The Conspiracy of the Religious Elite

a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

what, is truth to hard for you to understand?

there are 66 books in our bible. and if you disagree with Paul you need to eliminate 13-15 books. Paul was alive during Christ earthly ministry, I have no doubt he saw Christ and heard him teach, but because of the teachers he had he did not believe until that faithful day when Jesus Knocked off his high horse, and later taught him. Remember he got his gospel and the teaching from Christ, for he conferred not with flesh and blood but went into the wilderness and conferred with Christ alone and returned and spent 3 years in Damascus before ever going to Jerusalem.

No, you are in error on Paul's teaching, if you compare PROPERLY, you will see Paul's teaching do not disagree with God's teaching. What you fail to see is the influence of the Christian religious Elite is the blending of teachings for different groups that you have accepted. the failure to rightly divide which is the most rejected and non-used instruction will only lead to wrongly joining or blending scriptures.

Until you break free of the Religious elite influence and their mindset on the Bible, you will only eliminate more and more of the bible until you very little left, and it will not instruct you to salvation by Christ Cross alone but to works only and no one can be saved by works alone in this age.

It is because of the Religious elite influence on Christianity today that your teachers have the conclusions of Paul's teachings being in error. But in fact it is the Religious Elites influence and teachings that are in error and not Paul's.

A little leaven leavens the whole lump. These people have been at this since 315AD. they have 350 plus perverted Bibles out there to perpetuate the confusion and as long as they confuse they can control, and all for filthy Lucre. it is the enemies way to keep men from simplicity that is in Christ Jesus.

Jesus is the salvation of men both Jesus taught this and so did Paul. Jesus was also the king of the Jews for the promised kingdom, that was his first and foremost ministry. When the Jews fully rejected the persons of the Godhead, the father in the OT, Jesus in the gospels and the Holy Ghost at Acts Chapter 7. That i s hen a change took place and the Jews and their kingdom was set aside and the Gospel of the Grace of God in introduced for all men alike.

You say your read it but you don't believe it. If you have the Holy Ghost then you should have believed this is proof you don't have the Holy Ghost because you don't believe the whole of God's word. Even if you know, as I do you cant understand it all you still will believe it all to be true.

a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

Please they do not get their justification from Paul's writings directly they get them by twisting Paul's words. And that is something totally different from what is truly taught. Peter called it private interpretation and they twist it to their own destruction.

If you get a hold of the preserved word and read it for as many years as I have, you begin to use God's divine cross-references system and you will see how Paul's teachings agree with much of the OT and with the Gospels. The only difference is, Paul knows he is dealing with a different Gospel and time period because the Jews rejected Christ and the fullness of God before he was called, and that he was sent to take the gospel of Grace to the Gentiles. But he never gave up on trying to reach the Jews.

I have read my preserved Bible through over 100 times since 2005, and the NT at least 300 times since that time when I finally found the Bible that was a fulfillment of God promise to preserve his words to all generations forever. I do have a doctorate in theology from a well known Bible college, I was a missionary for over 15 years in a foreign country among Catholics and Muslims. I know my Bible and I believe it, ALL of it.

What it takes is faith in God alone.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

ChesterJohn....I see in you s good, dedicated man. That's honorable I'll reply more tomorrow.

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

Please they do not get their justification from Paul's writings directly they get them by twisting Paul's words. And that is something totally different from what is truly taught. Peter called it private interpretation and they twist it to their own destruction.

If you get a hold of the preserved word and read it for as many years as I have, you begin to use God's divine cross-references system and you will see how Paul's teachings agree with much of the OT and with the Gospels. The only difference is, Paul knows he is dealing with a different Gospel and time period because the Jews rejected Christ and the fullness of God before he was called, and that he was sent to take the gospel of Grace to the Gentiles. But he never gave up on trying to reach the Jews.

I have read my preserved Bible through over 100 times since 2005, and the NT at least 300 times since that time when I finally found the Bible that was a fulfillment of God promise to preserve his words to all generations forever. I do have a doctorate in theology from a well known Bible college, I was a missionary for over 15 years in a foreign country among Catholics and Muslims. I know my Bible and I believe it, ALL of it.

What it takes is faith in God alone.

Ok, Chester...I'm going to make a suggestion to you. First, read Romans 3:9 (the whole thing)..then go "cross reference" where Paul took that from. (that would be Psalm 14). Then, read Psalm 14 in it's CONTEXT. Hint...the first verse say's "the FOOL has said in his heart there is no God". Then, read the rest of that Psalm and see if there is an actual comparison between those who God is WITH (meaning the righteous)..and those who God is NOT with (meaning the fool who says there is no God).
Then, ponder to yourself, WHY would Paul leave out that most important first verse...except that maybe he needed to use that Psalm (out of context) to say that EVERYONE was unrighteous...yea, EVERYONE.
Then, when you're done with that, go do your "cross referencing" on ALL of Paul's goobly gop, and see how many times he does the same thing when referring to the OT. He twists it, contorts it, and basically uses it out of context, to sell his doctrine.
I hope to God you can figure it out.


