The sin against the Holy Ghost?

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: IllegalName
a reply to: MrBlaq

ללכת עם הרוח לא נגדה

But the road that leads to life is narrow...

And few will find it.

Strange that the majority religion considers itself the narrow path that few find.

Illogical, actually. I would have to say Christianity as it is today is the widest of all paths. Factually speaking.

originally posted by: Wombocracy
a reply to: pthena

Speaking of words that should be looked up (genius being from genii djinn is what I imagine you mean):

EL ect (El=God)

EL ite

Son/sun, coincidence? Not likely.

There is more. I have come to realize that the english language was designed with some occult (hidden) features. Look at the days of the week, the names we gave planets, etc.

El-ephant
El-ectricity
El-ven
El-aborate
El-astomer
El-iminate
El-lucidate
El-lectorate
El-lusive
El-swhere
El-emental
El-der
El-ope
El-evator
El-iptic
El-bow
El-m
El-k

Your point was?

originally posted by: Wombocracy

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: IllegalName
a reply to: MrBlaq

ללכת עם הרוח לא נגדה

But the road that leads to life is narrow...

And few will find it.

Strange that the majority religion considers itself the narrow path that few find.

Illogical, actually. I would have to say Christianity as it is today is the widest of all paths. Factually speaking.

Many "do the show" and call that Christianity. In truth, it is in the attitude of heart and a matter of will.

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: Wombocracy
a reply to: pthena

Speaking of words that should be looked up (genius being from genii djinn is what I imagine you mean):

EL ect (El=God)

EL ite

Son/sun, coincidence? Not likely.

There is more. I have come to realize that the english language was designed with some occult (hidden) features. Look at the days of the week, the names we gave planets, etc.

El-ephant
El-ectricity
El-ven
El-aborate
El-astomer
El-iminate
El-lucidate
El-lectorate
El-lusive
El-swhere
El-emental
El-der
El-ope
El-evator
El-iptic
El-bow
El-m
El-k

Your point was?

My point was made in that comment. You must have missed it. I am not surprised, you don't have much of an eye.

Yes, many words begin with e and l, very good. I don't think I could have lived without knowing that.

Do you think that is some sort of valid rebuttal to the fact that EL in ELite, and many other words, was purposely used for the fact that it means God in Hebrew? Many of the words you used in fact.

Because it is not. It is just a fact. Only the unaware challenge facts.

Of course if you are agreeing you could have said that so I don't have to guess.

Knowing how you are about anything that is not a well known fact (to you that means untrue), I do doubt that you are.

originally posted by: NOTurTypical

originally posted by: Wombocracy

originally posted by: NOTurTypical

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: NOTurTypical

So nobody since is allowed to see god because this one guy ate some forbidden fruit?

You can try to convince me of the veracity of that, but to me that part is misinterpreted, too.

What did Jesus say?

How many people had ever seen Father?

Jacob touched God, not only that he prevailed over him in a wrestling match.

Pillar of smoke or fire, that was God too.

Moses. Spoke with God, to his back but he saw him.

No, they all saw a pre-incarnate Son of God. Jesus only said no man had seen the Father at any time, He never said no man had ever seen God at any time.

No, the book of Genesis clearly has a wrestling match between God and Jacob. Are you saying that God is not the Father?

Whatever Jesus meant by that doesn't change the OT God into a pre-incarnate Son of God.

You can make up whatever you want, but you won't find support for that in scripture. I think you had better learn what Jesus actually meant by that because he didn't wrestle with Jacob, El (God) did.

I could make a much better case that the Father is not the God of the OT than you could for your, no offense, ridiculous idea.

originally posted by: MrBlaq
How absurd people are mixing Gnostic heretical nonsense of the Kabbalah
with the Christian faith established by the Son of God.

To avoid the delusions of a horrible Anti-biblical religion of deceit I
recommend Michael Hoffman's expert scholarly research books
Judaism Discovered and Judaism Strange God's.

You are absurd thinking that something you know nothing about is heretical.

And for thinking that heretical is something other than a word used to persecute people violently for over a thousand years of history.

And that your follow the leader faith is superior to anyone elses.

