Transhumanism and what it is to be human

I see a lot of arguments against transhumanism, but none of these anti-arguments are convincing me. What I have to oppose to these arguments against transhumanism is the following question : what is it that makes us human ?

What does it mean to be human, and who can tell with absolute certainty ? How do we know that we aren't just an intermediate creature ? We have always been changing, why should we believe that change should stop now ? Why do we somehow think that we have arrived at the end of evolution and that we are a finite product ? Where are the limits and who is wise/intelligent enough to tell everyone else where the limits should be ?

400.000 years ago, there was a guy named Urg and he tried to warn his nomad tribe of the dangers of fire, of how it would change everything, how it would make us so different that we wouldn't be able to recognize ourselves afterwards. He said that we had never used fire before, and that it was not wise to use fire. 10.000 years ago, there was another guy, named Ourk, and he warned everyone of the dangers of agriculture, saying that we shouldn't have anything to do with it, because we had never done things like that and that it would change us so much that we would not be able to recognize ourselves afterwards.

Are we creatures that must live on this planet forever, because it has always been this way and that must not change ? Are we creatures that must have a biological family(a father, a mother, and perhaps brothers and sisters) ? Can these things change, and even disappear, and is it a problem if we do it ourselves instead of letting mother nature do it for us ?

In fact, the only argument against transhumanism that has value in my eyes, is to say that "it took nature hundreds of millions of years to create this delicate balance and we are about to change it in the span of a few years. We don't know what we are doing and we can't foresee all the consequences". But haven't we already changed a lot of things with for example vaccines, medicine, agriculture, internet, and so on ? Ultimately, aren't we the expression of nature ? Aren't we here, haven't we evolved until this point in time, haven't we proved that we are wise enough to make our own choices, even if we have made many mistakes along the road ?

a reply to: gosseyn

People will choose to modify themselves, As long as those additions, subtractions, replacements or mutations aren't performed involuntarily, we stand to learn much from the initial brave pioneers of intermediate biology.

You can get a sex change but, don't make me get one or pay for yours and we're good.

originally posted by: gosseyn
In fact, the only argument against transhumanism that has value in my eyes, is to say that "it took nature hundreds of millions of years to create this delicate balance and we are about to change it in the span of a few years. We don't know what we are doing and we can't foresee all the consequences". But haven't we already changed a lot of things with for example vaccines, medicine, agriculture, internet, and so on ? Ultimately, aren't we the expression of nature ? Aren't we here, haven't we evolved until this point in time, haven't we proved that we are wise enough to make our own choices, even if we have made many mistakes along the road ?

"Transhumanism" isn't some singular thing, like stronger muscles. It is a complex that is part of a larger macro platform. The larger platform includes Artificial General Intelligence ("Skynet"), the Technological Singularity, crazy / wicked nanotechnology, and much more all intrinsically interrelated.

Perhaps the most important part to consider in terms the more transhumanism parts of the larger paradigm is the radical Life Extension technologies, which are promising indefinite lifespans.

This is a HUGE problem because not everybody will be able to live forever. You'd have to end new childbirths globally. This would mean literally ending the CYCLE OF LIFE.

And that's just one issue right on the surface.

The bigger issue with all of this stuff (MISSING in almost literally ALL transhumanist narratives) is the part about the REAL world we live in. The real world that is owned by the global power elites / "Patriarchy" / "New World Order" or whatever you want to call it / them.

When you look at the history of the entirely related world of Eugenics, and the endless case studies of elitist population control desires that you will find in those pages, along with said concepts having connections with this kind of stuff to "progressivism" all the way back to the beginnings of Eugenics... and now factor in this emerging reality where there's already "too many" people, and now the world is about to enter a new paradigm of humans living forever?

What would they do to stop the masses from also being able to participate? The answer is simple: TURN ON THE NEWS! At this stage in the game, in one way or another, basically everything to do with things arising from social engineering / engineered wars / economic warfare (against the masses) have something to do with this big picture. Between total social chaos mass diversions to keep everyone looking somewhere else, or in undermining us ALL in various ways to plunder our wealth, better control us, weaken us, destabilize us, enhance their power strangle hold... its all about the big game for this power structure.

It isn't even hard to see, you just need the right goggles and its glaring all around now.

See here for the data behind my reasonings, all well documented by me over a period of a decade:
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: gosseyn

if you can be chiped and/or hooked to a computer you can be programed on some real levels.

that being case your caveman analogy is moot.

try again

a reply to: gosseyn

I'll add that we haven't evolved socially enough to be ready for the big switch.

