USAF Wants a 'Penetrating Counter-Air' System Within 14 years

a reply to: Zaphod58

We need the new capabilities no matter what, but we need to keep the costs under control.

Sounds like you're a realist as new technology doesn't usually come with a low cost.

The hardest part seems like it would be figuring out what the most needed new capability is that can also be used on future platforms. Spend big on the R&D costs now to make it cheaper to acquire in the future.

a reply to: gpols

They're starting in the right direction with the KC-46 and B-21 with partial fixed price contracts. They need to start using some of their black world technology, to put into new developmental platforms. Off the shelf tech helps a lot to keep the costs down, and some of that is pretty advanced.

a reply to: Zaphod58

The platform they are suggesting in this article seems like it could benefit from some of that tucked away black world tech. Especially if they want air superiority.

You think they are worried about setting off an arms race incorporating some the black stuff in new projects? They have to have some things that are more advanced than what we have but less advanced than what they have.

a reply to: gpols

There's some interesting stuff that's making its way out slowly. We'll slowly see more and more get out into the world, but it's mostly going to be sensor systems and lower grade stuff that gets declassified. We won't see anything really big get declassified for awhile yet.

a reply to: Zaphod58

In other words the only way to know if it was apart of a black project is if you had knowledge of or worked on the project.

That 6th gen flying wing Northrup teased us with was pretty slick. It seems to me for some capabilities it would make more sense in trying to perfect atmosphere exit and entry. If you were delivering a payload it would be sweet to just drop in right over your target and disappear before they even know what was going on.

Probably not very useful for intelligence gathering like it seems they want this new platform to do though.

a reply to: gpols

PCA is the next step in the battlefield cloud system that they're working towards. It's going to do a lot more than just be a counter air platform. It's going to be impressive as hell to see this thing in operation once it hits FOC.

a reply to: Zaphod58

It'd suck to wait 14 years only to end up disappointed by something equivalent to a no show, or something that couldn't fly in the rain. Or something else equally ridiculous.

This whole cloud system seems really interesting though. Complete real time data from the whole globe at the click of a mouse or tap of a screen.

a reply to: gpols

There's a good chance that we're going to see almost exclusive off the shelf tech used in the airframe. That will drastically reduce both cost and risk during development. They'll use new engines and computers and the like, but like the B-21 they're going to do everything they can to reduce as much risk as possible during development.

The battlefield cloud is going to put us years ahead of anyone else for awhile. Pilots are going to have near total situational awareness and be able to attack targets without using their own radar or other sensors, in some cases before the target even knows that they're there.

a reply to: Zaphod58

We won't see anything really big get declassified for awhile yet.

Maybe, maybe not. I heard the rate of strange triangular/chevron sightings has increased lately.

a reply to: Fastmover

From what I've heard recently, the only programs that are being declassified are old programs that were canceled. We may see some come out that had classified development programs, like the B-21, but there aren't any plans right now to bring anything earth shattering out into the light.

a reply to: Zaphod58

There's a good chance that we're going to see almost exclusive off the shelf tech used in the airframe.

What kind of off the shelf tech, the good or the "so good nobody knows"?

a reply to: Zaphod58

As far as manned aircraft goes I believe we have reached a point where the aircraft can maneuver in ways a pilot can't handle, correct? I remember reading something about the F22 and how the flight computers tune the capabilities back so the pilot doesn't blackout or get hurt.

a reply to: Fastmover

Both.

a reply to: gpols

They actually reached that point as far back as the Viper. There were a number of losses in the early years due to G-LOC because they were able to over G the pilots pretty badly.

a reply to: Zaphod58

I'm interested in seeing what the PAC is going to have though. The F35 wasn't built to dog fight, I'm wondering if the PAC will try to compensate for that. Even if not to dogfight I'd imagine it would allow the platform to do some pretty cool things.

a reply to: gpols

It won't. They've already said it will probably have a fighter designation, but will be bigger and less maneuverable than traditional fighters. They're after range and loiter time now.

According to many here (ATS) the F-35 already fit the penetrating profile. It has become so smart that it can tell the pilot how to fly safely behind enemy lines without being spotted.

Do the US really have to build a New airframe if they already have one that does the job?

What about putting the techonology of the F-35 into the B2 so that it could become just as smart?

a reply to: spy66

Yes. Because the F-35 can't send all the information that it gathers to other aircraft. The existing network used by other aircraft, including AWACS and BACN has been compared to having a dial up modem, with the F-35 having huge packets of data to send. One of the things PCA will do is allow more information to be spread wider.

Not to mention there's no point in having a limited number of airframes capable of doing the mission and the rest of your fleet being 40 years old.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: spy66

Yes. Because the F-35 can't send all the information that it gathers to other aircraft. The existing network used by other aircraft, including AWACS and BACN has been compared to having a dial up modem, with the F-35 having huge packets of data to send. One of the things PCA will do is allow more information to be spread wider.

Not to mention there's no point in having a limited number of airframes capable of doing the mission and the rest of your fleet being 40 years old.

Well they could suit up the B2 and the F-22 With the same Technology and the AWACS?

The plan is to also build a large pack of F-35s in the future to replace the 40 yearolds. I think the plan is to build around 3000 +- F-35s to replace the old fleet?

a reply to: Zaphod58

Which means the ability to deliver larger payloads for a longer period of time. Yeah that does sound pretty cool. Especially considering it will be sucking up every piece of data relevant to increase the over all operations situational awareness.