Will Bernie Sanders Try An Independent Run At The White House?

a reply to: MotherMayEye

There's always that possibility, but Bernie is ultimately a calculated (or alternatively desperate) gamble. We know Hillary will be bad, we greatly suspect Trump will be bad. Bernie might not end up being better but I cannot imagine he would be worse than Hillary.

originally posted by: Eilasvaleleyn
a reply to: MotherMayEye

There's always that possibility, but Bernie is ultimately a calculated (or alternatively desperate) gamble. We know Hillary will be bad, we greatly suspect Trump will be bad. Bernie might not end up being better but I cannot imagine he would be worse than Hillary.

This is my thinking too.

But then again, I voted for Obama in 2008. My judgement cannot be trusted.

originally posted by: Eilasvaleleyn
a reply to: MotherMayEye

There's always that possibility, but Bernie is ultimately a calculated (or alternatively desperate) gamble. We know Hillary will be bad, we greatly suspect Trump will be bad. Bernie might not end up being better but I cannot imagine he would be worse than Hillary.

This is the kind of thinking I believe 'The Establishment' (read as: Congress and those they are beholden to...but, please use whatever definition you want..) counts on.

Ultimately...Congress spending under Hillary's and Trump's plans will be awful. But, Congress spending under Bernie's plan will be the most disastrous thieving of American taxpayers this country has ever known. Same goes for the power that Congress will seize, under Bernie, on behalf of the federal government.

It's not so much Bernie as it is Congress. Congress doesn't deserve any trust to spend and legislate under Bernie's huge tax & spending plan.

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
It's not so much Bernie as it is Congress. Congress doesn't deserve any trust to spend and legislate under Bernie's huge tax & spending plan.

Would they even be able to get enough done to spend all that money?

All I see are those idiots arguing endlessly still, just over a larger pot.

originally posted by: atomish

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
It's not so much Bernie as it is Congress. Congress doesn't deserve any trust to spend and legislate under Bernie's huge tax & spending plan.

Would they even be able to get enough done to spend all that money?

All I see are those idiots arguing endlessly still, just over a larger pot.

Like the Affordable Care Act, Congress will pass legislation that does nothing to benefit the people and, instead, filters more money to those they are beholden to. In the case of the ACA, that would be insurance companies, pharmaceutical companies, hospitals...

...Congress will feign gridlock and give us the worst possible 'compromises.' And the two parties will point their fingers at one another while no one is the wiser about what's really going on.

ETA: At least that's what Congress' record indicates will happen.


ETA 2: Obama's Stimulus Plan is another good example. Congress allocated untold millions to 'phantom districts' without any oversight and blamed it on failures in the Recovery.org reporting system.

...for example, recipients typed in invalid zip codes and there was no alert that the zip code did not exist. That's a basic safety net that any website I've used has in place.

Congress cannot be trusted.

We simply have more to lose under Bernie than we could ever hope to gain under any of them.

originally posted by: MotherMayEye

originally posted by: atomish

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
It's not so much Bernie as it is Congress. Congress doesn't deserve any trust to spend and legislate under Bernie's huge tax & spending plan.

Would they even be able to get enough done to spend all that money?

All I see are those idiots arguing endlessly still, just over a larger pot.

Like the Affordable Care Act, Congress will pass legislation that does nothing to benefit the people and, instead, filters more money to those they are beholden to. In the case of the ACA, that would be insurance companies, pharmaceutical companies, hospitals...

...Congress will feign gridlock and give us the worst possible 'compromises.' And the two parties will point their fingers at one another while no one is the wiser about what's really going on.

True, that. I guess it would be easy enough to pass massive sweeping legislation that diverts all that money at the same time as they are stealing it.

You're right, no matter which way this ends up, business as usual is bad for us, as usual. Those boners could do a lot of damage with a plan like that if this all continues unabated.

a reply to: Sillyolme
'It wasn't all over the news? It made the history books./
..Not for a couple of years as the 'suspicions' mounted. And even then those deniers kept on denying that it had happened.

"OMG the denial is thick in this thread."
...What denial? That back room shenanigans and conniving is going on? That is denial? You think I am in denial?