Maybe we would have by now if not for the countless overlapping generations of social engineering our masters have put us through.

But instead our latest generation, the one totally born in modern technology mind you, are becoming these socially divisive hyper-sensitive "Special Snowflakes" at an increasing rate, especially with social media tech. Them 'naturally' coupling with "SJW" philosophical mindsets (also enhanced by social media tech) is already creating total social meltdown at an alarmingly rapid onset and increasing rate right out the gates.

What we're seeing happen with social tech (social engineering + social media) should be the ultimate proof we aren't ready for it. Our global elite masters aren't ready to wield it faithfully, and we The Little People aren't evolved socially enough for it either.

If you want to be a Transhumanist and see the world survive the century, well as I've argued for years: First we need to stop the Power Elites. That should be priority one for everybody at this point.

You guys are confusing science&technology with the economic system that has led us to monstrous inequalities and pockets of concentrated power. Science&technology, or more simply technique, has been with us since the moment one of our very distant ancestors took a branch or a bone from the animal he just ate and used it as a tool. The question of transhumanism is a question that would have emerged in any other economic system. If the fruits of science&technology (automation, computerization, etc..) have not been distributed it is not the fault of science&technology. You can't blame the tv screen or the computer because it is used to spew propaganda. If today, with all the incredible possibilities that science&technology offer us, the big masses are still proletarians exploited and dispossessed of the fruits of their labour, it is not the fault of science&technology. If with every new scientific discovery, people are worried - with good reason - that it will be used against them, it is not the fault of science&technology.

There is a deeper problem here which I talk about in this thread www.abovetopsecret.com...

originally posted by: IgnoranceIsntBlisss

originally posted by: gosseyn
In fact, the only argument against transhumanism that has value in my eyes, is to say that "it took nature hundreds of millions of years to create this delicate balance and we are about to change it in the span of a few years. We don't know what we are doing and we can't foresee all the consequences". But haven't we already changed a lot of things with for example vaccines, medicine, agriculture, internet, and so on ? Ultimately, aren't we the expression of nature ? Aren't we here, haven't we evolved until this point in time, haven't we proved that we are wise enough to make our own choices, even if we have made many mistakes along the road ?

"Transhumanism" isn't some singular thing, like stronger muscles. It is a complex that is part of a larger macro platform. The larger platform includes Artificial General Intelligence ("Skynet"), the Technological Singularity, crazy / wicked nanotechnology, and much more all intrinsically interrelated.

Perhaps the most important part to consider in terms the more transhumanism parts of the larger paradigm is the radical Life Extension technologies, which are promising indefinite lifespans.

This is a HUGE problem because not everybody will be able to live forever. You'd have to end new childbirths globally. This would mean literally ending the CYCLE OF LIFE.

And that's just one issue right on the surface.

The bigger issue with all of this stuff (MISSING in almost literally ALL transhumanist narratives) is the part about the REAL world we live in. The real world that is owned by the global power elites / "Patriarchy" / "New World Order" or whatever you want to call it / them.

When you look at the history of the entirely related world of Eugenics, and the endless case studies of elitist population control desires that you will find in those pages, along with said concepts having connections with this kind of stuff to "progressivism" all the way back to the beginnings of Eugenics... and now factor in this emerging reality where there's already "too many" people, and now the world is about to enter a new paradigm of humans living forever?

What would they do to stop the masses from also being able to participate? The answer is simple: TURN ON THE NEWS! At this stage in the game, in one way or another, basically everything to do with things arising from social engineering / engineered wars / economic warfare (against the masses) have something to do with this big picture. Between total social chaos mass diversions to keep everyone looking somewhere else, or in undermining us ALL in various ways to plunder our wealth, better control us, weaken us, destabilize us, enhance their power strangle hold... its all about the big game for this power structure.

It isn't even hard to see, you just need the right goggles and its glaring all around now.

See here for the data behind my reasonings, all well documented by me over a period of a decade:
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

This right here is the main point that needs to be emphasized!!!

The technology can not be in the hands of the Eugenicists! And that is preciesly where it is to be found.

The are slowly conditioning the masses to be plugged into a virtual world and create a version of A Brave New world that will give them ultimate power. Through social engineering they are creating their version of the real world.

