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posted on May, 3 2016 @ 07:54 AM
a reply to: Kantzveldt
Fully agree, as per usual. But information is power, knowledge is wealth. And of course narcissism is necessary in justifying that power. If they create a covert power circle based upon how much more intelligent they think themselves than the general populace, it should create greater cohesion and loyalty to the group, no?

How many times has it happened on this site, people claiming to have super secret knowledge not to be given to the profane masses... methinks it makes them feel special.

a reply to: artistpoet
Yes, good on the narcissistic cult-leader for closing down tradition against the will of the masses. But I suppose you would support an authoritarian elitist, you even capitalized the pronoun as if the man were a god. His death proves otherwise.

posted on May, 3 2016 @ 09:11 AM
a reply to: SargonThrall

The Atenist approach will always require insiders and the suggestion that they are somehow God like in their understanding, of course it's the case that Heliocentricity isn't going to impress anyone today, nor is the hidden scientific knowledge of say 500 years ago, hence the trick is to seemingly always be ahead, therefore the rumour spreading of secret elites that have technology far in advance of that generally known, conformity, wealth and subservience the only means through which you can hope to get any near to such.

It's possible to make generalization to some extent that the Renaissance was a positive example of the Hellenistic tradition of freely shared knowledge re-emerging even though it transpired in wealthy mercantile families and even though the alchemical tradition coalesced with occultic herbal practise, but by the time you get to the Enlightenment with the New Atlantis of Francis Bacon and the secret colleges there is a serious problem developing, Jewish interests are also becoming increasingly inter-woven with the Protestants and Deists, the people of today are reaching exactly the same conclusion about the Neo-Atenists as did those who tried to restore the damage caused by Akhenaten in Egypt and that was it was simply criminal.

Hand in hand with the genuine scientific developments always seemed to be the underground market for occult tradition that could now be gleaned from ancient texts and artifacts, that was generally bogus and/or crank and also in keeping with much of what passes for revealed hidden tradition on ATS and the internet in general, the peddlers of this were unlikely to believe any of it themselves if belonging to the secret college tradition, and were simply taking advantage of the credulity of the uninformed masses.

posted on May, 4 2016 @ 02:09 AM
a reply to: Kantzveldt
My dear, your thoughts are my own. It must be a trick of psychology, capitalising on the human natures of fear-of-the-unknown and curiosity-for-the-mysterious. People cannot stand a cliffhanger and the nature of occult knowledge must represent the ultimate cliffhanger!

I imagine the elites do actually have advanced technology - why wouldn't they suppress it for control? Even the Hittites kept iron-working a trade secret.

It appears you are saying history repeats itself and the illuminists are paralleling the Atenists, and the disenfranchised populace parallel the Egyptians defacing Akhenaten. I may start referring to the modern elitists as Atenists; it fits too perfectly.

And certainly those texts are bogus, or at least primarily bogus, to the detriment of a gullible public. Like that oft-paraphrased quote,

"Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful."

posted on May, 4 2016 @ 04:22 AM
a reply to: SargonThrall

I'm sure they have the relatively advanced and the power structure to support the secrecy, there are lots of things i could think of to call them but all said and done they mean nothing to me, we did good here, thanks for your help...

posted on Aug, 11 2016 @ 10:31 AM
a reply to: Kantzveldt

My longing to be free of the followers Aten is palpable. It is becoming an obsession. Rudolph Steiner maintained the sixth epoch would be the Epoch of the separation of the Good from the Evil...(I don't know that much about Steiner so correct me here if he is 'off')...and I have heard it said that the control of creative force is the birth of the sixth epoch.

I used to look at the Atenists and think, "they must know the secrets"; I too was lured by the mystery...but now all I desire is to blow through/past them into the fire[abyss]wall that the destroyers cannot cross over and be done with all their bull# and destruction...

The problem with 'waking up in paradise' (via Nanse on your other post; Purification of the Earth) is that they will still be here, thus it can NEVER be paradise...but will remain in corruption (at any rate, even by separating the good, it would only be a step towards paradise). The problem with taking corruption forward (say 'up' the tree of life) is that they will be more dangerous, with more power, so there has to be a system set up by which they cannot pass until they understand how to behave.

I would not wish them to be injured; but separate the Good and remove them from the clutches of the Evil would be ideal (God repented from the Flood because THAT didn't work, obviously and made a new covenant with all living things including animals and plants).

