Ancient conceptualization of the Matrix

originally posted by: InTheLight
a reply to: Kantzveldt

that being ley (solar energy) lines It appears there exist both ying and yan energies (sometimes separate, sometimes together and balanced) in ley lines,

You should probably read up on the discovery of Ley lines mystical properties
en.wikipedia.org...
It was made up in 1969

originally posted by: Marduk

originally posted by: InTheLight
a reply to: Kantzveldt

that being ley (solar energy) lines It appears there exist both ying and yan energies (sometimes separate, sometimes together and balanced) in ley lines,

You should probably read up on the discovery of Ley lines mystical properties
en.wikipedia.org...
It was made up in 1969

Why should I probably? To be swayed over to the scientific side?

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: Marduk

originally posted by: InTheLight
a reply to: Kantzveldt

that being ley (solar energy) lines It appears there exist both ying and yan energies (sometimes separate, sometimes together and balanced) in ley lines,

You should probably read up on the discovery of Ley lines mystical properties
en.wikipedia.org...
It was made up in 1969

Why should I probably? To be swayed over to the scientific side?

So you don't appear to be ignorant...
you're talking about the mystical properties of something that doesn't have any, which was made up originally on the whim of one man to describe ancient pathways between Neolithic sites, which may have not even existed and then embellished in the sixties and linked with Atlantis in a popular book of fiction...
There is no supporting evidence for the claim..

originally posted by: Marduk

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: Marduk

originally posted by: InTheLight
a reply to: Kantzveldt

that being ley (solar energy) lines It appears there exist both ying and yan energies (sometimes separate, sometimes together and balanced) in ley lines,

You should probably read up on the discovery of Ley lines mystical properties
en.wikipedia.org...
It was made up in 1969

Why should I probably? To be swayed over to the scientific side?

So you don't appear to be ignorant...
you're talking about the mystical properties of something that doesn't have any, which was made up originally on the whim of one man to describe ancient pathways between Neolithic sites, which may have not even existed and then embellished in the sixties and linked with Atlantis in a popular book of fiction...
There is no supporting evidence for the claim..

How can an individual support a claim of altered consciousness through external energy sources, when no conventional scientifically-accepted instruments exist (yet) to corroborate their experiences?

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: Marduk

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: Marduk

originally posted by: InTheLight
a reply to: Kantzveldt

that being ley (solar energy) lines It appears there exist both ying and yan energies (sometimes separate, sometimes together and balanced) in ley lines,

You should probably read up on the discovery of Ley lines mystical properties
en.wikipedia.org...
It was made up in 1969

Why should I probably? To be swayed over to the scientific side?

So you don't appear to be ignorant...
you're talking about the mystical properties of something that doesn't have any, which was made up originally on the whim of one man to describe ancient pathways between Neolithic sites, which may have not even existed and then embellished in the sixties and linked with Atlantis in a popular book of fiction...
There is no supporting evidence for the claim..

How can an individual support a claim of altered consciousness through external energy sources, when no conventional scientificially-accepted instruments exist (yet) to corroborate their experiences?

biogeometry.org...

biogeometry.org...

www.rexresearch.com...

a reply to: Kantzveldt

I haven't read everything yet, but I did read through A Rehabilitation of Spirit Ruha
from conclusion:

Ruha pops up in unexpected places.
I wonder if scholars have seriously looked at or skipped over this particular verse of Gospel of Thomas:

29. Jesus said, "If the flesh came into being because of spirit, that is a marvel, but if spirit came into being because of the body, that is a marvel of marvels.

Yet I marvel at how this great wealth has come to dwell in this poverty."

In a big pile of Gnostic texts is found a writing that doesn't quite fit, and in that writing which can almost be understood from a standard Christian point of view, there is this verse.

I recall some 2 1/2 to 3 years ago, a new member of ATS started a thread stating how the Holy Spirit was being held captive in a dungeon under the Vatican. Of course ATS being ATS you can imagine the responses coming from other members.

After 4 or 5 pages of this, in which I was trying to form a plan of action with the OP by which to effect Her liberation, two separate "enlightened" people were exclaiming "yes, you have been awakened and enlightened, come under my wing and I will instruct you." But then the two "enlightened guides" got to arguing between each other as to which was the most appropriate guide.

But anyway, since I'm not an astronomer, I pretty much have to look up astronomical info.

Antares is visible in the sky all night around May 31 of each year, when the star is at opposition to the Sun. At this time, Antares rises at dusk and sets at dawn as seen at the equator. For approximately two to three weeks on either side of November 30, Antares is not visible in the night sky, because it is near conjunction with the Sun;[16] this period of invisibility is longer in the Northern Hemisphere than in the Southern Hemisphere, since the star's declination is significantly south of the celestial equator.

