England Needs More Permanent Gypsy Sites

a reply to: EvillerBob

Yeah I know they are ethnically different by now, but the culture is similar.

I have always been intrigued to know how native Irish see their English Gypsy counterparts.

a reply to: EvillerBob


Dacia as it was properly named was the seat of the Dacians a powerful anti Roman tribe whom it took the Romans a long time to suppress.

Though the Romanians (not the Roma gypsy's) language is believed to be descended from the Vulgar Latin language as you know and the Romanians themselves (not the majority Romany Gypsy) are believed to be a mix of both Dacian descent and of course Imperial Settlers (the bulk of whom were not necessarily Roman but from within the empire which as you know covered a huge geographical area).

Though I do find this quite probable from the given KNOWN fact's I am suspicious as it was a highly desirable region due to it's location and suitability for wine production etc.

Also it is worth noting that as for the Ethnic Indiginous (or at least for nearly 2000 years) Romanian people there are interesting parrallel's with the Roman mythology that Rome would certainly have used to there own advantage being as they were consumate at adapting the local religions but in this case it would have been awfully familiar to the Romans.

As you know Romulous and Remus the twin brothers whom supposedly founded Rome with Romulous being the more important of the two were supposedly orphaned and raised by wolves, Roman legionaries sometimes wore wolf skin's with the head still attached and mounted on there helmet's.

Now the Dacians had a very intriguing belief and I am sure that the Contemporary Roman scholors would have agreed, the Dacians may have revered the wolf also and even called themselves wolves though they were probably an offshoot of the Thracian culture, a sister tribe to the Thracians if you like and an Indo European tribe.

As you also know after the fall of Rome just like many places in the empire Romania or Dacia if you like was most probably invaded several time's by the Marauding tribes whom prowled the post Roman dark age europe especially since the last stronghold of the Roman world Byzantium was not influential at that time over that part of the world.

You are quite correct though and I have to backtrack on why that nation is today called Romania since the Roma whom were named Gypsy by the europeans seem to have reached europe sometime between the early 13th and 14th centurys while to my own correction the earliest mention of Romania may be from about the 10th century and is made by Byzantium scholars.

It seem's my knowledge was based on faulty theory's, I must also stress I was repeating what I had seen and read in the past so thank your for correcting me and not being too offended, I know how proud Ethnic Romanians are and they have a right to be after all they have suffered (though there is that little bit of a black mark in which Romania allied with the Nazi's).

I wonder now though if the Roma are named after Romania even though it as not there homeland, the Roma do not call themselves Roma but Rrom with a rolling R.

a reply to: EvillerBob

To be fair we bought a horse drawn caravan from a clan of red-headed Irish travellers who overwintered in their council house. Each summer they would buy one of Slattery's tourist caravans. Because of the huge rise in insurance costs due to terrible incidents, the bottom dropped out of the horse drawn holiday market, and there were hundreds of caravans for sale.

They'd travel around, 'seeing a bit of the country', knowing someone would ask if the caravan was for sale. We had no idea how common and cheap these caravans were, but they didn't take advantage of us. They sold it at a reasonable price with a small profit. Then the men went down into town and came back with a ghetto blaster and huge smiles.

The image of them silhouetted against the sky as they left is firmly embedded in my memory. Children running, men on a flatbed cart pulled by a donkey, the mother behind pushing a pushchair. She'd asked us if we'd sell her our pushchair but we used it every day so we said no. That's one thing we've always regretted. We should have let her have it, the one she had was worn out. We both feel a deep sense of regret for not realising how much she needed it.

In our experience this clan were good people. Very rough, the one who was a bit aggressive was kept in check by the others. I'm sure some of their habits would be a problem for neighbours, but I saw no greed or malice in them, just delight in the beauty of the land around them.

I wouldn't shed a tear if they "magically" disappeared.

They set up camp in my town every year for the Appleby horse festival.