The top technology that is being rolled out is being done so in a way that we are tracked and categorized. Packaged into nice versions of materialistic slaves that will plug into that occulus so fast it will make peoples heads spin. Once they roll out the tech that can be plugged right into your brain and the matrix becomes real, we will find ourselves being used as batteries, not by machines but these "immortal" elite scum that are at the source of all the suffering in the world.

Thank you for sharing your post and links to your previous posts.

You have eloquently described my very real concerns with lunatics like Ray Kurzweil and the rest of the AI bunch that are owned by the disgusting eugenicists who have funded them!

originally posted by: gosseyn
...it is not the fault of science&technology. You can't blame the tv screen or the computer because it is used to spew propaganda. ...it is not the fault of science&technology. ...it is not the fault of science&technology.

I never said it was.

I said both in the "real world" (geo-power-politics), and socially our species isn't ready. It's nowhere near ready. WE haven't been evolving, only our ability to build better tools & tech has (because our tools & tech help us get better / more efficient at it).

If you look at my combined response, it tells the tale of what we are (combined) AS humans. And that is the ultimate crisis in this emerging face of emerging technologies.

It appears that the ancients wrote fables to warn of the dangers of misusing technology. Prometheus, Icarus, The Tower of Babel, 1 & 2Enoch and maybe even the Arc of the Covenant and the story of the Golden Calf.

Solomon's fabled Kingdom warns about the dangers of harnessing unknown power from "demonic sources" to assist you and that even if you have temporary control over the powers it may have unintended consequences and Solomon dies a babbling idiot who previously was the wisest man on earth.

All allegorical of course but the moral is if you are going to use new knowledge make damn sure you know how and what things could go wrong so they can be prevented.

And beware of approaching things you don't understand without caution.

From what I read and understood one of the main issues about transhumanism is the danger of losing the soul and the glorification of mind only. To TH soul does not matter and plays no role, the only thing that is important is mind and control of everything through mind, even emotions.

There are many websites about promoting and refusing TH and TH is said to be one of the biggest (future) dangers (other two are virtual reality and nanotechnology).

If you read (conspiracy) theories about machines attacking us in the future, you will probably stumble upon the reason for that- the machines are futuristic humanity who accepted TH, lost the soul and is trying to get it back. Check some Wes Penre papers if you want.

I'be been pondering about the TH issues for quite some times and it's really hard to set a healthy limit what helps and what not. As no other thing TH isn't just bad or good. It all depends on your perception and priorities. I am convinced that human mind, soul and body together are capable of doing things that we can hardly believe to be possible (check for example paranormal states as described in Patanjali's sutras) that would make most of known technology completely obsolete, while leaving complete freedom of every individual.

Bigger control is one of the main goals and dangers of TH and many people already described how technology changed from using "outside" gadgets (usables) to using wearables (like smart watches and other gadgets you put on your body to function) and now already into implants.

www.wareable.com...

wtvox.com...


So, while having pacemaker and artificial hand that can behave like natural hand doesn't seem bad, you can easily imagine all possible way more "advanced" products. Technology might help us and make many tasks easier, but will never solve basic human problems by itself. TH is a consequence of people being detached from themselves/their own soul and each other so an extent that they are unable to communicate with each other in a normal way. If you have e.g. emotional trauma, technology can make you virtual space in which you can feel better, but if you are not ready to dig inside yourself and you use technology to escape reality, nothing will improve.

originally posted by: gosseyn
You guys are confusing science&technology with the economic system that has led us to monstrous inequalities and pockets of concentrated power. Science&technology, or more simply technique, has been with us since the moment one of our very distant ancestors took a branch or a bone from the animal he just ate and used it as a tool. The question of transhumanism is a question that would have emerged in any other economic system. If the fruits of science&technology (automation, computerization, etc..) have not been distributed it is not the fault of science&technology. You can't blame the tv screen or the computer because it is used to spew propaganda. If today, with all the incredible possibilities that science&technology offer us, the big masses are still proletarians exploited and dispossessed of the fruits of their labour, it is not the fault of science&technology. If with every new scientific discovery, people are worried - with good reason - that it will be used against them, it is not the fault of science&technology.

There is a deeper problem here which I talk about in this thread www.abovetopsecret.com...

Technology and technique are the primary sources of innovation in a liberal economy with competitive enterprise.

All economies have wastefulness, pollution and misuse. Capitalism simply prefers actors with the lowest of these influences. No other system could be as moral, ethical or successful.

Transhumanism will not change the overall process of interpersonal exchange. AI is more of a potential source for headaches.