God is good, his justice isn't violent.

All my Christian friends love talking about how God is going to destroy the wicked and usher in an era of universal prosperity. I try to tell them that God doesn't have to destroy anyone in order to Usher in Eutopia, but logic seems not to matter.

For the record, I find it psychotic if you look forward to the annihilation of billions of people and consider it divine retribution. God has the power to harden hearts (Pharoah), so he has the power to soften them too. He could do it in a second and remove every evil inclination man or woman has. Everything.

I've come to grips with the idea that he has a plan, I have a great life so I can't complain and am not. People are suffering and I would help if I had the means but Im just getting by myself. God has been good to me, I am very happy.

I don't want every person in the world who isn't a christian to go to hell. Hitler and Mussolini, Pol Pot and Qadafi are his problem and I'm sick of my Christian brethren's intolerance and denial of. If asked what happens to people not in the church, the so called unsaved, many Christians will tell you without compunction they will be under God's judgement and if not saved by the blood of the Lamb i .e. a Christian in good standing, you won't receive salvation i.e go to heaven.

I find this disturbing because I know many nice people who don't deserve hell any more than any Christian I know. And they don't believe everyone deserves to go to hell.

I believe that God offers everyone salvation who deserves salvation, everyone doesn't gets another chance, except the worst of the worst.

Divine retribution is just and God is merciful to the extreme. What do you think?

Cupcake,no one is going to hell-there is no hell,and no heaven,but look at my signature-there ARE CONSEQUENCES.You leave here,and you were a good person in general,harmed none,helped where ever you could-you just stay away from "the light" or else you shall be forced back into the cycle of reincarnation.If you were evil and harmed many,i don't think you get That option. Then you come back into the exact re-enactment of one of your victims. There ARE consequences,and it has nothing to do with any of the "Big Religion" dogmas.

originally posted by: Caligula
I believe that God offers everyone salvation who deserves salvation, everyone doesn't gets another chance, except the worst of the worst.

I don't exactly believe in God, but I agree that it is foolish to make a difference between people, between sinners and righteous ones.

But do you think there are some people who are "the worst of the worst", as you say, who do not deserve salvation? You are saying there are some people who are the worst of the worst? This is interesting to me, please elaborate.

This is an honest question to you, I am trying to figure things out.

a reply to: Caligula

Luke 19 'But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.'

Straight from the big jeezy's lips apparently.....

originally posted by: Raxoxane
Cupcake,no one is going to hell-there is no hell,and no heaven,but look at my signature-there ARE CONSEQUENCES.You leave here,and you were a good person in general,harmed none,helped where ever you could-you just stay away from "the light" or else you shall be forced back into the cycle of reincarnation.If you were evil and harmed many,i don't think you get That option. Then you come back into the exact re-enactment of one of your victims. There ARE consequences,and it has nothing to do with any of the "Big Religion" dogmas.

I think it's kind of insulting to call this poster "Cupkake", to be honest. If you have knowledge of heaven and hell, then please, share it with us?

You say there is no hell, no heaven, but there are consequences.

I respect you opinion, but to me there is no difference between what you say, and what I hear my local preacher say, or what I hear an Iman say,

They are all the same. We just have to search for a deeper truth, and the OP is trying to do that. But there are no easy answers. No karma or divine justice.

What is the difference between hell and heaven?

God's justice was to send His Own Son to us, to teach us, to be an example for us, to die for us. Nothing else really matters, except that Hell does not exist. See Genesis 1:1 - God made the heavens and the earth, no mention of Hell.

originally posted by: Subnatural


What is the difference between hell and heaven?

The Kingdom of Heaven is among us right now, operating. Ever wonder why Jesus described it by how it worked, not by what it looked like? Yup - it is not the cartoon harp + cloud heaven with Saint Peter at the gate.

Ever notice that as little as the Bible says about Heaven, it says less about Hell?

The difference between hell and heaven is that heaven exists...

a reply to: Subnatural

I didn't mean it in an insulting way,sorry if you took it that way-i've been called a lot less tender names on this site,jeez people are Sensitive

What is the difference between me and a preacher or an imam? Thanks so much for asking,i shall tell you.