Oh, and the only "twisting" done, is by Paul himself...and he flips it right back around on everyone else, who even TRIES to see through his charade.

a reply to: Matrixsurvivor
Paul did not leave anything out. The Holy Ghost can do with his words that which he want for it is his words not Paul's. So when he inspired Paul to write to them he chose to use just that portion. It is called "rightly dividing. They Holy Ghost commands that of us and he does it as well.

The problem is no one believes God inspired the Bible to be written as it is. They believe it is just written by men and is a fairy tail.

But if your reject one part you reject it all.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

The problem is no one believes God inspired the Bible to be written as it is. They believe it is just written by men and is a fairy tail.

But if your reject one part you reject it all.

So IF one rejects the ridiculous stories that we know are not real... we must also reject Jesus

What a load of utter tripe...

Complete nonsense

Good job Chester

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
a reply to: Matrixsurvivor
Paul did not leave anything out. The Holy Ghost can do with his words that which he want for it is his words not Paul's. So when he inspired Paul to write to them he chose to use just that portion. It is called "rightly dividing. They Holy Ghost commands that of us and he does it as well.

The problem is no one believes God inspired the Bible to be written as it is. They believe it is just written by men and is a fairy tail.

But if your reject one part you reject it all.

Then, the Bible is your God. Not God.

a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

No, Jesus is my God.
God's word says this.

Psalms 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

If God has given more importance to his word than his or Jesus name, then it is my duty to give greater importance to his word.

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

No, Jesus is my God.
God's word says this.

Psalms 138:2 I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.

If God has given more importance to his word than his or Jesus name, then it is my duty to give greater importance to his word.

OR...you could walk out on your back porch and just talk to Him, wait for an answer, and if it doesn't line up with scripture...then what? Do you honestly think He can't speak to you outside of "his WORD"
You are limiting Him, then. He's not in a box, Chester. Not even a "book box".

a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

I talk to him no only on my porch but in my car, on my bed in the bathroom, while walking, while painting, just about every where, doing anything.

The Book, his words let me judge people and beings by what they say whether they be of God or the Devil. Not only that it gives me great comfort to see how he was in the past and in that I know he can hold mine and your future.

It is called faith in God's word.

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

I talk to him no only on my porch but in my car, on my bed in the bathroom, while walking, while painting, just about every where, doing anything.

The Book, his words let me judge people and beings by what they say whether they be of God or the Devil. Not only that it gives me great comfort to see how he was in the past and in that I know he can hold mine and your future.

It is called faith in God's word.

I'm happy for you.
I didn't get saved by "God's word". I got saved by reading a C.S. Lewis book and asking to know Jesus afterwards. I didn't even repent. I just asked. What happened afterwards blew me away. I read the Bible constantly afterwards. I woke up at 5 am to dig into it. But, I was only drawn (mostly) to the Psalms and the gospels. Paul irritated the crap out of me.
I didn't get too much into the Torah. I did read it, but not indepth. Wasn't drawn to it.
I also read much of the prophets.
So, your experience and mine or different. I also had "issues" that God helped me with...much like your own.
I just see God as so much bigger than the box religion or the Bible puts Him in. Anything that can create galaxies times infinity, doesn't need an animal sacrifice or would exclude those who have infirmities. Just look up at the stars. Do you really think a God that can do all that needs blood to satiate His wrath?
Not me. That's not the God I've experienced.
Like I've said in other threads....I think there are many voices in the Bible. Some good, some evil.

a reply to: Matrixsurvivor
In this age repentance is not required for salvation only trust in the finished work of the cross of Christ.

Paul's writings are to the body of Christ today in this age, maybe what you need to do is ask God to reveal why the writings to the body of Christ irritated you so much?

I had problems at first on how to reconcile the writings of Paul to the Body of Christ with the gospels, Hebrew through Revelation. and the Law in the OT. I struggled and struggles and two things came to mind, 1) the just shall live by faith, and study to show thyself approved unto God, a worker who need not be afraid, rightly Dividing the word of Truth. So I sought how to rightly divide and that is when things started to come together.

The heavens show his handiwork and testify of the power of God.

Only the Jews were ever required to have a sacrifice to come to God. Today ALL men come to God through the blood of Christ Alone this is the simplicity that is in Christ.

