Climate Change Denial, Anyone?

In my city, we’re regularly experiencing 40ºC temperatures, and schools are closing in the afternoons because of the heat. This has never happened before. Across the country the year’s first rice harvest has pretty much failed because of a lack of rain.

In nearby India, entire cities are out of drinking water. Power stations have shut down because the rivers from which they draw coolant water have dried up. In the south of the country, a heatwave is claiming the lives of the frail and the elderly.

On the opposite side of the world, in Venezuela, an unprecedented drought has combined with political mismanagement to create a situation where the government has imposed a two-day week on the public sector to save energy. It would like to do the same to the private sector but knows that there will be a revolt if it tries.

In North America, unprecedented rainfall has caused severe flooding in the US state of Texas, the latest in a long series of climate-related disasters and extreme weather events the country has suffered in the last few years.

And across the border in Canada, unusually high temperatures and changing wind patterns are helping a wildfire consume the town of Fort McMurray, pop. 88,000.

The La Niña effect this year (reverse El Niño) has caused worldwide bleaching of coral reefs, again on a scale never seen before.

Greenland is melting.

Anyone still feel like denying climate change, or feel like claiming, in the face of vast if circumstantial evidence, that we’re not helping to cause it?

Welcome, climate change deniers, to the Real Anthropocene. And a hell of a scene it is.

they have gotten very quiet of late.

a reply to: Astyanax
I'm on the fence as to rather climate change is man made, because I haven't done much research on the subject. Do you think all of climate change is Man's doing or just some of it? Further more, why do you think it's Man's doing at all? This is something I've been meaning to delve into for a while so I'm all ears for both sides.

a reply to: Astyanax

And next year La Nino will start and the weather will change completely

Why is it that when a climate denier says that there is less hurricanes despite predictions that climate change will cause more intense and greater number of hurricanes, we are told that our question relates to weather and climate change is not weather.

Yet, if you believe in climate change, you point to weather as proof of climate change and we are supposed to buy into it.

most climate bleaching ever seen - what in the last 150 years out of a planet that is billions of years old? And it couldn't have anything to do with all the pesticides being discharged off the coast of australia.

There are many scientists who believe that climate change is not caused by CO2. Even the most ardent supporter of the CO2 theory of climate change can attribute only a 0.2 increase in temperature since 1890 that was caused by man.

There are also a fair number of scientist who have come to believe that climate is far more influenced by ocean currents (like El Nino) than by CO2.

And they have proved that that warming and cooling cycles interchange every 30 years or so. And they are predicting that we are about to enter a cooling period.

The CO2 theory of climate change does not account for the cooling that occurred in the 30 year period from about 1945 to about 1975. The ocean current theory does.

Tired of Control Freaks

a reply to: Astyanax

Look at what's happening in Alberta, that wildfire is massive and it has forced the evacuation of a city with more than 80 000 people living there.

Amazingly over 80 000 people evacuated safely from what's being told on the news however the fire continues to burn out of control.

There is also another large fire near Edmonton that is forcing evacuations as well.

This is largely due to a much dryer than normal winter where almost no snow fell, leaving everything bone dry.

This is a trend that will continue to get worse and fire season hasn't even officially started, Saskatchewan is another province that carries a very high risk for the same thing to happen.

a reply to: Thetan
My opinion is climate change is definitely accelerated by man.

I usually use this answer to questions like that, can man and is man causing climate change?, puts things in perspective.

In 5000 years, humans have cut down 80% of the worlds forest, 20 % is left, 10% old growth(untouched forest) and 10% regrowth(replanted forest or just tree's).

Everyone knows that forest is the lungs of the earth, and that it's obvious if you remove 80% of those lungs, trouble will happens.

In the old days before this cut down, the planet had no problem with higher natural Co2 levels as the forest would take advantage of it and process the Co2 as carbon sinks and oxygen .

Today the 20% forest that is left has to take care of the natural Co2 and the human caused Co2 on top of the natural.

You don't have to be a professor or scientist to figure out that it creates a problem, that the lungs of Earth is struggling with those higher than normal Co2 levels, even if it was only the natural levels.

CLICK ME

CLICK ME 2

originally posted by: Astyanax

In North America, unprecedented rainfall has caused severe flooding in the US state of Texas, the latest in a long series of climate-related disasters and extreme weather events the country has suffered in the last few years.

