Why Did Ancient Europeans Just Disappear 14,500 Years Ago?

Why Did Ancient Europeans Just Disappear 14,500 Years Ago?

Some of Europe's earliest inhabitants mysteriously vanished toward the end of the last ice age and were largely replaced by others, a new genetic analysis finds.

The finds come from an analysis of dozens of ancient fossil remains collected across Europe.

The genetic turnover was likely the result of a rapidly changing climate, which the earlier inhabitants of Europe couldn't adapt to quickly enough, said the study's co-author, Cosimo Posth, an archaeogenetics doctoral candidate at the University of Tübingen in Germany. [Top 10 Mysteries of the First Humans]

Here an interesting little read. After reading it the book Guns, Germs and Steel by Jared Diamond came to mind. Although the replacements didn't have guns and steel they may have had "Germs" from any early form of raising some types of livestock. Run the clock forward to when the Europeans made contact with the New world. Disease wipes out the much larger indigenous Human population. Same thing may have happened several times in our human family tree history, I'm sure this also accounts partially for the disappearance of Neanderthal and Denisovan and possibly others... I feel and have stated this here many times.

If it wasn't the main cause then possibility a large contributing factor.

Wouldn't a rapidly changing climate lead to a change in the types of diseases (viruses, bacteria) and their means of spreading?
A changing climate would also lead to a change in vegetation and wildlife. My guess is that there immune systems couldn't adapt to the change.

I'm imagining there was some disease or virus that they just couldn't shake off (after having a winter cough for a month). But modern humans had a different immune system that operated in a different way - maybe recognising irregular protein shapes versus regular protein shapes.

Good question Slayer. I've read different theories, such as cataclysm, climate, disease, etc. Considering some of the things that have happened on this planet, I'm just wondering how long it's going to be until we find out first hand. We certainly aren't immune, just because of our technology.

a reply to: SLAYER69

Wasnt there meant to have been some kind of event about 12500 bc that number has stuck in my mind for some reason.
If the people have been replaced then something must has happened to them. Guess the question is the what..

a reply to: SLAYER69

That is one rugged looking coconut...reminds me of the terminator skull

a reply to: stormcell

The environment changes, making the regions in question more habitable for early forms of livestock or other wild species that were not previously local which then move into the areas in question that the newer groups of humans have already been in long term contact with them and were not affected by anything they may be carrying.

Specie expansion and or replacement.

a reply to: SLAYER69


"Guns, Germs, and Steel". What a great book!

I never thought of it happening like this through history before guns and steel too though ... but that same type of scenario makes sense to me!

So they lived through an Ice Age, but couldn't adapt to a warming climate?

Unlucky Norwegians, Swedes, Finnish, Icelandics etc..

Survival of the fittest, they were taken out by superior hunters, that is all.

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: SLAYER69

Wasnt there meant to have been some kind of event about 12500 bc that number has stuck in my mind for some reason.
If the people have been replaced then something must has happened to them. Guess the question is the what..

Yes, there was some kind of nuclear bombardment of the North American continent. A high-energy sub-atomic blast from a supernova that got caught in Earth's magnetic field. About 1/3rd of the Northern Hemisphere got nuked. Chert deposits show that they were hit by neutron radiation:

www.viewzone.com...

"...the Paleo-indian catastrophe in 12,500 BC ..."

"The enormous energy released by the catastrophe in 12,500 BC could have heated the atmosphere to over 1000°C over Michigan, and the neutron flux at more northern locations would have melted considerable glacial ice. Radiation effects on plants and animals exposed to the cosmic rays would have been lethal, comparable to being irradiated in a 5-megawatt reactor more than 100 seconds."

Wouldn't that be cause for a continental flood? But it would have warmed up the climate, ended the ice age, and allowed human civilisation to expand.

a reply to: SLAYER69

Anthropologists have been wrestling with this since I was in school in the 90's. It's a far more complex question than it seems, in my opinion. I believe that it was a combination of factors much like what occurred when these people encountered Neanderthals as they pushed into Europe from the Caucuses. Personally, I think it was a combination of disease, admixture and inability to adapt rapidly to a quickly changing climate. Europe was still fairly cold 50-60 KA when the first HSS made their way in during the LGM, temperatures increased quite rapidly. That alone will introduce new threats from flora and fauna to insect born pathogens. Add in a new group of people who possess different skill sets and it's a recipe for disaster and mirrors what happened when HSS met up with Neanderthal in Europe. The interesting thing to note is that this did not happen in the Levant and Iraq when HSS first found our cousins but it did occur and in rapid fashion, in Europe.

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978
So they lived through an Ice Age, but couldn't adapt to a warming climate?

Unlucky Norwegians, Swedes, Finnish, Icelandics etc..

Survival of the fittest, they were taken out by superior hunters, that is all.

