Why the Colonization of Mars is a Dumb Pursuit.

a reply to: reddragon2015

Imo, they aren't planning to colonize anything in space. Its too expensive and way too dangerous. They said all that about the moon before apollo and the shuttle to get you to buy into the programs.

What they really want to do is mine mars and return precious metals to earth. The people wit the money want more money, not pouring dollars down a colonial well.

After all this time they still haven't established any presence on the moon even. You think now they are going to colonize some place even further away?

Not buying any of that jingo.

originally posted by: luthier
The hypcocracy of some folks criticizing the actions of others while typing on their next chunk of the land fill is astounding.

I hope all the we need to fix the planet here crowd has solar panels, drives electric vehicles or bicycles only, and work as activists either creating artifacts like Musk, Dean Kamen, or Bucky Fuller.

All the love in the world isn't going to stop that astroid from killing more on this planet than any human.

Which is the purpose of expanding and learning more from space. We would definitely learn a lot about maximizing efficiency.

It's far beyond hypocrisy, and leans more towards complete delusions. As we type, on the crap that goes into the next landfill, eat and drink from the plastic cups, we produce tons of more material things that poison ourselves.

So producing more crap and poison, in order to get to another planet, to do the same is insanity. Whether it's green or not seems to make no difference, because we don't look at the realities of our lives, and that pills, poisons, cancer and mental breakdowns, are at an all time high, but sure let's run from our madness here and start over on Mar's.

"Maximizing efficiency" in our current MO is like screwing to get our virginity back. It's delusional.

Look at all the trash, circling our own planet.

It's probably ok, because sooner or later we'll poison ourselves, or do something stupid like masses nuclear waste spills, that kill us all. The earth, in time, will return to it's former glory minus the mad species that polluted itself to death, all the while trying to get to other planets, to do the same.

Yep seems perfectly logical to me.

originally posted by: Realtruth

originally posted by: luthier
The hypcocracy of some folks criticizing the actions of others while typing on their next chunk of the land fill is astounding.

I hope all the we need to fix the planet here crowd has solar panels, drives electric vehicles or bicycles only, and work as activists either creating artifacts like Musk, Dean Kamen, or Bucky Fuller.

All the love in the world isn't going to stop that astroid from killing more on this planet than any human.

Which is the purpose of expanding and learning more from space. We would definitely learn a lot about maximizing efficiency.

It's far beyond hypocrisy, and leans more towards complete delusions. As we type, on the crap that goes into the next landfill, eat and drink from the plastic cups, we produce tons of more material things that poison ourselves.

So producing more crap and poison, in order to get to another planet, to do the same is insanity. Whether it's green or not seems to make no difference, because we don't look at the realities of our lives, and that pills, poisons, cancer and mental breakdowns, are at an all time high, but sure let's run from our madness here and start over on Mar's.

"Maximizing efficiency" in our current MO is like screwing to get our virginity back. It's delusional.

Look at all the trash, circling our own planet.

It's probably ok, because sooner or later we'll poison ourselves, or do something stupid like masses nuclear waste spills, that kill us all. The earth, in time, will return to it's former glory minus the mad species that polluted itself to death, all the while trying to get to other planets, to do the same.

Yep seems perfectly logical to me.

Maybe your being so arrogant you think we are beyound the pattern of the universe.

Sometimes bad things happen.

Asteroids, volcanoes etc can do more in 25 seconds to destroy life on this planet than we will over time.

So maybe we are made to go out and continue. Maybe we are made to be virus. Who knows.

I do know that going after people using artifacts to help humanity be more efficient is just hypocritical foolishness. I personally have no issue with it and will continue to support man's ventures into space.

You can continue being a make believe ludite. Who is using electricity and typing on a computer to make philosophical points that have little actual logic.

originally posted by: luthier
Maybe your being so arrogant you think we are beyound the pattern of the universe.

Sometimes bad things happen.

Asteroids, volcanoes etc can do more in 25 seconds to destroy life on this planet than we will over time.

So maybe we are made to go out and continue. Maybe we are made to be virus. Who knows.

I do know that going after people using artifacts to help humanity be more efficient is just hypocritical foolishness. I personally have no issue with it and will continue to support man's ventures into space.

You can continue being a make believe ludite. Who is using electricity and typing on a computer to make philosophical points that have little actual logic.

"Philosophy" the word means "The love of wisdom. Someone or some group needs to take a step back from the madness, from their own "Arrogance". Dogma's or belief's are so strong, on our planet, that we'll kill ourselves for them.

Maybe if we keep piling our computers high enough, we won't even need to use advanced propulsion system to get to another planet, we'll just be able to walk there.

I'm all for exploration, but not until we are able to care for the place we already live.

And as for logic, I'm well versed in formal argumentation. If you care to dissect my argument using formal syllogisms, you will find valid premises and conclusions. However, if you look at your argument it's based purely on dogmatic personal beliefs, and opinions with a blatant disregard for a valid conclusion.

originally posted by: Realtruth

originally posted by: luthier
Maybe your being so arrogant you think we are beyound the pattern of the universe.

Sometimes bad things happen.

Asteroids, volcanoes etc can do more in 25 seconds to destroy life on this planet than we will over time.

So maybe we are made to go out and continue. Maybe we are made to be virus. Who knows.

I do know that going after people using artifacts to help humanity be more efficient is just hypocritical foolishness. I personally have no issue with it and will continue to support man's ventures into space.

You can continue being a make believe ludite. Who is using electricity and typing on a computer to make philosophical points that have little actual logic.

"Philosophy" the word means "The love of wisdom. Someone or some group needs to take a step back from the madness, from their own "Arrogance". Dogma's or belief's are so strong, on our planet, that we'll kill ourselves for them.