A preacher(usually Christian) or an imam(usually Muslim) subscribe to belief systems,to one of the Big Religions,for which there are bibles and korans.They tell you,you need a "key" to get into "heaven" either Jesus or Mohammed or even better,blowing up a bus full of schoolkids,that actually also seems to get you laid by hordes of virgins..Yayy..Jesus(no pun intended)

My family and myself have no religion,we worship nothing and nobody,but we know there is only ONE CREED:

First Harm None
Add to that,help the less fortunate,or indeed Anyone in dire need,where and when ever you can

We believe that there is a cycle. We believe that if you are very evil,and harm many,or harm even few very grievously,you shall incarnate into the same type of life as your victims, in your next incarnation.We believe that if you were very evil,staying away from the light upon departing the flesh-conveyance Here,will avail you none.

Simple as that.We chase away our own demons,we hack this life by ourselves,the buck stops with US. We do not need nor want any deity,real or perceived.We do good because it makes us happy to do good,and to help people. We are sovereign souls. We do not HAVE souls-we ARE souls,trapped for this incarnation in these pesky flesh suits. Maybe as punishment,maybe because we fell into the trap of "the light" last time we tried to exit the prison planet. We shall not make that mistake again.

a reply to: Raxoxane

That's kind of what I said and think. I also think Jesus taught a form of reincarnation but it was left out. I believe the gospel of Peter has a similar teaching along with other texts I don't remember the names at the moment.

a reply to: Prezbo369

Jesus was well known for using metaphors and I bet that is an old testament quote.

a reply to: Caligula

All my Christian friends love talking about how God is going to destroy the wicked and usher in an era of universal prosperity. I try to tell them that God doesn't have to destroy anyone in order to Usher in Eutopia, but logic seems not to matter.

For the record, I find it psychotic if you look forward to the annihilation of billions of people and consider it divine retribution. God has the power to harden hearts (Pharoah), so he has the power to soften them too. He could do it in a second and remove every evil inclination man or woman has. Everything.

Some. Not all. Love their Christian doom porn. They literally get off on the idea that God/Jesus will murder Billions of people during the so-called tribulation. They also love it when some pastor says that some natural or man-made disaster was God's judgement on gays, Muslims, Catholics, whatever. BUT...they love you, and so does Jesus.

a reply to: Subnatural

War criminals do not deserve to go unpunished but I don't have a clue what God does with them.

Do you think Hitler should go to heaven with St. Peter? Repentance is a big deal in Christianity and I don't think he repented.

originally posted by: Caligula
a reply to: Prezbo369

Jesus was well known for using metaphors and I bet that is an old testament quote.

Actually, it comes from a parable Jesus told in Luke 19: 11-27

11 Now as they heard these things, He spoke another parable, because He was near Jerusalem and because they thought the kingdom of God would appear immediately. 12 Therefore He said: “A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom and to return. 13 So he called ten of his servants, delivered to them ten minas, and said to them, ‘Do business till I come.’ 14 But his citizens hated him, and sent a delegation after him, saying, ‘We will not have this man to reign over us.’

15 “And so it was that when he returned, having received the kingdom, he then commanded these servants, to whom he had given the money, to be called to him, that he might know how much every man had gained by trading. 16 Then came the first, saying, ‘Master, your mina has earned ten minas.’ 17 And he said to him, ‘Well done, good servant; because you were faithful in a very little, have authority over ten cities.’ 18 And the second came, saying, ‘Master, your mina has earned five minas.’ 19 Likewise he said to him, ‘You also be over five cities.’

20 “Then another came, saying, ‘Master, here is your mina, which I have kept put away in a handkerchief. 21 For I feared you, because you are an austere man. You collect what you did not deposit, and reap what you did not sow.’ 22 And he said to him, ‘Out of your own mouth I will judge you, you wicked servant. You knew that I was an austere man, collecting what I did not deposit and reaping what I did not sow. 23 Why then did you not put my money in the bank, that at my coming I might have collected it with interest?’

24 “And he said to those who stood by, ‘Take the mina from him, and give it to him who has ten minas.’ 25 (But they said to him, ‘Master, he has ten minas.’) 26 ‘For I say to you, that to everyone who has will be given; and from him who does not have, even what he has will be taken away from him. 27 But bring here those enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, and slay them before me.’”

a reply to: Klassified

Absolutely. I like that term. Doom porn. Im actually cracking up.

a reply to: Caligula

I think IF there are only Christians in "heaven" sign me up for a one way ticket to hell...