Antares is one of the four first magnitude stars that lies within 5° of the ecliptic (like Spica, Regulus and Aldebaran) and therefore can be occulted by the Moon and, though rarely, by Venus. The last occultation of Antares by Venus took place on September 17, 525 BC; the next one will take place on November 17, 2400. Other planets have not occulted Antares in the last millennium nor will they do so in the next millennium, as they pass as a result of their actual node position and inclination always northward of Antares. On 31 July 2009, Antares was occulted by the Moon. The event was visible in much of southern Asia and the Middle East.[17][18] Every year around December 2 the Sun passes 5° north of Antares
Antares Position

As mad as it would seem to mount an assault in order to rescue Her from evil clutches, I think She can pretty much take care of Herself. I think, and I hope that I'm not mistaken.

originally posted by: InTheLight

How can an individual support a claim of altered consciousness through external energy sources, when no conventional scientifically-accepted instruments exist (yet) to corroborate their experiences?

Nice attempt at moving the goalposts, but rather obvious...

You're not talking about altered consciousness, you are talking about some easily checkable nonsense which you have accepted wholesale without checking the facts.

The mystic qualities of ley lines didn't exist until 1969, when they were made up for a book which has no support, for a claim that is easily provable nonsense..
Did you even consider that there are no scientific instruments to measure the power of ley lines, because the power doesn't exist...

a reply to: Byrd

I noticed, for instance, that they didn't actually show the semi-enforced homosexual pederasty that was part of the Spartan culture (the Agoge)

Much of my views of ancient culture come from Historical Fiction. For Spartan culture I read(past tense, more than 40 years ago) Frank Yerby's Goat Song. Yerby certainly didn't leave it out.

The title refers to advice given to Ariston as a desirable young man by a much older mentor: "So dance to the goat song while you can; hark to the panpipes in the hills. Put vine leaves in your hair; drink deeply. Clasp in hot embrace fair youths and maids."
Goat Song

a reply to: Marduk

You're not talking about altered consciousness, you are talking about some easily checkable nonsense which you have accepted wholesale without checking the facts.

Ley Lines has become a meme. The discussion of ley lines does not necessitate adherence to a particular book. That's how memes work.

In fact the OP offered two pieces of writing showing a purely physical understanding of ley lines as landmarks for shamanic journeys so the travelers don't get lost. See? ley lines purely physical.

If then, someone has an experience related to landmarks an such, what can one person say about another's experience?

“You may be an undigested bit of beef, a blot of mustard, a crumb of cheese, a fragment of underdone potato. There's more of gravy than of grave about you, whatever you are!”

― Charles Dickens, A Christmas Carol

originally posted by: Kantzveldt
a reply to: Byrd

I disagree and wrote my opinions here were i considered that Atenism was the result of developments within the cult of Re based upon their solar observations and reflections and that there was an inner circle that persuaded Akenhaten to embrace Atenism in order to further their own cause, that after his demise and their forced departure they continued their tradition among the Hebrews in the form of Yahwism, the positing of an unknowable and Masculine Celestial abstraction, and the suppression of all other cultic practise.

I'm afraid that the evidence is contrary to your idea that Atenism sprouted from an inner circle and was based on solar observations. Contrary to your claims in your first thread, there is no evidence that advisers and courtiers of Akhenaten fled Egypt to try and convince the tribes of the Sinai to become monotheistic.

* In the first place, the only one with all the theology was Akhenaten (and probably Nefertiti.) He made the rules and defined the religion.
* in the second place, it wasn't COMPLETELY monotheistic... he still gave offerings to the god of the Nile.
* in the third place, there's over 500 years between the time of Akhenaten and the appearance of monotheism in Canaan. If there had been temples to the Aten and evidence of the Aten in that area over that 500 year period of time, then it would be plausible. But there isn't.

Thematically, the two are quite different. Atenism was dumped on an existing cultural framework - Yahwesm produced a codified set of ethics that was not necessarily bound to the culture that shaped it. Yahwism is evangelical; Atenism isn't. Atenism isn't concerned with "forgiveness of sins" (this is an alien concept to them) but Yahwism is all about atonement. Yahwism had priests - Atenism had only Akhenaten and Nefertiti.

And finally, the Aten is neither male nor female.

originally posted by: pthena
Much of my views of ancient culture come from Historical Fiction. For Spartan culture I read(past tense, more than 40 years ago) Frank Yerby's Goat Song. Yerby certainly didn't leave it out.