Maybe if we keep piling our computers high enough, we won't even need to use advanced propulsion system to get to another planet, we'll just be able to walk there.

I'm all for exploration, but not until we are able to care for the place we already live.

And as for logic, I'm well versed in formal argumentation. If you care to dissect my argument using formal syllogisms, you will find valid premises and conclusions. However, if you look at your argument it's based purely on dogmatic personal beliefs, and opinions with a blatant disregard for a valid conclusion.

Sure. I have a degree in philosophy myself .

One we need to fix all problems on earth before exploring space.

This is a false assumption. Not only is it an impossible task the solutions to these problems will most likely come from the technology from space exploration. Colonizing Mars means mining material on a planet with no life. It gets us closer to mining the asteroid belt. As we expand into space it takes stress off of earth. The materials and mining operations for the equiptment can come from elsewhere.

Two we can't do both.

Of coarse we can. See number one. The technology will come from groups of people designing equiptment for something far less controlled by politics. Mea ing faster advancement and proof of concept won't be delayed by industries looking to remain monopolies.

Three. The solutions already exist on earth. The political and cooperate power have stopped them from being used. For instance take the slingshot device. Nobody will fund it. Not the UN not anybody. Bucky fuller created countless artifacts that could have helped humanity nearly 50 years ago. The monolithic dome is an evolution of those ideas. So you see many of those around?

Four the problems you are concerned with are social not technical. Political and cooperate power structures are holding these things back. It has nothing to do with actual artifacts needi.g to be developed. Most of these artifacts to save humanity already exist.

Five the revolution necessary to disrupt the political control mechanism may disrupt and destroy humanity in itself . So the people working in space exploration may ha e a way around this. If an artifact of efficiency works in space pwolle will natural say why don't we use that here on earth.

I am on a cell so forgive the lack of formal process.

a reply to: Realtruth

Reply: Nice!

a reply to: intrptr


lol wow I have never seen this before. It's entertaining, to the point and actually disturbing. Thanks for sharing

Humans and their problems.

About Elon Musk - in comparison to other "wealthy" people - he actually has a specific vision that is very noble. He uses the "wealth" he gained to achieve his vision and if you have talked to Elon Musk - you will realize that it's not about him but about the team that actually makes this work - because they are as dedicated as himself to achieve this goal.

I like how "envy" always destroys the good things - but we are right back there: Humans and their problems.

a reply to: Realtruth

Hey where is your response. You asked me to lay out an arguement in a more formal matter. Where is your response?

a reply to: DOCHOLIDAZE1

tell that kid down the street who doesn't get to eat about that drop in the ocean

I noticed you conveniently overlook the fact that the money is raised by private capital - and its all about "feeding the children" as if the largesse of the health and social security budgets don't perpetuate a system of looking after the boys

a reply to: TheConstruKctionofLight

do u not see how forsaking the future will certainly seal our fate. Look how far it has already gotten us. We are in one of the worst states we have ever been as a people. If we do not take care of us, Mars does not matter.

I'm all for human colonization of other worlds. However I don't think the others that inhabit this solar system are too keen on it considering how violent we are. I don't think we are allowed to physically leave low earth orbit. We would've had bases on the moon by now and giant space stations or a space elevator. It appears that we are on quarantine. Can't say that I blame them for doing it to us. I would too if I were them.

I'd say we should colonize Mars and send all the douches there, Earth would then be a better place....

originally posted by: reddragon2015
First of all, I want to say that I have no issue with wanting to explore space and beyond. It's an awesome idea.

It's just so stupid to me, that we are wanting and investing time and money into a project to colonize a dead planet. All in the while, we have this beautiful planet, that is Earth, here and we are killing it!

Why? I think we should stop any colonization of Mars or any other planet and learn to keep this one first. We have here is a rare life supporting planet right where we are.

It's just with all these people celebrating about Elon Musk and his landing of booster blah blah blah.

Do you really think this guy cars about the environment at all? Selling an electric car for 80k a pop?

Stop celebrating useless stuff, like putting a man on mars, and how about we save the rhino's. Oh wait, they're already gone as of today.

Wake up people. Elon Musk is not a savior nor a pioneer. Just another douche with money.

Okay, I'll stop ranting now.

Why?

Simple.

Different strokes, for different folks.

They are doing it, because they can.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus
a reply to: reddragon2015

Having humans (and other species) on another planet almost guarantees our (their) survival so it actually is a very high priority for the future of all living things on earth.

That is where the future of man is.

Out there, and not some half assed political agendas like 'saving' the planet.

Rocket engineering NOT social engineering.

Considering the moon is literally across the street, I'd like to see us start there... wait, that's been flagged for chinese industry...

a reply to: reddragon2015

I agree, there is no reason to go there. Most people believe it to be a stepping stone. Say if we do land and colonize mars it will influence more people about space and kind of boost our space technology research rate. I don't believe that would happen, I believe it would be exhausting and pointless. There is also the idea that there are resources on that planet that we can harvest....Yeah I doubt that.

You cant terraform a planet with no magnetosphere. Mars is a lost cause. Nothing can grow there without
A field stopping the radiation from the sun. People would have to live in underground cities to have a viable shelter and greenhouses .

originally posted by: texasyeti
You cant terraform a planet with no magnetosphere. Mars is a lost cause. Nothing can grow there without
A field stopping the radiation from the sun. People would have to live in underground cities to have a viable shelter and greenhouses .

Not really it's fine for a colony stopping off point. Some large geodesic domes would be fine for that.

a reply to: reddragon2015

Why? I think we should stop any colonization of Mars or any other planet and learn to keep this one first.

The work we do today will save mankind in the future , we have to put a colony on Mars if we are to secure our future as a species.