Well I Was Correct About What The French Would Do If We Exit The E.U.

originally posted by: grumpy64
a reply to: Soloprotocol
How will they be working if they are illegals?

Seriously..?????????

originally posted by: Soloprotocol

originally posted by: grumpy64
a reply to: Soloprotocol
See what happens when the benefits are stopped for those who are deemed illegal immigrants and they are paid to go home.

Most of them will be working and not on benefits.

I would go further........every economic study undertaken shows that migrants bring more in than they take out. So, yes you do end saving in benefits payments......but it ends up being a net loss when loss of spending in the economy is taken into account.

As to the thread itself, as others have noted, what do we expect?

It would be madness for France to guard our borders if we decide to leave the Union. Are we to guard France's borders for them? Of course not......so why should it be any different for them?

originally posted by: grumpy64
a reply to: Soloprotocol
That will be France's problem.

No, It will be the UK's Problem.

Still waiting on a answer to my question. Here it is again for the hard of hearing..

How do you remove ii's who do not wish to move if the country of origin refuses to accept them. ?

originally posted by: Soloprotocol

No, It will be the UK's Problem.

Still waiting on a answer to my question. Here it is again for the hard of hearing..

How do you remove ii's who do not wish to move if they country of origin refuses to accept them. ?



More so if said country of origin is a war zone - that would be breaking all sorts of international treaties that we are paid up members of (and original signaturies of).

Just saying "we would send them back" is the intellectual equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears.

At the moment, the law states that any truck driver who is found to have illegal immigrants in his truck will be fined £5000.

Why not extend that to the ferry companies, Tunnel operators and Airlines?

They make damned sure no one can get on without a ticket. They can make sure no one travels here without permission.

originally posted by: Flavian
I would go further........every economic study undertaken shows that migrants bring more in than they take out.

Most reports can be picked apart and some are not independent. They often ignore the fact that there are upwards of a million illegal immigrants in the UK.

I'll throw in some examples.

- Migrant nurses do benefit the UK as they are professionals an pay taxes. They also have to speak English and are on the immigration controls if not EU. Generally, professional are also more empowered and more likely to adapt to the host culture.
- Migrant Poles working in the building industry are legit, because they are EU.
- Uneducated Somali, Afghan, Eritrean (etc) men, who speak little or no English work in the black economy or are forced into criminality. They are not on the immigration registers. Most of the pressure is non-EU immigration.
- Muslim women of Pakistani/Bangladeshi origin are under-represented in the workplace in the UK, so contribute nothing in taxes. It is now a recognised problem that many women from some communities are controlled by their inability to access education and work, due to cultural constraints (mainly made by men).
- Creaking roads, hospitals, schools cannot accommodate more people. No account taken of this pressure.
- No room for more, and more houses. No account taken of the pressure on the land.
- How do you cost the societal changes and demonstrate a benefit to the native inhabitants whose lives are compromised?

You could also factor in wage compression as immigration makes the pool of available labour ever larger.

originally posted by: SprocketUK
At the moment, the law states that any truck driver who is found to have illegal immigrants in his truck will be fined £5000.

Why not extend that to the ferry companies, Tunnel operators and Airlines?

They make damned sure no one can get on without a ticket. They can make sure no one travels here without permission.

The problem with that is the Ferry Companies, Tunnel operators and the Airlines will pass on any losses to you and i.

Basically anyone with a passport can enter the UK. The trouble is, hundreds of thousands have dumped the passport once here and have never went back home once the visa expired. it's not hard to get fake id nowadays.

Every country in the world has the same problems with immigration. The UK is not an exception.

originally posted by: Soloprotocol

originally posted by: grumpy64
a reply to: alldaylong
That might be silly on the part of the French. Can you imagine the number of immigrants the British might send back to Europe if things go a bit pear shaped ? There could be a lot more heading to Europe than the other way around.

And what happens if the migrants dont want to leave and the country of origin refuses to accept them. Do we just pen them up at our expense.

No EU means the Human Rights Act can be slung out. Machine guns at the Chunnel, cow-catchers on the Eurostar, and Soylent Green for everyone!

a reply to: Soloprotocol

Better than doing nothing. No visa no entry.

As for those overstaying, well, if we had the will to find and eject them it would be doable.

originally posted by: Tulpa
a reply to: alldaylong

Nice of our French cousins to threaten us like that isn't it. After years of failure, they want to use the camp as leverage (I thought that was the migrants plan) to get their way.

Not really. There's nothing to say a country has to stop refugees from leaving the EU. In fact, I think it's rather encouraged. It's an entirely logical and natural consequence of leaving the EU.