Yea, we've had more freak weather in the last 6 months than I remember the prior two years. It started about December, lots of heavy rain and crazy lightning thunder. Now it seems like a weird fortnight to not have the tornado sirens going off. Some of these bolts have been mighty exciting!

It's definitely happening, I just think that we can take it on for a while yet before it's truly unmanageable. All around me, people might bundle inside when the sirens are going off, but they sure do skedaddle off to work the same as every other morning but a few hours later. I know many are less fortunate, but overall as a species we've still got more left in us.

No denial here, but I'm also not going to feed into the sensational titles and outright fear-mongering that the media at times attaches to the reality of climate change.

a reply to: Astyanax

When the ruling class have the ability to control the weather through the militaries use of HAARP and the refusal to use the free (or clean but they cannot charge people for electricity) energy device that Keshe produced last year its a bit hard to determine what the truth is

But from a common sense perspective if our planet were in danger and the ruling class were in danger would things not change immediately?

back in 1850 TB was killing the rich as well as the poor, the rich paid for the sewers in England out of there own pockets

I will step up to the plate.

I am in Texas, We are still in Drought in the panhandle, Rainfall in my area has not yet returned to 1970's levels. 4 years ago we lived in a Ring of fire, and Huboobs that were Reminders of the Great Dust Bowl Days.

Weather is something I have to pay attention to Because a good portion of the Industrial Controls I design go into Cotton Gins, and Good Crop years means Great work for me.

Growing up in the 1970's I can remember reading Pop Sci and National Geographic Stories about the Coming Ice Age, and how it was already late Rolling though. Then in the 80's a phenomenon called Acid Rain was all the buzz in the news (where did it go?), About the Mid 90s the sky is falling was Global warming. Now it is Climate Change. Thing is if you can find elders who lived though the dust bowl days they can tell you first hand that the weather Right now is Close to how it was then, and that it tends to go in small cycles up to bigger cycles.

Greenland has Melted Before, Fossil Records show the ancestors to grapes actually grew there, Hmm, Temps have to be close to France, Italy norms for that to happen. So Greenland has melted before.

Yes people have done some awful things to the environment, But were farts of amoebas on flees in comparison to what One Volcano does.

There is fear of the Ocean Levels Rising, do something for me take a glass fill it with ice, then fill it with water until it is at the brim, put that glass on a clean dry saucer and check it after the ice melts did you get water on the saucer? Or better yet here you go...



Oh but it is the Ice Caps that are melting, The Northern Cap is almost all on water, and the southern cap over Antarctica has been growing.

NASA website on it.

Net Result No change.

In the Last six months Pakistan had Monsoon type weather (again NASA website) which is not too far off from your location I am willing to bet maybe on the other side of India if I am reading context clues right...

While yes Humans have done Some Nasty things to the Environment and need to clean up what we have done and are doing it In my honest opinion is not the Cause of the Global warming / Cooling / Climate Change. If any thing is to blame Blame the Sun. Yes Old Sol itself, how many solar flares have we dealt with in the last decade. How many times has technology had to change because of sun spots. (why analog signals are loosing viability and everything has been moving to the more stable digital)

And all this screaming about it, where are the solutions, why are not ideas that could alleviate drought like ice redistribution, forced desert flooding from oceans being tried? Because just Like Meds there is no money in a cure. Fix the problem and make it go away makes the cash cow go away.

In short if One wants to complain about a problem with out suggesting a solution then it is just bitching about it.

a reply to: Astyanax

I've been wanting to post these two videos somewhere, so going to use your thread as an excuse:


Jimmy Kimmel really stuck it to climate deniers the other day:



...and received the inevitable backlash:




These two clips capture the pointless absurdity in trying to reason with the Sarah Palin crowd. But man are they good for a laugh sometimes

Regardless of our actions, the universe
will do what the universe will do.

# 634

a reply to: Astyanax

"Climate Change/Global Warming" is so 2012.. The population control is now via the water/food supply. Once the escape ships, inner Earth bunkers were built and perfected, then Plan B went into effect. Remember when 'They' plan these "Bug Outs" they're not including You and Your Aunt Edith, They are thinking only of their own Self.

