

a reply to: Annee

Oh, then I guess you just forgot about that when you wrote you first extremely thoughtless reply then.

a reply to: Annee

Who say LGBT teens welcome it, but why are they the only ones who need special treatment and programs to survive it?

Why are they the only kids whose bullying needs special treatment and rights beyond the bullying other kids receive? Is that bullying somehow less or something?

a reply to: jonnywhite

Again, you really don't understand any of this. Why was my post flagged and removed? This is stupid. I'm showing your how the "solution" is in fact more of a problem, and you're using some weird reasoning where you say doing nothing is worse than doing something, when in fact that something is actually what is worse than nothing. It makes no sense.

You don't do just anything because doing nothing hurts people... it's just dumb. You find out not only what is actually occurring, but WHY it is. Saying that it happens because there's victims, and that the solution is segregation... so what do you think about integrated schools. Are we supposed to go back 60 years and erase the civil rights movement or something?

I honestly have no clue how to properly respond to you. The way you're taking in information baffles me.

a reply to: ketsuko

You know the answer. It's lobbying and organization by minorities, for minorities.

Watch the news, see the cycles of things to fear, and note that the things to promote shuffles as well. One cause to the next, for the last however long, one of them has been LGBT.

No focus, all happening at once, a few to pick out of a bag.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Annee

Oh, then I guess you just forgot about that when you wrote you first extremely thoughtless reply then.

Thoughtless? You're calling facts thoughtless?

Let's look at your ARROGANT post I responded to - - with FACTS.

YOUR POST: Have you no idea what it's like to be a gifted child or have you never had one in your family you had to end up being an advocate for? When you are above average intelligence and that manifests, the adults around you tend to get very upset and take it out on you (i.e. bully you). I had teachers who bullied me, counselors who would take me into the office and ask me what I was doing wrong ("Why don't they like you?), and administration who would simply refuse to do anything about it because smart kids aren't a problem. So you really have no clue at all. And it is bullying. It IS the same. You say gay kids can't help it? Well smart kids can't either.

MY POST: (100% factual): My family? The "useless geniuses". Brilliant minds who can't seem to apply it to everyday living. Seems we have an inherited type of Autism Spectrum. The thinker/philosopher who'd rather drive a bus. My brother was reading the newspaper at age 4. Public school pushed him aside to learn on his own. Private schools at that time rejected him because he would be a distraction. He turned to drugs and alcohol.

NOTE: And YES, I got called into the office on a regular basis. The lecture: "You are way too smart to be lazy, your IQ is in the top 3% of the state, you should be a leader to the other kids, not day dreaming in class, blah, blah, blah, blah.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Annee

Who say LGBT teens welcome it, but why are they the only ones who need special treatment and programs to survive it?

Why are they the only kids whose bullying needs special treatment and rights beyond the bullying other kids receive? Is that bullying somehow less or something?

Reading comprehension? Thought you were smart.

The "Safe Schools" are open to all students who wish to apply.

As I stated.

originally posted by: ketsuko

... why are they the only ones who need special treatment and programs to survive it?

Why are they the only kids whose bullying needs special treatment and rights beyond the bullying other kids receive? Is that bullying somehow less or something?

You are sorely mistaken if you think LGBT kids aren't at higher risk than those that are not. Try taking off your blinders or doing a little research once and a while.



Queer Teens Face A Shocking Amount of Violence and Discrimination

This population is at a high risk for psychiatric comorbidities and life-threatening behaviors. Research shows that this group is more likely to experience shame, discrimination, family disapproval and social rejection compared to straight peers.

(excludes transgender kids - those numbers are worse)

From the CDC: LGBT Youth

Sexual Identity, Sex of Sexual Contacts, and Health-Related Behaviors Among Students in Grades 9–12 — United States and Selected Sites, 2015

Statistics You Should Know About Gay & Transgender Students

I can only speak for the T in LGB() but as someone subject to bullying, harassment, ostracization, and humiliation from students and even a few teachers throughout my school years, let me tell you how bad it sucked. I won't even mention the acts of extreme homo/transphobic physical violence I experienced as I've documented them here before.

LGBT kids aren't special snowflakes but they are particular targets and this crap needs to stop. Education is the key to that.

Try looking up some of your own local schools online. I just did and even in my conservative red state, LGBT bullying is specifically called out as a problem and is not acceptable. It is still going to happen though and if special programs or curricula are needed to deal with it, then so be it. It's about damn time.

a reply to: Freija

Did you really miss her point entirely? Is this thread for double digit IQ only?

Man what happened to ATS? This is ridiculous.

What happens when we're all in our special boxes and all free to be segregated and safe. I mean wow this is some sort of dystopia you people are rooting for here.

originally posted by: pl3bscheese
a reply to: Freija

Did you really miss her point entirely? Is this thread for double digit IQ only?

You care to explain exactly what point is being missed?