Why are so many people eager to give away their power?

In the city where I work, "they" just passed (or are about to pass) a new regulation that forces people to pay 5 cents per bag (plastic or paper) when making purchases at businesses like supermarkets, etc. Why? The environment, of course.

Whether we like it or not and regardless of it's imperfections, we now and will for the foreseeable future live in a currency based economy. Money is power. I'm not talking about the mega-rich that buy and sell politicians. I'm talking about for all of us, money is power. With enough money people can choose where they want to live, for the most part. With enough money people can travel wherever they like, for the most part. With enough money people can decide what to eat, what to wear, what to drive and so on.

While I understand that the aforementioned example will only cost a family a few dollars extra per shopping trip, why do so many people seem so eager to give their money (power) away? For the environment? Nothing stops anyone who cares from recycling their plastic/paper bags already (as I do). Further, there are so many other little feel-better-taxes all over this nation and although an individual may not feel it because these fees are spread over so many different aspects of daily life, they do add up.

I just find it odd that so many people are so eager to give away their power.

a reply to: eluryh22

I have often wondered why people are so willing to become slaves to the state.

Please let me know when you figure out why.

a reply to: eluryh22

Responsibility is hard.

Giving responsibility of your freedoms to government is easy.

a reply to: eluryh22
In this case, a kind of laziness. Our parents took their own hard-wearing shopping bags to the shops, and resuming the habit would take very little effort.
In my country, we've also got supermarkets selling tough "lifetime" bags, promising to replace them for nothing when they wear out. We've now got this regulation nationally, but I've never needed to pay for a plastic one.

a reply to: eluryh22

We pay 10¢ per bag here. It only amounts to a few extra dimes, not dollars. We all have the option to bring our own reusable bags, as well, but I just usually forget them. It's not a big deal I guess.

a reply to: eluryh22
Because they are frightened of Freedom.

I'd say we gave our power away to money a while ago so nothing new here.

Matthew 6
24 No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money.

I don't mean to bring religion into this but Jesus hit the nail on the head here. The main reason we have so much corruption and violence in the world is because of money and our love for it. Either someone owes someone money so they kill them, money is to made from war, etc., a very long list of our problems stem directly from money being involved.

We don't see this kind of stuff in the wild because animals use their environment as it was meant to be used, we exploit the environment for profit and kill the world and ourselves in the process.

If you think your power lies in money then I hate to say it, but you're wrong. Money is an inanimate object, there is no power in it other than what we give it.

Paying for plastic bags doesn't make you a slave to the state,lol

Nothing and nobody stops you from taking your own cheap canvas shopper bags. I pay for Extra plastic bags sometimes,they are cheaper than buying proper dustbin liners. Entirely my own choice. Not the guvment,nor Geeky Greg the P+P manager is gonna give a # whether i cart away my purchases in a frikken wheelbarrow-as long as i PAID for them

Entirely at your own permission and of your free will do you Buy bags. There's lots of options.

So how exactly is it that my guvment Forces me to buy these bags at the supermarket?

I'm sorry not being a jerk,maybe i just don't comprehend what you meant.

a reply to: DISRAELI

We also have those-they're not expensive and the P+P's ones are funky sometimes,you turn the bag around to hide the P+P logo,then it looks like any shop-bought canvas type bag. A good deal. But as i said,i have to buy bin liners sometimes and plastic bags are just cheaper. It's not like the editor of "Garden and Home" is coming over for tea anytime soon

That`s crazy,when I go to walmart they very often only put 1 or 2 items in a bag that could hold a lot more items,now if i`m going to have to start paying for the bags i`m going to be micro-managing how they pack the bags and i`m sure i`m not going to be the only one, look forward to slower checkout lines.
I remember when they did the switch from paper bags to plastic bags, the big selling point was that it would save the trees and the plastic bags would be cheaper for the merchants so prices would stay low since the merchant is saving money by buying plastic bags instead of paper bags.
I guess the expert genius`s who were pushing plastic over paper bags didn`t foresee the obvious problem that millions of tons of non biodegradable plastics would cause, which is why i now never believe anything the "experts" say, they have been wrong too many times.

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

I appreciate your sentiment but I think we are essentially having two separate conversations.

I'd say we gave our power away to money a while ago so nothing new here.

From a philosophical standpoint, I have no argument with you there.

For the balance of your post, I would say that money would be just one of the many causes of foul human behavior. Greed, yes. But also jealousy, fear and unwarranted or misplaced revenge would be on that list as well.

If you think your power lies in money then I hate to say it, but you're wrong. Money is an inanimate object, there is no power in it other than what we give it.

If you are talking about the power of the intangible world (my faith, the love that is shared between my family and I, the comradery I share with my team mates at work), then yes, those are powerful things that supersede money and can be neither bought nor sold.