How this would be done...I haven't a clue YET...but that is the purpose of dreamers..."to dream the impossible dream". Is this a parallel world; a divided world; a world advanced slightly in space/time; ??? When you look at the tree of life imagery out of Sumeria you can see that the earth is in the middle of the 'tree' but that there are node both ascending and descending...Raw unbridled creation power/force beneath; ordered pure stasis/stillness above...there must be some way to navigate to the next node (this is the birthright of cohesive organized spirit intellect aka 'humanity' as opposed to the disorganized chaos and unbridled power of the creative force).

Thanks for a 'good read' SargonThrall and first time reading you SargonThrall; interesting.

posted on Aug, 13 2016 @ 06:28 AM
a reply to: ChristianHart

I suppose a question of harmonious balance and cyclic progression, discounting the internalized Sun Goddess of the Netherworld and insisting on the stasis of the Aten in effect is to consider the Sun ever directly above at Mid-day, which is to say that you remain with the cumulative effect of all that could be realized on that day, but you shall never see another, a retarded state of mind, and the reason their religious thinking has not advanced in the better part of 3,500 years.

Again in terms of inbalance, in only regarding the externalized Masculine conceptualization of that which has developed internally one remains with only the idea of creative force and disregards the actual process, the existential, to the effect that one's religious understanding is little more than a masturbatory fantasy, exemplified by the Discordian as the ultimate expression of the Atenist, it is only the idea of the thing were anything is possible.

It is obviously the case that despite only recognizing the singular principle of the light manifest that the actual cyclic creation continues and science and reason is ever playing catch up, evaluating change according to their own perspective, which is to say they assimilate ever increased understanding within retarded ideologies becoming ever more dangerous.

It is always the case with Hebrew texts and Masonic tradition that one can trace back to earlier sources and traditions, that they are the ever increasingly distorted and vague notions of ideas that once made sense, but that they effectively ended and suppressed such sources towards their own advancement, that they only repackage and sell back according to their own brand.

Greater change only occurs with regards to the Doctrine of the Five Suns, which is simply the sub-division of the ecliptic plane into five according to precession, thus periodics of circa 5,200 years, at this point we are concerned with the next stage following on from the development of civilizations circa 3,200 BC, it's those civic developments which the Atenist-Judaic-Masonic traditions have subverted and monopolized, the next one they will not see coming, and it's one thing to control the media and politicians and academia but quite another to control consciousness itself, as all said and done they were only ever part of the process, an example of what not to do and the incentive to move forward, Allani thinks naughty little Atenists are silly...

posted on Aug, 16 2016 @ 02:10 PM
a reply to: Kantzveldt

Hi Kantveldt!
I thought I killed the conversation (as I so often do) and I haven't looked at ATS after the first couple days [got discouraged] until today. I warn people about circular logic often and circular systems (things that serve their own self interest through perpetuating their own self interest)...some of them are catching on...I think...hope. Replication by 'cloning' never a good idea as you always suffer informational death over time due to decay...hahaha...well, not my responsibility to cross breed parasites.

Doctrine of the Five Suns

I know you just explained it...but can you point me to a reliable/comprehensive resource where I can read a little more...
I never dreamed even 9 months ago that there would be so many interesting things to discover in the world...
Thank you, Christian

posted on Aug, 16 2016 @ 03:09 PM
a reply to: Kantzveldt

Again in terms of inbalance, in only regarding the externalized Masculine conceptualization of that which has developed internally one remains with only the idea of creative force and disregards the actual process, the existential, to the effect that one's religious understanding is little more than a masturbatory fantasy, exemplified by the Discordian as the ultimate expression of the Atenist, it is only the idea of the thing were anything is possible.

I found an interesting website Cosmopolisproject by Dr. David Fideler

This is from the Islamic tradition, but this actually applies to all of the monotheistic traditions. The central idea in the Islamic tradition is tawhid or divine unity. And so it’s pure monotheism. But the problem is that, within the Islamic tradition, there has been a major crisis that has been going on for centuries, because there are two totally different interpretations of divine unity. And they both have two, totally different outcomes.

One interpretation of divine unity in the Islamic tradition is that there is a divine unity that encompasses the entire world and all of creation. And you find that reflected in Sufism — that there’s a divine unity present in the world, and that it encompasses us. I think that’s the original meaning of the Islamic tradition, because there are verses in the Quran that support it. For example, there’s a very beautiful line that says, “Wherever you turn, there is the face of God.” That is very beautiful, and there are other expressions of this in the Quran, that the divine is really present in the world.

But then there’s this totally different interpretation of divine unity, which is that “because God is one, God is totally separate from the universe.” And in that later interpretation, there is no contact or intercourse or connection with God directly, but only through a system of laws.