The title refers to advice given to Ariston as a desirable young man by a much older mentor: "So dance to the goat song while you can; hark to the panpipes in the hills. Put vine leaves in your hair; drink deeply. Clasp in hot embrace fair youths and maids."
Goat Song

An excellent book, and one I read long ago.

a reply to: InTheLight

It interests me how the intrinsic nature of a particular landscape defines the spiritual associations and effect on mood and temperment, how that can be affected by human activity, the one generally follows the other, but there is also a far greater general overlaying of the Earth, a pattern according to spiritual archetype that defines the underlying nature of each region.

a reply to: pthena

That's a very funny suggestion the Holy Spirit held captive in a dungeon beneath the vatican and not that far off the Mandaean perspective really, which i don't think is quite right but does demonstrate the continuity of Mesopotamian tradition, Allani herself insists that she's neutral and good and evil is dependent upon an individuals choice whether to accept or reject good and evil inclinations offered, that we are rather expected to make such decisions.

a reply to: Byrd

There was the evidence suggested in the links in the OP which i think make a reasonable case but it's not my work so take it or leave it, it is though ridiculous to state Akenhaten was the one with all the Theology whatever that's supposed to mean, the cult of the Aten preceded his reign, an aspect of the cult of Re, of course it pleased his person to become the singular focal point of all state religion in conjunction with his exclusive relationship to the Aten, but that was a gradual process.

There is no disparity in dates as a cult of YHW is attested for the period, it's the translation of the underlying principles of Atenism into that particular cult and tribal group i suggested, not the continuance of Atenism itself, nor was Yahwism ever evangelical it related only to the collective of the tribe of Israel , the Priesthood to one extended family only, and their code of Law was pretty standard for the greater region.

Yahweh's earliest possible occurrence is as a place-name, "land of Shasu of YHW", in an Egyptian inscription from the time of Amenhotep III (1402–1363 BCE)

Israel emerges into the historical record in the last decades of the 13th century BCE, at the very end of the Late Bronze Age, as the Canaanite city-state system was ending

originally posted by: Marduk

originally posted by: InTheLight



Nice attempt at moving the goalposts, but rather obvious...

You're not talking about altered consciousness, you are talking about some easily checkable nonsense which you have accepted wholesale without checking the facts.

The mystic qualities of ley lines didn't exist until 1969, when they were made up for a book which has no support, for a claim that is easily provable nonsense..
Did you even consider that there are no scientific instruments to measure the power of ley lines, because the power doesn't exist...

so, you are saying the Nasca Lines (outlines of spiders/ or clams and arrows) are themselves Ley-Lines in the Ideal sense... but... the Nazca and Ley lines are nothing more than 'Spiritual Uplifting' to willing participants



I do 'witching'... most often with pieces of copper wire, hand held so the metal wires can rotate freely.

when I find 'soething' which makes the two wire rods criss-cross that action signals there is a buried object or energy (like moving water) directly below.... causing the Electro-magnetic Continuum to swirl in a vortices & thus criss-crossing the Electro-Magnetic sensitive metal rods...(a good witching can tell the depth by the strength of the mystical-magical criss-crossing & / Or the 'pull' of the primal detecting device.
imho - ley lines are a mental construct of imagination...as most lines will be underground water flows running along pathways of strata & not line-of-sight pathways...perhaps even fault lines may erroneously be thought of as ley-lines


OP... your answers are way too exotic... for me to accept as real

a reply to: Kantzveldt
Just an interesting video.

Not that I've been to Vienna.

ETA
What I meant to do was quote Wikipedia

Ambivalence

is a state of having simultaneous conflicting reactions, beliefs, or feelings towards some object. Stated another way, ambivalence is the experience of having an attitude towards someone or something that contains both positively and negatively valenced components. The term also refers to situations where "mixed feelings" of a more general sort are experienced, or where a person experiences uncertainty or indecisiveness.

Although attitudes tend to guide attitude-relevant behavior, those held with ambivalence tend to do so to a lesser extent. The less certain an individual is in their attitude, the more impressionable it becomes, hence making future actions less predictable and/or less decisive. Ambivalent attitudes are also more susceptible to transient information (e.g., mood), which can result in a more malleable evaluation. However, since ambivalent people think more about attitude-relevant information, they also tend to be more persuaded by (compelling) attitude relevant information than less ambivalent people.

Explicit ambivalence may or may not be experienced as psychologically unpleasant when the positive and negative aspects of a subject are both present in a person's mind at the same time. Psychologically uncomfortable ambivalence, also known as cognitive dissonance, can lead to avoidance, procrastination, or to deliberate attempts to resolve the ambivalence. People experience the greatest discomfort from their ambivalence at the time when the situation requires a decision to be made. People are aware of their ambivalence to varying degrees, so the effects of an ambivalent state vary across individuals and situations. For this reason, researchers have considered two forms of ambivalence, only one of which is subjectively experienced as a state of conflict.

a reply to: pthena

Transcending ambivalence to prevailing winds of mood or a specific pull of being, is the most difficult hurdle, as it requires the wisdom of impermanence of experience never being the same experience twice or else everything becomes severely limited in choice... the lingering memories of experience become the brakes that turn into procrastination or waiting for a mood to strike. It is a form of unconscious or subconscious bias in most cases, dragging feet to check the suggestion of any unseen difficulty in the road ahead that can become anxiety.