Locals horses go missing, break ins go up, rubbish everywhere, they steal electric and defecate all over the bushes.

The one sole reason I hate them? My brother had a local pub a few years back and had to kick some of them out one night, they came back and stole his dog, Charlie.

Devastated my brother.

a reply to: woogleuk

I'm not surprised you're getting quick stars on this one.

Some things can be ignored. But not horse theft, break-ins, rubbish, interference with utilities, unburied excreta and theft of beloved dogs. All these are choices made with free will. These choice leads to hatred.

a reply to: Kester

Another thing I have noticed, they tend to drive around in white vans offering "services", like roofing etc.

They get money upfront and either do a shoddy job, or just don't go back.

I'm sure not all traveller groups are like this, but pretty much all the ones that have landed in Workington / Cumbria are.

a reply to: woogleuk

haha my neighbour does pikey tarmacking and gardening from his white van, offered to do ours for a price, I kindly turned down the offer, the tarmacs normally stolen leftovers from job sites

a reply to: TigStar82

And the weeds grow back through in a fortnight.

a reply to: woogleuk

I'm embarrassed to admit I fell for the story when one of the Rathkeale criminals came to my door with a useless Chinese generator and a warm, friendly story. Lucky for me I didn't have £200 in the house or I really would be too ashamed to admit my foolishness. www.abovetopsecret.com... Notice how this lot are the ones activists were asked to defend. Total spook manipulation.

But this thread is about the need for more permanent sites for English Romanies. A need that has gone unanswered for a long time.

a reply to: Kester

I didn't mean to appear to go off topic, in my mind it was in line with the thread.

I was highlighting the issues faced when these cleppets show up, so if a permanent solution was found, which town or city would have to suffer?

It's their way of life, and having them all located in one place / several permanent locations is going to wreak havoc on the communities that are burdened with them.

There would have to be a lot of "permanent" locations situated up and down the country that they can move between, and for the sake of the community, lots of toilet facilities built and also electrical hookups....but who would foot the bill?

a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

Depends who. www.independent.ie...

THIS is the 33-unit housing estate in Co Limerick owned by one of the Irish Travellers living on the controversial and illegal Dale Farm camp in England.

My closest English Romany friend shared ownership of a house with his father. They also shared the same name. When the father was prosecuted for a particularly unpleasant crime there was some confusion because of same name, same address. My friends reaction was to pin his father against the wall with a sawn-off shotgun under his chin and explain to him why he should be a better role model.

a reply to: woogleuk

I'm trying to keep myself on topic. Not one of my strong points.

Much stronger policing is needed.

There's money in the travelling community to foot the bill, but we all know there's a tendency to ask for everything to be provided free, then trashed.

a reply to: Kester

There is a large gypsy / hawker / traveller population in the town where I live.

They have been the source of constant trouble.
There are regular confrontations between them and various other groups of locals.
They harass young women and try to intimidate the weak.

I myself have been glassed, stabbed and had a lump bit out of my back in separate altercations with gypsy's.

They pay no council tax, rarely tax their vehicles and never pay tax on earnings.

To give some balance I've got to say that I do know a handful who are great people, try to mix with locals and have become respected members of the local business community etc.

The local council has just voted to help fund the re-build one of the existing permanent sites to the tune of £1.8Million and are proposing to build yet another - the third in total - new permanent site, ( I think this new site is deemed necessary for Eastern European gypsy's....but I may be wrong).

All this when the council have stripped services to the bones, are proposing to shut a popular, well used and historic town library and gallery and are about to announce further large increased in council tax payments for those of us who have to pay them in addition to even further cuts in services and funding.

a reply to: Freeborn

In the thread title I used the word Gypsy to mean English Romany. After reading the comments I'm even more convinced the Irish and East European's shouldn't be here, except in small numbers.

a reply to: woogleuk

I don't have the answers. It's a problem that's been more or less stagnant for a long time. No reason for us to provide for Irish or East European. We don't need this.