As long as we're allowed to mine the entrance of the Channel Tunnel, I have no objections whatsoever.

You make life unbearable for them, you take away their freedoms. They stay in a facility under lock and key. If they are here illegally they will be crimunals and should be treated as such. So no TV's, mobiles etc to hve contact with the outside world. I am sure they will quickly remember their Country of origin. Then pay Country of origin to take them back. Money creates miracles in this corrupt world we live in. We certainly would have to stop putting them in 4 star hotels, fgiving them meals and pocket money and allowing them to freely rosm around the Country znd expect them to report to Police as we do now.

If France want to be awkward then we could block the tunnel. France woould soon have Germany on their backs when costs of importing their goods to UK goes through the roof. The tunnel is convenient for EU as well as us.

Then the only way for migrants to come over illegally would be by sea. Get our navy back on our seas and any that come on ferries make surr they do t set foot on British soil by doing thorough searches on ferries and holding any illegals caught and sendimg them straight back to France. I am sure there are many Brits who would volunteer to do this for a few hours a month.

France should habe toughened up years ago. They are the ones who have allowed them througj the border in the first place. I know they are in free movement but that is only for EU citizens, so illegals should have been stopped. I read everywhere how migrants at Calais are refusing to be fingerprintec, wellthen France should tell them in no uncertain terms they either comply or they get sent to a facility such as a prison until they comply with the law of the land either that or face being deportd. They have allowed illegal immigrants the upper hand for years. If I committed some of the violent acts we have seen in past few days on Frdnch soil, attacking Police and lorry drivers, I would be arrested and wouldnt have any choice about giving finger prints.

UK too have been too soft for too lomg. Is it any wonder many want to come here. Apparently France havd far stricter asylum rules, so why dont we? When people do come illegally we then allow them to stay and put them in hotels. Whag sort of a message is that? UK successive governments have always blamed this on European Courts so if we leave they will habe to start doing their jobs correctly bdcause I dont think Brits will tolerate anh more ex uses at that point.a reply to: Soloprotocol

Another thing which might entice illegals on to a plane back to their Country of oriigin is to pay them a couple of grand to leave, like some sort of amnesty. Yes it would cost UK initially but I would much prefer to give money that way and have a positive outcome at the end, rather than paying for hotels, thousands and thousands on legal fees etc.a reply to: anxiouswens

As an addendum to the fine idea for airlines etc.
Maybe letting them know that if they get fined too many times they will lose their operators licence will have an effect.

I won't make an opinion about this, I do not live in any of the countries effected. I live here in America where we vote for the best liars and chaotic people to run our country.

You certainly couldnt get a better liar than we have at the moment and add Mr Blair to that and I think this is one fight the UK will definitely match if not win!a reply to: rickymouse

a reply to: anxiouswens

To be honest, the way you get rid of "illegals" is to deport them, promptly and without ceremony.

I have great sympathy for people who come from crap hole countries, but there's a limit. We live in a time when we are too nice and too accommodating, and where too many people take advantage of this fact.

Human rights is something I hold dear, especially the rights of women and girls who are treated horribly in many cultures. However, we are in a ludicrous situation where people use human rights as a coverall excuse.

For example, I saw an interview on the TV of a migrant in Greece bleating on about it being a human right "to live where I want", when stopped from easily progressing to Germany.

There are myriad examples of where illegal immigrants have hidden behind human rights and lawyers to frustrate laws and processes. The "right to a family life" basically guarantees that you cannot get deported! It's a joke and a scam.

a reply to: Soloprotocol

Still waiting on a answer to my question. Here it is again for the hard of hearing..

How do you remove ii's who do not wish to move if the country of origin refuses to accept them. ?

This is where commons sense come in.

Most of these immigrants come from countries that recieve UK aid.


ampp3d.mirror.co.uk...

The UK threatens to close the cheque book if they do not take back their own nationals.

Sorted.

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: Bluesma

Maybe just maybe if The French put much tighter controls on their southern and eastern borders, there would be no build of illegal migrants at the Channel Ports. Just stop them getting into France in the first place.

Otherwise just round them all up and INSIST they claim asylum in France or send them back to wench they came from.

Common sense is a free commodity.

.... and maybe if the UK would stop giving everyone who stops in so much aid and healthcare without question, maybe those people would be fine staying over here on the continent?

Look, the stupid game of blame can go back and forth like that forever.
It is besides the question of the topic - if the UK pulls out of the EU, should the countries of the EU hold themselves responsible for the UK's border control?

Why, in your opinion, should they?