This of course can occur simply because nothing is missing from the moment one is currently in as well and perfect in and of itself; so why change it?

Since it is always changing instant to instant to instant of course

a reply to: BigBrotherDarkness

I bask in the decadent luxury of ambivalence.

Hi, my name is Pthena.

It has been over one year since any major geas has been lain(laid?) upon me.

My Butterfly totem is ascendant. I am content to drift in the gently wafting breezes.

I know that not everyone has this luxury, as much as I may wish it. Most people still live in hardness and in tough decision making. My empathy and sympathy has such limited impact (and some would say zero), but it is what it is, and does what it does, whatever that may be.

ley line - spring - underground stream - aquifer - matrix: on topic.

originally posted by: Kantzveldt
There was the evidence suggested in the links in the OP which i think make a reasonable case

That was the view held at one time, yes. But more material (and examination of the tombs of the nobles at Amarna) and excavations have changed the picture (including excavations in Israel and the Levant.

it is though ridiculous to state Akenhaten was the one with all the Theology whatever that's supposed to mean, the cult of the Aten preceded his reign, an aspect of the cult of Re, of course it pleased his person to become the singular focal point of all state religion in conjunction with his exclusive relationship to the Aten, but that was a gradual process.

There was no such thing as the Aten religion before Akhenaten. He changed the concept of the Aten from an aspect of Re into an abstraction (the concept of "Light" as the god of all)

There is no disparity in dates as a cult of YHW is attested for the period, it's the translation of the underlying principles of Atenism into that particular cult and tribal group i suggested, not the continuance of Atenism itself, nor was Yahwism ever evangelical it related only to the collective of the tribe of Israel , the Priesthood to one extended family only, and their code of Law was pretty standard for the greater region.

There are no codified principles of Atenism. Nothing was ever written down (except the Great Hymn, which appears late in the reign) and the practices (altars in full sunlight, etc) are not like that of any Yahwist group. See Albertz, Rainer, and Bob Becking, eds. Yahwism after the exile: perspectives on Israelite religion in the Persian era. Vol. 1. Uitgeverij Van Gorcum, 2003. (search for it... it's readable on Gooble Books)

]Yahweh's earliest possible occurrence is as a place-name, "land of Shasu of YHW", in an Egyptian inscription from the time of Amenhotep III (1402–1363 BCE)

Often cited, but highly problematic. It's "Yahu in the land of Shasu" and the current consensus is that "Yahu" is a place.
en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: pthena

Lain or laid... hmm since you said lingered; then lain. Is that a Glimmer in your pants or are you just happy to see me?

Don't ask me why I'm blushing btw, I haven't worn a bridal gown except for one Halloween years and years ago.

To keep on topic lay or ley lines? Something about that occurred in '69...

a reply to: BigBrotherDarkness
LOL!

Well it's been a long time coming. 20 years, as the calendar goes.

I saw a glimmer of the matrix and ran around saying to any and all, "everything's connected!"

Back then I was a semi-normal productive member of society, job and everything. I'd whip out a poem or story and perform it for my co-workers in the break room. One guy said, "I'd sure like to be a fly on your wall!"

So I did one of those pull the head back, neck arched, chin down moves. "You'd probably find it quite boring. Just a guy at the keyboard drinking copious amounts of coffee and chain smoking, occasionally laughing, occasionally crying. And besides that, I'm not in the habit of killing spiders. So no, I don't think you would enjoy being a fly on my wall one bit, and certainly not for long."

Maybe I should tone it down a notch so people don't get the wrong idea. Doesn't matter really though, I'm just a guy at the keyboard, typing matrix and such lines. Ley lines and what not. But seriously, everything's connected.

a reply to: pthena

Internet tropes are true... there are no women actually ever on-line. Just lonely guys with caffeine and nicotine addictions that may or may not feel pretty.

The matrix is a movie that has caused some persons to have existential crisis or nervous breakdowns of a software malfunction in their brains where it was too plausible of a reality that the other one shattered.

Easily elucidated by your TRANSformation from descriptions seeming well you know wink wink, that coupled with the bars closing on a weekend energy drifting in the night air a reflect spell to the geas was in order as I lift a restraining bolt to my lips called a cigarette.

The talk of magic and mysticism is fun and interesting and what makes the world truly go around... all of human society is founded on ideas and creativity yet taken as real as the signature says.

Personal phenomena arising and passing however can be extremely personal and unless having a discussion best left as dreams and flights of creative fancy hoping to dance a jig getting someone hooked into an alternate reality than... "I am Bender insert girder." ant like functions get pretty boring... hive burrow collapses at any given moment 100's of times a season so it's constant rebuild and attack!

Sand anyone?