And that trying to know God through books and meditation is bad.

a reply to: Wombocracy

Oh, the OT has numerous instances of people seeing God. Many. Jacob wrestled with God, Moses and Elijah saw Him, Adam walked in the garden with Him, Gideon saw Him, He appeared in the firey furnace in Daniel, God came to Abraham and ate with him and Sarah,.. numerous times "God" was seen and interacted with men in the OT.

YET. Jesus said at no time had any man seen the Father. So who was appearing to men in the OT? Tell me. It was God as the text says, and it was not the Father as Jesus said.

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: Wombocracy

Oh, the OT has numerous instances of people seeing God. Many. Jacob wrestled with God, Moses and Elijah saw Him, Adam walked in the garden with Him, Gideon saw Him, He appeared in the firey furnace in Daniel, God came to Abraham and ate with him and Sarah,.. numerous times "God" was seen and interacted with men in the OT.

YET. Jesus said at no time had any man seen the Father. So who was appearing to men in the OT? Tell me. It was God as the text says, and it was not the Father as Jesus said.

So you ARE saying that the God of the OT is not the Father of Jesus then. I agree.

a reply to: Wombocracy

I never said that. Jesus says He is His Father. Jesus also said no man had ever seen His Father in the past. Yet, all throughout the OT it clearly says men had seen God.

Explain the apparent contradiction if you can.

a reply to: MrBlaq

Hoffmans work is epic and puts a context to the Jewish religion we have today that few people understand .Jesus's saying of their oral traditions making the commandments of God of none effect fixed my own none understanding of that time .

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: Wombocracy

I never said that. Jesus says He is His Father. Jesus also said no man had ever seen His Father in the past. Yet, all throughout the OT it clearly says men had seen God.

Explain the apparent contradiction if you can.

My explanation is that the G of the OT is not the Father of Jesus.

But I am not a Christian either so I can't rectify it from a Christian perspective. Logically at least.

Maybe I can. Hebrew scripture was not meant to be taken as literal history or events that actually happened.

Jews today know this and they would have then too. Especially Jesus.

So if the stories are just for faith and spirituality then nobody did really see God. Jacob couldn't have possibly wrestled with God.

So in that sense he is right, nobody really did see God.

a reply to: Wombocracy

Originally posted by Wombocracy
Good stuff. I never thought to ponder the Holy Spirit as a union of Father and Son but I will give it some thought for sure.

I tend to view the Holy Spirit as the Mother to the Son of God and Mother of humanity. Sophia's Spirit, though not Sophia in the spiritual physical sense but her Spirit in the projected sense.

Well, you’re certainly putting the right elements together…

You see, the “Holy Spirit” gives birth to “The Son” i.e. it births him or her into the Kingdom. That’s why the “Holy Spirit” is often referred to as a Mother, from such sources as the book “Pistis Sophia”, various Gnostic texts and Valentinus etc… and a few others…It’s really just symbolic…IMO

A better way to describe it is this…

When your Spirit connects with the Father’s Spirit…which is the meeting of both Spirits together; then what happens in-between is termed the “Holy Spirit”…but it’s really just “The Son” and “Fathers Spirit” meeting together…It like Jesus said in his prayer “let them become one Father, as you and I are one”

Of course when this happens to someone, they become to realise they are a “Son of God” i.e. “A Son of the Living Father”, and become “birthed”, into the Kingdom of God…They become a new creation…like a Third Element


- JC

a reply to: Wombocracy

Jesus affirmed many times that YHWH was His Father. Here is the answer to the apparent contradiction:

People in the OT did see God, the pre-incarnate Son. The pre-incarnate Jesus. No man at any time had seen the Father, but many had seen the Son.

originally posted by: NOTurTypical
a reply to: Wombocracy

Jesus affirmed many times that YHWH was His Father. Here is the answer to the apparent contradiction:

People in the OT did see God, the pre-incarnate Son. The pre-incarnate Jesus. No man at any time had seen the Father, but many had seen the Son.

I don't mean to be rude but that is the most unsupportable and frankly untrue comment I have ever heard regarding not only this issue but the Bible as a whole.

I would think you could see the problems with what you are saying but you are saying it so you don't.