You do know they were adapted to an Ice Age meaning they would need to burn thousands of calories more to survive than modern humans. If local species started going extinct and herds were stopping their migrations I would expect their population to drop rather quickly.

It's like blaming the extinction of the dinosaurs solely on an asteroid. When the dinosaur population was already in shambles before the asteroid even hit.

a reply to: SLAYER69

We know we humans are vicious, territorial and militaristic.

Couldn't one tribe have invaded and systematically wiped out another?

Even if the invaders had mated with the defeated tribe, if they carried predominant traits and the invaded tribe had recessive ones, the offspring would be more like the invaders than the original tribe.

I'm inclined to believe the majority of the former population was wiped out by the ice age not by those that repopulated it after the ice age...
Infact they may even be the ancestors of the survivors that had to flee Europe in order to survive...

originally posted by: TheLotLizard

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978
So they lived through an Ice Age, but couldn't adapt to a warming climate?

Unlucky Norwegians, Swedes, Finnish, Icelandics etc..

Survival of the fittest, they were taken out by superior hunters, that is all.

You do know they were adapted to an Ice Age meaning they would need to burn thousands of calories more to survive than modern humans. If local species started going extinct and herds were stopping their migrations I would expect their population to drop rather quickly.

It's like blaming the extinction of the dinosaurs solely on an asteroid. When the dinosaur population was already in shambles before the asteroid even hit.

Yet they didn't have many rivals until the ice started melting and then they faced oblivion.

As for the Dinosuar analogy, sorry wasted on me. I don't care for Dinosaurs, well enough to give them a capital letter at the beginning of their collective name, that's all.

However, the fact they existed should be enough for anyone to question Theology. Or was God testing us?

a reply to: stormcell

For those that believe, anytime between approx 12,000 B.C. and 10,000 B.C. is the timeframe in which the Atlantis civilzation fell due to warfare.

It's also widely speculated that nuclear weapons were used during this collapse. The "Paleo-Indian catastrophe" is where science meets alternative history, in that it's agreed that a massive release of energy occured within our atmosphere.

Just sayin'

a reply to: stormcell

That was an interesting link! Researchers have also found horns and antlers from the period which were bombarded with micro-meteorites. The linked article mentions the Carolina Bays, and they are usually associated with the southeast states, but some are found as far west as Wichita, Kansas. The major axes do point toward the Great Lakes region, and if you look at a map of Lake Michigan in particular, you can see the partial circular outlines of impact on the lakeshores. If they are what they look like, the Carolina Bays would be secondary impacts...

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: SLAYER69

Wasnt there meant to have been some kind of event about 12500 bc that number has stuck in my mind for some reason.
If the people have been replaced then something must has happened to them. Guess the question is the what..

The Younger Dryas event. Which absolutely was a stressor for the entire northern hemisphere.

Combined with disease, and you have the human, neandertal, and denisovan collapse. Then combined with the incoming human presence, along with the lack of seasonal growth due to the impact, the megafauna were hunted to extinction. WHich was yet another stresser for homonids living in Europe and Asia.

An unfortunate (for them) series of events that helped give rise to agrarianism.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan
You are absolutely right BFFT,
The younger dryas event supressed populations across the world, not just the northern Hem.
It is also a point of note that recent population genetics studies show that nearly all european and western eurasian populations have effective minimum populations around 12kya

[reply]stormcell[/reply]
A super nova was firestones's intial theory as to how those cherts and other samples, were exposed to a hi energy particle flux.
A super nova or atomic bombs are no longer on the table, since the same traces of high energy particle have been found in trees killed at tunguska.
The amount of energy involved in the disintegration of a larger bolide is phenominal.

One thing to remeber also, is that the taurid progenitor was huge, approx. 150 kilometers in dia., and it inserted into an earth croosing obrbit and began to break up some 25kya.
When it started to break up it left a massive tube of derbris, that the earth would cross 4 time a year.
So its safe to say that there was more than one impact event, and that the major one was the YDB boundry event. This would help explain the seeming temorporal discontinuities of the world wide evidence.

[reply]stormcell[/reply]
A super nova was firestones's intial theory as to how those cherts and other samples, were exposed to a hi energy particle flux.
A super nova or atomic bombs are no longer on the table, since the same traces of high energy particle have been found in trees killed at tunguska.


This is the first time I've heard that info. I've researched the Tunguska incident quite extensively.
The answer is far from clear cut, but IMO the Tunguska incident was actually caused by an ET drone that self detonated due to mechanical failures. ( This scenario is also discussed in The Law of One or Ra Material as well.)

Leads me to believe that both Atlantis' collapse and Tunguska were both forms of nuclear detonation, however using what seems to be a more sophisticated type of nuclear energy that emitted less harmful radiation than our current nukes.

Food for thought