The preserved word of God, the Holy Bible are the words of God. There is both good and evil in the bible we must divide them and see how it applies.

a reply to: one4all

Your rligous zealousy is what is dangerous,if your religous associates helped you get what you have,it wasnt the Lord boyo it was your gang......dont assume your religous privilage will last forever.....things are changing fast. You seem pretty materialistic.......I bet your God also fogives you for indulging in that which billions of others may never know???....lol.....ooops I forgot you likely buy your way out of that one with a few bucks of charitable afterthought and a hail mary or a confession or two......lol. You are only welcome to your uncontested religous idealisms until you begin using them to self-justify pushing people around and then you become a zealot and a focus of societal dischord.

And why do you judge a man for what his Father has given him?> He was simply testifying and given all of the glory to The Most High who gives and takes. One day all that God has given will be taken and then ten fold given forever. Why is it so wrong to give the glory to the one who gives?

the thread has really drifted form the fact of the OP that the Christian religious Elite of our day have created their own society and if you are not part of it, going to their schools, learning dead languages and professing to know them well enough to understand what some said thousands of years ago, have degrees from their schools.

You are not welcomed to pastors in 99% of the churches of any given denomination today.

They have turned the calling of God in to a system to make filthy lucre and we must remember that Money is the root of ALL evil in this world of men.

a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

Then, when you're done with that, go do your "cross referencing" on ALL of Paul's goobly gop, and see how many times he does the same thing when referring to the OT. He twists it, contorts it, and basically uses it out of context, to sell his doctrine.

Such as? Even though this was not directed to me you did paste into an open forum and after reading left me not understanding your point other than more Saul/Paul bashing. Could you please give all of this so called goobly gop and show me those many times that Paul twists, contorts and uses scripture out of context? Also where can I find the professed doctrine of Paul that you have many times declared?

Rom 3:9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;

Psalm 14:1-7
[1] To the chief Musician, A Psalm of David. The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
[2] The LORD looked down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any that did understand, and seek God.
[3] They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one.
[4] Have all the workers of iniquity no knowledge? who eat up my people as they eat bread, and call not upon the LORD.
[5] There were they in great fear: for God is in the generation of the righteous.
[6] Ye have shamed the counsel of the poor, because the LORD is his refuge.
[7] Oh that the salvation of Israel were come out of Zion! when the LORD bringeth back the captivity of his people, Jacob shall rejoice, and Israel shall be glad.

I see no conflict in this comparison whatsoever. There are two distinct covenants here. One of law and one of grace. The Psalm era was one of law while Paul's is of grace.

Now if you read 1Corinthians 12:13 it would explain Romans 3:9 very well

1st Corinthians 12:13 -
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Put the two sources together and you read ---------------------

Quote
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;
Unquote

The above are the words rightly divided by several different authors.

Perhaps the Holy Spirit has not taught you to divide the words of truth.

a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

See what you fail to see that is God is preserving his words and that he has the right to inspire Paul using his words as he feels fit for a teaching under the gospel of the grace of God.

Because of the lack of any man who knows even how to correctly translate Hebrew spoken over 2000 years ago, as well as what God truly meant. So God preserved it and gives inspiration to Paul for today under the gospel of the grace of God.

Does that make it incorrect that David said it differently for Israel?

NO of course not.

Again it is your lack of faith in God being powerful enough to preserve his words to us today.

God has the right to do with his word as he wishes and no man can say anything to him about it.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

See what you fail to see that is God is preserving his words and that he has the right to inspire Paul using his words as he feels fit for a teaching under the gospel of the grace of God.

There is NOT A GOSPEL OF THE GRACE OF GOD. Find that in what Jesus taught....seriously, use the words of the savior you profess.

Because of the lack of any man who knows even how to correctly translate Hebrew spoken over 2000 years ago, as well as what God truly meant. So God preserved it and gives inspiration to Paul for today under the gospel of the grace of God.

Once again, you keep touting Paul....how bout you promote your SAVIOR? That would be Jesus...right??

Again it is your lack of faith in God being powerful enough to preserve his words to us today.

Um, ok...so he's so powerful that the only thing he seems truly concerned about is PRESERVING HIS WORD....never mind all the atrocities that are committed daily, or the children starving to death, or the millions of animals slaughtered, or the people who cry out daily for SOME KIND OF ANSWER FROM HIM...and they get zip.
Yea, I guess WORDS are more important than people, Chester.

God has the right to do with his word as he wishes and no man can say anything to him about it.

I just did.

originally posted by: Seede
a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

Then, when you're done with that, go do your "cross referencing" on ALL of Paul's goobly gop, and see how many times he does the same thing when referring to the OT. He twists it, contorts it, and basically uses it out of context, to sell his doctrine.