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Caligula

I think IF there are only Christians in "heaven" sign me up for a one way ticket to hell...

I've seen what nations and people are capable of doing when their imaginary friend manifest through them. I'll take hell any day, hail Satan!

a reply to: Caligula

God loves everyone right? Take a girlfriend or family member you love with all your heart. if they committed murder would you send them to hell for ETERNITY? # no, you would feel bad that they felt they had to perform such an act. If god loves us infinitely there is no hell simple as.

a reply to: Caligula

Let's make it very clear

Jesus died, choose Jesus choose forgiveness
Deny Jesus, choose separation from God, separation from God is hell, no rest, no seventh day

God does not change the heart, if He did we would be robots, it's a free choice, God does not enslave mankind By forcing His will on us, sorta, in my opinion.

God doesn't condemn mankind the law does, God doesn't send mankind to hell, they choose it by denying salvation

Study that you may be accounted worthy

a reply to: Raggedyman

If God was all knowing then he would know that Many people would stray from the path in this modern age. I am a believer in a higher power whether because I am right or because I am worried. either way I can see no hell in anyone's future, it just doesn't fit with gods everlasting forgiveness. Be who you are, if you are a murder think about what you are doing, what impact it will cause, what grief it will create, and if you do I think you would at least think twice which should be enough for god.

I'll start by saying, that i don't subscribe to any religious denomination, and therefor, do not believe in the "christian god" in the way that someone of the faith might. I do, of course, believe in something.

For the record, I find it psychotic if you look forward to the annihilation of billions of people and consider it divine retribution. God has the power to harden hearts (Pharoah), so he has the power to soften them too. He could do it in a second and remove every evil inclination man or woman has. Everything.

This quote outlines one of the most confusing parts of modern Christianity to me.. how is it at all in line with the "faith" to say, never mind believe, that this is a positive thing that god could do?

It completely goes against every quote that is attributed to the anointed one. Loving your enemies and turning the other cheek and all that.

If you were evil and harmed many,i don't think you get That option. Then you come back into the exact re-enactment of one of your victims. There ARE consequences,and it has nothing to do with any of the "Big Religion" dogmas.

I concur more with this line of reasoning, but i'd take it a step further in saying : everyone, no matter your deeds, be them positive or negative, everyone - before crossing over the threshold - experiences everything they have ever done to anyone, in full emotional detail.

That time you were young and you fried an ant with a magnifier? You experience being that ant.
That time you yelled at your mom and told her you hated her? You experience that moment from her POV

Then of course there are the extremes, if you've murdered someone, raped or otherwise physically assaulted anyone, you experience that, as well as the repercussions its had on the rest of their life.

Beyond this, i believe that you also witness the reactions to your death that everyone who reacts to it has. Ever.

So say you commit suicide, and there is a public candle light vigil, you would experience every thought, emotion and consequent action perceived and committed by everyone who reacted to your death in any way. (though possibly from an outside perspective, rather than a first person one in this case, since you now are your soul and its happening in "real time" - all be it, nonlinear)

But of course, on the flip side, you would also experience all the positive effects you've had on the world.

That time you helped an old lady cross the street, or that time you gave your last $5 to the homeless man down the road.. Every time you told your loved ones how much they mean to you, etc.. you may never know when you have saved or changed a persons life.

I think its possible that when people see their lives "flash before their eyes" during a NDE it is a pre-cursor to this experience, allowing them to review the things, in an instant, they have been a party to, so they can consider a different path forward, pursuing that which is genuinely theirs to experience.

There is nothing i can conceive of more just than experiencing that which you have forced upon others, and equally, that which you have done that benefitted others.

In conclusion, if "God" created all men equal, then i believe that all men are treated as equal in the eyes of the divine spirit; it is your own actions that punish or reward you, your own actions that define the lessons you have left to learn and finally whether you decide to "go into the light" and start over, or continue into the void and seek a new experience.

All life is connected and there is, therefor, no sense in singling out one minuscule soul in the grand scheme of things; particularly from an omniscient view point. The idea of an eternal place of punishment is contrary to the very existence of an immortal soul, whose purpose - presumably - is to experience the creation in all of its wonder.

To know thyself, and be that genuinely is all we can truly strive for, in my humble opinion.

EmBa