However, the overall point I was making was about the physical world we live in. I think it's easy to turn up one's nose at the idea that money is important in our admittedly flawed economic system. However, as I started my original post, for better or worse this is the world as it is at the moment.

a reply to: Raxoxane

Paper, plastic or canvas... the government is forcing the separation between you and your money.

But I digress....

It's not about the bags specifically. It's about the general concept where the government intervenes "on your behalf" to take care of you "at a cost" because they know better than you do. The popular thing for politicians to do nowadays is to put everything under the Climate Change umbrella. (I'm not giving an opinion on climate change, just saying that is a popular one for them to use).

Again, it's not this specific story but this story is just one more little chip, as they chip away at our individuality.

I'm probably not explaining myself adequately, so it may seem I'm making a mountain out of a mole-hill (but, it's been a long day).

Well, when I saw the threat title, I was like "OOH OOH I know!" -I have some real firm ideas on that subject.

But then the example you used? I cannot see how you equate that with giving away ones power?
And why will it cost families more money? They cannot bring bags??

It has been probably ten years that stores stopped giving you bags here - you can buy one (costs about 80 cents for a big one) and they are not thin ones. They are reusable with good handles and all. Everyone has them already, you just keep some in your car at all times and bring it in with you.


Trying to see where the loss of power is... I almost feel the opposite- like I have MORE power. I get to choose what I take my groceries in, I can bring a basket, a cardboard box, various types of sacs... I have freedom to choose now. (I hated those thin whimsy plastic ones they had long ago).
But I also have more responsibility... I have to think ahead and have them in my car. But power always come with an equal amount of responsibility, so that feels right.


That there î is my answer, by the way, to why people are so often willing to give away their power!
Because in doing so they are relieved of the responsibility that goes with it- sometimes people feel the responsibility is not worth the power.

(I find myself wondering- do you guys still have someone who puts your stuff in the bag for you???
26 years in Europe, that seems terribly bizarre to me now. We must put our stuff in the bag ourselves here.
Would you consider that having more power or less? )

a reply to: Bluesma

Well, when I saw the threat title, I was like "OOH OOH I know!" -I have some real firm ideas on that subject.

I absolutely want to hear about your ideas.

But then the example you used?

Please understand that the thread was born basically out of a stream of consciousness, and the article I had read about the bags was only the catalyst. My overall thought about the issue is that each and every time the government implements a rule/law/regulation that separates a person from their income, under the guise that they are "looking out for you," they are stripping away an individual's freedom to make their own choices.

Side note: Regarding the bagging of my groceries.... I have a bit of obsession about that. I forbid anyone from bagging my groceries. There is a method to my madness. I know what goes where in my kitchen/pantry so I know what should be bagged with what. I also have a system where the heavy stuff gets placed on the counter at the supermarket, because I know where I want it in the trunk of my car (so it doesn't crush the light stuff). Long story.

I totally relate on the bagging! That's why I asked. I like to put things in an order which facilitates my putting them away- so like I have a bag for frozen stuff I'll put in the kitchen freeze, and another for the ones I'll put in the freezer in the cellar. I feel uncomfortably powerless when I go back to the US and have to stand there while someone else does it.

I think I just have a bit the same feeling about the choice of bags thing. I went through a period of experimenting- trying to see if I preferred bringing in plastic cases, cardboard boxes, all kinds of sacs... I now have my favorites that I always keep with me.

Have you ever seen films of animals being let outside for the first time? When they've been raised in labs, or that sort of thing? How scared and distrustful they are?
I think when you give a being power they aren't used to, it makes them get that way at first. They feel vulnerable, they get extra wary and alert to possible threat. Sometimes they will think it is a trap and run back in the cage.

You aren't obligated to buy a bag are you? Or is that just an assumption from habit- that you must get a different bag, each time you shop, from the store (but now it costs money).
Can you bring your own containers of your choice and keep your money?

We pay 10¢ per bag here. It only amounts to a few extra dimes, not dollars. We all have the option to bring our own reusable bags, as well, but I just usually forget them. It's not a big deal I guess.

How do you forget them? I always keep them in the truck. I damn sure wouldn't forget if 10 bags would mean I give the store another buck. I already do all I can to keep my grocery costs down...as this is the SINGLE BIGGEST point of inflation we see on a regular basis.

For one, idiots these days use case cutters carelessly, so you end up with holed plastic bags that come open.
For another, less bags (canvas holds more) means easier to carry in.
With plastic bags, often the bagger just doesn't fill them enough (which at a price per bag would suck).
Also, it forces them to bag a bit better, vs. just tossing it carelessly around.

Personally though, I prefer to bag my own. I'm much faster than these kids at it anyhow. I shop twice a month, for 4 people, so a pretty big order with two carts, and they simply can't keep up with the cashier (even with all the coupons I use). I can (did this job as a kid, when we actually took pride in it)...