Such as? Even though this was not directed to me you did paste into an open forum and after reading left me not understanding your point other than more Saul/Paul bashing. Could you please give all of this so called goobly gop and show me those many times that Paul twists, contorts and uses scripture out of context? Also where can I find the professed doctrine of Paul that you have many times declared?

Rom 3:9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;

Psalm 14:1-7
[1] To the chief Musician, A Psalm of David. The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
[2] The LORD looked down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any that did understand, and seek God.
[3] They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one.
[4] Have all the workers of iniquity no knowledge? who eat up my people as they eat bread, and call not upon the LORD.
[5] There were they in great fear: for God is in the generation of the righteous.
[6] Ye have shamed the counsel of the poor, because the LORD is his refuge.
[7] Oh that the salvation of Israel were come out of Zion! when the LORD bringeth back the captivity of his people, Jacob shall rejoice, and Israel shall be glad.

I see no conflict in this comparison whatsoever. There are two distinct covenants here. One of law and one of grace. The Psalm era was one of law while Paul's is of grace.

Now if you read 1Corinthians 12:13 it would explain Romans 3:9 very well

1st Corinthians 12:13 -
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Put the two sources together and you read ---------------------

Quote
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;
Unquote

The above are the words rightly divided by several different authors.

Perhaps the Holy Spirit has not taught you to divide the words of truth.

There was NO "grace era"...that was all Paul's made up BS. Jesus HIMSELF never taught that. You ALL lean on Paul.
Tell you what...quote your "Savior"...just Him. Not Paul. See what you come up with.

originally posted by: Seede
a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

Then, when you're done with that, go do your "cross referencing" on ALL of Paul's goobly gop, and see how many times he does the same thing when referring to the OT. He twists it, contorts it, and basically uses it out of context, to sell his doctrine.

Such as? Even though this was not directed to me you did paste into an open forum and after reading left me not understanding your point other than more Saul/Paul bashing. Could you please give all of this so called goobly gop and show me those many times that Paul twists, contorts and uses scripture out of context? Also where can I find the professed doctrine of Paul that you have many times declared?

Rom 3:9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;

Psalm 14:1-7
[1] To the chief Musician, A Psalm of David. The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
[2] The LORD looked down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any that did understand, and seek God.
[3] They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one.
[4] Have all the workers of iniquity no knowledge? who eat up my people as they eat bread, and call not upon the LORD.
[5] There were they in great fear: for God is in the generation of the righteous.
[6] Ye have shamed the counsel of the poor, because the LORD is his refuge.
[7] Oh that the salvation of Israel were come out of Zion! when the LORD bringeth back the captivity of his people, Jacob shall rejoice, and Israel shall be glad.

I see no conflict in this comparison whatsoever. There are two distinct covenants here. One of law and one of grace. The Psalm era was one of law while Paul's is of grace.

Now if you read 1Corinthians 12:13 it would explain Romans 3:9 very well

1st Corinthians 12:13 -
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Put the two sources together and you read ---------------------

Quote
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;
Unquote

The above are the words rightly divided by several different authors.

Perhaps the Holy Spirit has not taught you to divide the words of truth.

The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.

who eat up my people as they eat bread, and call not upon the LORD.

So WHO is the contrast here?? The "fool" and the one's that "call upon the Lord"... You can't include Paul in that. He hadn't even been born, nor thought of yet. So, this Psalm is distinguishing between the "fool" and the "righteous who call upon the Lord". It wasn't even remotely about every human ever born on the planet....as Paul makes it into.
NO. God is speaking through David in this Psalm, about the one who say's "there is no God...and is a fool", and those who ALREADY believe in God and trust Him...and are called the RIGHTEOUS.
Get around that, without using Paul, Seede.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

I had problems at first on how to reconcile the writings of Paul to the Body of Christ with the gospels, Hebrew through Revelation. and the Law in the OT. I struggled and struggles and two things came to mind, 1) the just shall live by faith, and study to show thyself approved unto God, a worker who need not be afraid, rightly Dividing the word of Truth. So I sought how to rightly divide and that is when things started to come together.

No...what you did was what 99 percent of what most Christians do....stop listening to the HS and instead listen to pastors, books, or just trying to make the "Bible" fit together with a false apostle in it.
Do you know what I've realized? The Bible (the book) has spiritual power in it...some good, some evil. You can read it and sense it. Therein lies the problem...you don't really know which power you are listening to, unless you trust the Holy Spirit (which is the Ruach Qodesh) and is a feminine noun in the Hebrew. The HS is not MASCULINE....it's feminine. That
is exactly WHY the whole Bible has been built on a Patriarchal foundation. Can't have any of the feminine getting a word in there, now can you? Where do you think the "feminine" comes from, Chester? If "WE" are made in God's "image".....then, where do you think those feminine aspects derived?