Pre incarnate Jesus is not the God of the Old Testament and doesn't make one appearance because the doctrine is foreign to every concept of the OT, OT Judaism and Judaism today.

And Christianity for that matter.

a reply to: Wombocracy

And daemon is likely derived from Sanskrit and daeva, but to call them demons would be incorrect. Unless you were a Parsee (Zoroastrian) then the word means demon. Or it did a long time ago.

I did look into Zoroastrian teachings about a year ago and noticed that words and terms common to two different religions were used in an inverted manner one from the other. I concluded that this was intentional in order for the people to easily distinguish themselves one from the other. Not a very detailed analysis I know, which scholars may laugh at or more likely ignore. Intentional differentiation.

In my mind, this intentional differentiation is also very important to a primitive tribal group's attempt to remain separate from other tribes (Hebrew religion development).

How I associate Gematria to this, even though numbers were not mentioned, I will leave you to come to your own conclusions.

I fail to see why you are participating in this thread. I know why I'm participating. Not because I have some religion, or philosophy, or gnosis greater than Christianity. No, I don't.

I'm participating because I am intimately aware of this issue within Christianity. The questions which are the topic were raised in another thread. The Original Poster was wise to start the thread. And he has high bona fides with respect to the topic.

From the accepted Christian perspective of the unforgivable sin, I don't deviate, as far as definition goes. My purpose is to offer myself as a clear example of someone who has done that (committed the unforgivable sin). I hope I made that clear enough to people interested and concerned about the topic.

It has to do with fear. Christians have, through the centuries, been fearful about inadvertently committing the unpardonable sin. I hope that my example shows that they should not fear inadvertently committing it. It is a strong willful thing.

I'm only an example of what Christians should not do.

a reply to: Wombocracy

Hey, then that's you saying Jesus is a liar. He said that no man had seen the Father at any time. Look it up, yet anyone who has read the OT knows many people saw God.

a reply to: Wombocracy

Originally posted by Wombocracy
I have a good version of Sepher Raziel. Awesome esoteric book, Raziel is the angel of the secrets of God.

Highly recommend it.

Thanks…

I have the Sefer Yetzirah “book of Creation” in pdf…which I was reading a while back, before getting side tracked…

I have 33 books (in PDF) on the Kabballa, and I haven't read any of them yet lol... but I don’t have “Sepher Raziel”, so adding to list…


- JC

a reply to: pthena

Wow you have a really artistic method of being pretty cool and then disappointingly arrogant.

It was inverted, the details are sketchy but it is Ironic that India was the nation to give refuge to the fleeing Persians during the rise of Islam although not surprising because a great deal of time had passed since Zoroaster walked the earth and he was not a preacher of hate. Today the Parsees are small in number but socially a success in India.

I have always been fascinated by the unpardonable sin. Not that I need to explain myself to you or want to hear yours. You couldn't explain how you thought of Gematria based on my comment and that is why you are leaving it to me to figure out. Because you can't.

originally posted by: Wombocracy

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: IllegalName
a reply to: MrBlaq

ללכת עם הרוח לא נגדה

But the road that leads to life is narrow...

And few will find it.

Strange that the majority religion considers itself the narrow path that few find.

Illogical, actually. I would have to say Christianity as it is today is the widest of all paths. Factually speaking.

Was Jesus talking about every religion on earth when he made that statement, or just to Jews and 1st century Christians ? The following verses in Matthew 7 answer that question. What it means is that there would be a unique groups of Christians on the earth that would be special in that they would always be closer to the real truth than their Christian contemporaries. If you study religious history you might discoverer who they were.
One example is the Waldensians. But they are not alone, somebody like William Tyndale was doing what Jesus commanded of Christians and he was killed by the church for it.
Who was on the narrow path, Tyndale or the churches clergy ?

a reply to: Blue_Jay33

Jesus is the narrow way, it's a singular way to the Father.

"I am the WAY, the truth and the life, no man goes to the Father except through me."

Inversely, every other path to the Father is the broad way. And you're right, many people who claim Jesus is their Lord are on the broad path. Their salvation hopes rest upon Jesus + X instead of Jesus alone.