When 'They' started to seed the clouds in Vietnam, even though Their enemy fought in tunnels, that ought to point to some evidence. You'd find this under "Operation Popeye" and to think these turds received $$$ then for 'research' or other lies, You should KNOW that the only difference is their budget went up, they haven't quit playing God.

I currently call Flori-Duh My ecological niche, December was warmer then March/April.

I'm almost looking to be 'sans a Body' then I won't have to eat their GMO foods and drink their tainted water just to pay THEM My $$$ to make Me better after they poisoned Me to begin with.. Didn't that real smart guy Alfred Epstein say something about doing the same thing over and over looking for a different result?

And here it is May and it was warmer in December..

I won't even blame it on a Hispanic female/male, either El Nino/Nina

a reply to: Astyanax

There is also snow on the mountains in Las Vegas right now.

a reply to: Astyanax

Extreme weather comes and goes.

Back in 2000, in the UK they said that snowfalls were a thing of past. During the next decade they experienced the heaviest snowfalls in the country's history.

Obviously, weather and weather patterns do not prove nor disprove "climate change" or "man made climate change".

There is no way to definitively prove that humans have any effect on the weather.

I think what is relevant to the discussion is Climategate and Climategate 2.0, the fact that climate data was being altered to fit the "man made climate change" agenda.

I think climate change deniers were born out of frustration with the only solution ever proposed. Which was to set up a global corrupt tax scheme.

That's it. That is the solution. Carbon credits and massive, crippling taxation.

MY frustration is the wholesale scientific denial in a good chunk of the US population. This denial, be it anti-vaxxers or climate change deniers are muddying the waters to the point where even the scientific community is being stifled in finding scientific solutions(or at least mitigation) to scientific problems.

The worst thing we could have done is allow politicians to get involved in a scientific debate. It's not like they will actually listen to scientists and engineers.

originally posted by: stinkelbaum
they have gotten very quiet of late.

Hey, it's election season and I have other things to do.

If you come up with any new ways to cost me money or more authoritarian power grabs then rest assured I will be back to smack you Chicken Little sounding climate zealots around again.

a reply to: Astyanax

I live in Saskatchewan and we had record low snowfalls this year and we are on track for record low rainfall as well. There won't be any crops if something doesn't change.

Fort Mac is insane and unless we start getting a lot of moisture northwen Canada will be burnt to nothing .

originally posted by: Astyanax
Welcome, climate change deniers, to the Real Anthropocene. And a hell of a scene it is.

Its called Scalar Weaponry.

The sun is actually starting to cool down, so as it magnetic influence on Earth diminishes, our crust starts to shatter more hence the recent spate of earthquakes along the Pacific Rim.

In 10-20 years environmentalists are going to be wishing that 100x CO2 was emmitted as the entire planet goes into a new Ice Age.

If you do not believe me, sell all your assets and give the money to Al Gore. Then he can jet around spewing out even more CO2 instead of using Skype.

originally posted by: Thetan
a reply to: Astyanax
I'm on the fence as to rather climate change is man made, because I haven't done much research on the subject. Do you think all of climate change is Man's doing or just some of it? Further more, why do you think it's Man's doing at all? This is something I've been meaning to delve into for a while so I'm all ears for both sides.

Climate change in the geological period is of course not human made, but most of the climate change now, as in within the last 50 years is from humans.

Why do scientists say that? Because they've been looking hard at it. There is always strong natural variation, but there is an additional change from human changes in the atmosphere.

There are specific and particular indicators corresponding to this change that show up in detailed experimental observations, more than just "climate is changing" but indications that correspond to the particular physical influence which can be traced back to the upper atmosphere. Some of these are fairly technical and they don't get into it in public but the scientists are not BSing.

There has also been searches for any other global climate change inputs, but they haven't been found.

a reply to: Mianeye

Ummm.. ALL plants use CO2, not just forests which implies mainly trees. Here's a great article which doesn't lean one way or the other on this issue, but rather looks at several interesting factors for the uptick in flora and fauna over the last two decades. I'm a bit of a fence rider myself on this issue as well as others. Mostly because "foundations and institutions" seem to want find ways to convince governments to charge me a fee for breathing/existing. That makes me take A LOT with a grain of salt. Any way, here's the link:

m.earthobservatory.nasa.gov...