You can see how different those two views are, and they lead to two totally different social outcomes, because the one interpretation creates a legal system of people telling you what you can and can’t do, what’s halal and haram, and all of that, and then punishing people. And the other view — that the divine encompasses the universe and is present here — leads to an entirely peaceful interpretation of the monotheistic tradition.

You find that basic dichotomy, I think really, in Judaism and Christianity too. So that’s what it really comes down to, I think, in terms of how the same religion can create totally different outcomes.
And while I didn’t write about it, there is a structural similarity between the one interpretation of Islam — the extremist Wahhabi view, where the divine is not part of the universe — and the mechanistic worldview of the Scientific Revolution: because in that worldview the divine was not part of the universe either. It was split off. And in the same way that you can only have a connection with God through an Islamic legal system, the Scientific Revolution was based on discovering the mathematical laws of nature, which were believed to be present in the mind of God — so there’s a direct parallel between those two structures.

In the Christian Trinitarian tradition and in the Gnostic tradition both, the divine feminine is subsumed on the one hand and degraded on the other.

In Trinitarian, Sophia the feminine wisdom of God has been replaced by Logos in the person of the Christ who became the second person of godhead. And the Christian Holy Spirit is a dude. So the Trinity is the Three Amigos. Feminine Wisdom is filtered through and mediated by the Christ Guy.

In Gnosticism, the World-Spirit of Wisdom is an emanation from the Father-Spirit, as such, incomplete, so creation is inherently flawed. The Father-Spirit must rule over the Mother-Spirit to bring order. Enlightenment is the evolution out of the flawed into the pure light of the Father.

In both instances, Athena/Sophia have the Virgin role as not being the originator of Life.

Athena traces back to Hittite (Mother) from the Hurrian and back to Inanna who may have been pre-Sumerian Mother. This last sentence is submitted as subject to clarification by the experts on such things.

posted on Aug, 16 2016 @ 07:42 PM
a reply to: pthena

The article makes a good point and clearly the Wahhabi perspective is the one the globalist agenda is happy to do business with as that lends itself to people being readily controlled through supposedly Divine instruction, but the whole thing is entirely abstract and silly.

I was given to look into the basis for Hermetic and Gnostic tradition as there has been suggestion from source that this related to the activities of Benjaminites in Arcadia introducing Atenist principles into Greek thought at quite an early date through the pre-existing cult of Hermes, that is to say they adopted it towards subversive influence given the nature of the cult and compromised the integrity of the Delphic oracle as a means to control (were Hermes steals the cattle of Apollo) ,it's hard to get beyond the legends though in such enquiry though the archetypes involved are interesting.

Again with regards to Christianity the main concern raised is the targeting of Rome, were two leaders of the Church both Peter and Paul are highly active for a sect there that barely registered in it's heartland, this is either through great love for Romans and Gentiles or the introduction of subversive Doctrine into the very heart of the Empire, the Pauline formulation of Christianity was according to Atenist principles and seemingly re-packaged the Western mystery traditions within the Empire with a new biblical basis, though there was all sorts of shifts in emphasis in that formulation.

But anyway this is why Allani is always going on about naughty little Atenists and what are we going to do about them, letting them take over the world not really an option, but watching the great mess they make in trying probably a requirement.

I'm going to do a thread involving the Hittite Mother Goddess, Ḫannaḫanna, perhaps later today, so you can maybe get back to me on that one afterward.

a reply to: ChristianHart

The main cultures were the doctrine of the Five Suns predominated were Meso-American such as the Aztec and Maya and also to the tribes more Northerly, but i think that relates to an earlier stratum of thought which would also have held in Indo-European tradition though that was obscured to the point of almost eradication by the sub-division of the ecliptic into twelve, i'm not really aware of any altogether reliable sources on Meso-American tradition though a quick Google will produce plenty of semi-reliable ones.

As i mentioned my main interest is with regards to the rise of civilizations in 3,200 Bc, i once did a search on that date and it was as if more happened in that particular year than any other since, if only because things tend to get rounded up with regards to it, but also if you go back a further 5,200 years you get the first urban developments, and as far back as 13, 600 bc could prove there or thereabouts for the first villages.
edit on Kpm831228vAmerica/ChicagoTuesday1631 by Kantzveldt because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 18 2016 @ 04:04 PM
a reply to: Kantzveldt

Paul was a Roman by birth and a Jew (unheard of at that time) and very well connected. He would have had to have been very well connected indeed to survive Nero's purge of all things 'Jew' after the 'Poppy/Josephus' infidelity incident where she ended up pregnant at the wrong time (by Josephus) and her and her unborn child were kicked to death by tickles me to death that people do not realize that Josuphus adopted surname is Flavius (the Flavians overthrew Nero)...and Josephus was awarded his adopted surname for his work in destroying Nero and betraying Palestine.