"Hey every news story starts as a trickle. Even big events sometimes. Then there's more and a bit more. So because it built-up that means it wasn't all over the news.".
...Right, but not current with the break in and it wasn't until it had gotten enough publicity did it snowball into the resignations.

"And Nixon resigning. I guess they hardly covered that at all too right ? "

...Now you are just being silly, conflating my understanding of Watergate with that overly simplistic and extreme comparison.

But now, it's gotten so sophisticated that their nefarious efforts will never be detected only suspected.
...With out those suspicions, who will there be to dig and finally get to the bottom of things. Who will there be to help bring justice to bear.

We are to presume that since there is no proof of rigging it's because they are better at covering it up? Ok conspiracy website I understand the thought process.
... Proof takes time and does not fall into the laps of deniers. Most often it is only through efforts of the suspicious that any kind of proof comes to light. Now I am not saying that everything is rigged. That the ballot boxes are stuffed and the voters are disenfranchised and all the other supposed proof it there just lining up for everyone to see. I don't know how much of it is true and how much not.

But when it comes to the Democrats and Hillary, it is clear to me that she was the second pick for them back in 08 and has been the 'ready to be crowned' queen since then. It was supposed to be a slam dunk. And to help that along the super delegate system was designed to keep out any but the favorites. And that's enough ''proof' right there for me to call the process rigged.

any independent run will guarantee a victory for the other party

originally posted by: syrinx high priest
any independent run will guarantee a victory for the other party

Pretty much the long and short of it.

If Bernie ran as an independent he would lose AND democrats would lose.

And I believe the truth is that Bernie is a democrat and party loyalist -- through and through. Running as a democrat (because it's more beneficial than running as an independent), does Bernie no favors according to his supporters. They believe the fix has always been in for Hillary.

On the other hand, his supporters also claim he is only running as a democrat for the benefits...but *wink* he's really an independent, anti-Establishment candidate "who knows he can't win as an independent."

But they can't logically have it both ways. I am certain the DNC would not run Bernie as a contender if he wasn't a party-player 100%.

originally posted by: atomish

originally posted by: MotherMayEye

originally posted by: atomish

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
It's not so much Bernie as it is Congress. Congress doesn't deserve any trust to spend and legislate under Bernie's huge tax & spending plan.

Would they even be able to get enough done to spend all that money?

All I see are those idiots arguing endlessly still, just over a larger pot.

Like the Affordable Care Act, Congress will pass legislation that does nothing to benefit the people and, instead, filters more money to those they are beholden to. In the case of the ACA, that would be insurance companies, pharmaceutical companies, hospitals...

...Congress will feign gridlock and give us the worst possible 'compromises.' And the two parties will point their fingers at one another while no one is the wiser about what's really going on.

True, that. I guess it would be easy enough to pass massive sweeping legislation that diverts all that money at the same time as they are stealing it.

You're right, no matter which way this ends up, business as usual is bad for us, as usual. Those boners could do a lot of damage with a plan like that if this all continues unabated.

Congress and the two-party system are such a problem. These are our biggest problems. The two parties run Congress and they cannot be trusted with their jobs.

Any so-called partisan divide is not to be believed, either. Their results are for sh*t and they cannot demonstrate their worth in any way.

We need a candidate that makes addressing the trust and accountability in Congress central to his/her campaign AND someone willing to speak the truth about the two-party CONSPIRACY.

The two parties do, in fact, conspire to profit from U.S. tax dollars -- and they spread the wealth to their wealthy friends, too.

Dang , been saying this a long time....Hell , I hope so

a reply to: AlaskanDad

The Bern . . . like gambling . . .

attractive to those who are quite poor at math.

a reply to: Sillyolme

You are given two candidates from 2 private party / organization's. With there own self interest. Even just that its rigged. Want to see a viable 3rd candidate or a Canaanite not affiliated with any party ? Cant unless they have polled more than 15 % witch the organizations choose. Election fraud and other playful crap sure its probably just neglect. But what about the 2012 elcetion where Ron Paul's name was left out of polls it would show winners 1,3,4 but not him. Or the fact the Republicans changed the rules going in to screw him ? The election is rigged stop pretending its not.

I think the OP got his/her answer yesterday. Bernie will indeed be playing ball with the establishment. At least somewhat...