Nero went on a PURGE of everyone Jewish who was not an agent in the hand of Rome. Which goes a long way to explaining how 'connected' Paul really was since he ended up [lol] under 'house arrest' in Rome, with a Preatorian guard on vati(serpent)can(hill) instead of a 'human candle' in one of Nero's famous dinner parties.

Paul IMO was the High Preist of Mithras and the founder of the church in Rome...not Peter. Tarsus, Paul's native town was the cult center of Mithras and he would have grown up as a member or at least heavily influenced by the ideology. Considering the similarities between Mithras and Aten worship and their excoriation and pursuit through torture and murder of the feminine and all thing feminine, including the pursuit and erasure of Judaisms relationship with El Shaddai (their feminine God; the breasted one) in favor of 'God the father'...I am not surprised if Mithrasism is the continuation of Atenism in the region...I don't have much to back that up document wise but it would be difficult to deny based on the church history and physical evidence.

I can't stand Paul as I see his bald faced lies and destruction of the Hebrew religion throughout the entire New Testament. Upon the destruction of the temple in Jerusalem in 70AD, (followed by the destruction of the temple in Alexandria temple in ? 74AD and the dispersal of the remaining Hebrews into the larger world) fledgling 'Christianity' is handed over for cultivation to Pharisee Paul, while all that remain of the Hebrew religion is handed over to Pharisee Ben Zaki who also proceeded to remove all trace of the divine feminine from memory and formed 'Judaism', something completely new to the region and the world. So, the 'change of the age's' religion was completed under the watchful care of the they plan on managing this change as well, giving them full control of the globe.

This is why they celebrate 'the rise of the Phoenix' the Red El (second 'fish'/'dove' or Holy Spirit of Pisces) who they intend on burning (probably at the stake) as 'holocaust' and ushering in their 'NWO' is simply the change over that they want...they do it every age...but by this they will achieve the 'fait acompli' by removing the divine feminine forever (or so they tell me) from the worlds mind. The 'Red El' would be what the modern Pharisees would outwardly call the Red Heifer...but of course, the real ritual will be much different and 'private'.

The idea is that the Red Heifer 'takes away their sin' aka they will be free to do all and everything they desire with no consequences whatsoever on the Earth. So, ha if you think they have ruled with terror and torture up to this point, you have another thing coming when you see what they have planned. I am not sure how it works exactly but I gather that upon the murder of the Red El and bathing in its ashes imparts immortality to the participant.

posted on Aug, 24 2016 @ 06:47 AM
a reply to: ChristianHart

The only manner in which i could see Paul serving Romes's interest was in defusing a sect that challenged the Herodian Dynasty and Temple authorities, in that there was common interest with both parties, as a means to achieving this making observance of the Torah obsolete in terms of a suggesting a New Covenant was a good way to make the sect unacceptable to the Hebrews.

It didn't serve Romes interest to promote this sect as a means to subversion through Jewish connections across the Meditteranean and within Rome, the only continual justification for such activities would have been in the promoting of the insignificance of worldly powers and Temple authorities, that they had not been challenged as they were irrelevant compared to the Kingdom of Heaven, thus a Doctrine of not challenging authority which would also have served Rome's purpose.

I think that the Gallilean sect in looking to formative traditions of Israel and the cult of El Shaddai found common cause with Hellenistic thought regarding the spiritual archetypes of the Heavenly bodies, that the sect was something of a synthesis and thus even made itself even more unacceptable to the Yahwist in bringing all that back up, but rather than those earlier traditions being re-introduced into Jewish religion it became the case that the Jewish premise was introduced into the Roman Empire, and that the common elements which made such possible became also eroded and obsolete within the classical world, thus all that remains is the Yahwist perspective.

It's true that Paul's familiarity with Cilician tradition would have helped understand the association with springs and rivers as conveying spiritual archetypes including those understood to constitute the Holy Spirit, and given the popularity of the Syrian Goddess at the time and Anunitum as marking the Piscean age that sign of the Dove showing the connectivity of the fish of the waters to the transcendent dove of the Heavens, or more likely the sect itself had adopted it as the then New Agers, in many ways i do think the Gallilean sect was right to attempt to save the Jews from themselves by restoring traditional religious practise and thought in going back to basics and seeing the greater picture.

edit on Kam831236vAmerica/ChicagoWednesday2431 by Kantzveldt because: (no reason given)

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