UK Referendum 23 June 2016 - Will it be an EU BREXIT or Not?

originally posted by: eletheia
hidden deep inside the EU agenda is a plan to force a change to 'right hand side' of the road driving.

Oh, well. Now you've found out anyway, we just as well might confess it. Yes, it's true, your source is mostly correct. However, there is one small, but significant detail where they got it wrong. The plans you're mentioning are the "renegotiation plans", the new treaties that will be made between the UK and the EU might the Brits vote "out". Given that there is a significant chance the Brits will go for a Brexit, the British government, which is overwhelmingly pro-EU, already drafted new treaties. These new treaties in effect will keep the UK in the EU, but to satisfy the nationalists in the UK, four changes will be made: the EU will rename the Euro to "Pound (Sterling)" with the symbol £; the UK will then join the monetary union; the continent will drop the French "Kilo Metre" and adopt the mile as the standard measure of length and - and this is the reason for your confusion - we will have to change to left side of the road driving.

After all, that's the normal way to do things in the world, see the picture below (source).

a reply to: ForteanOrg

I heard there is a secret treaty being passed immediately after the referendum banning fish and chips, only snails or frogs legs and chips! The legs have to be no less than 10mm thick and a prescribed curvature as well

*Edit*
Only teasing, the treaty is just banning the word chips, they will have to be referred to as French fries at the point of sale!

originally posted by: RP2SticksOfDynamite

I know that some have placed little credence on the www.pollstation.uk... poll but I ask ATS's at what number of voters does credence start to kick in? The number of voters in this online poll has now already exceeded 31467 votes and 80% of them are for leaving the EU? If the number of voters reaches 80-100,000 should notice be taken?

Come on ATS's whats your opinion on this?

a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

I'm keeping an open mind, it could just be that 'leave' voters are more motivated to share their opinion on that government poll site....or it could be that it is an accurate reflection of how the country is thinking.
I hope it is the latter of course!

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: ForteanOrg

French fries at the point of sale!

French Frie Buttie doesn't work

neither does Fish & French Fries

originally posted by: bigyin

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: ForteanOrg

French fries at the point of sale!

French Frie Buttie doesn't work

neither does Fish & French Fries

Hahaha! We actually agree on something!!!!

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

I'm keeping an open mind, it could just be that 'leave' voters are more motivated to share their opinion on that government poll site....or it could be that it is an accurate reflection of how the country is thinking.
I hope it is the latter of course!

Yes. It just amazes me how high the vote leave is. I mean 80% of nearly 32000 voters is massive. It means that for them to become even, the next 25000 voters would have to vote remain. Normally polls involve around 2 to 3000. This is already 10 to 15000 that.

However, it might explain the desperate actions of the IN campaign.

originally posted by: RP2SticksOfDynamite

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

I'm keeping an open mind, it could just be that 'leave' voters are more motivated to share their opinion on that government poll site....or it could be that it is an accurate reflection of how the country is thinking.
I hope it is the latter of course!

Yes. It just amazes me how high the vote leave is. I mean 80% of nearly 32000 voters is massive. It means that for them to become even, the next 25000 voters would have to vote remain. Normally polls involve around 2 to 3000. This is already 10 to 15000 that.

This type of poll where people can vote in an uncontrolled manner is rather meaningless unless the sample fetches millions of votes. For example that 32k sample so far could double in one day if Nigel Farage posted the link onto his Facebook page and asked people to vote. And of course, the majority of them will vote Leave.

originally posted by: 83Liberty

originally posted by: RP2SticksOfDynamite

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

I'm keeping an open mind, it could just be that 'leave' voters are more motivated to share their opinion on that government poll site....or it could be that it is an accurate reflection of how the country is thinking.
I hope it is the latter of course!

Yes. It just amazes me how high the vote leave is. I mean 80% of nearly 32000 voters is massive. It means that for them to become even, the next 25000 voters would have to vote remain. Normally polls involve around 2 to 3000. This is already 10 to 15000 that.

This type of poll where people can vote in an uncontrolled manner is rather meaningless unless the sample fetches millions of votes. For example that 32k sample so far could double in one day if Nigel Farage posted the link onto his Facebook page and asked people to vote. And of course, the majority of them will vote Leave.

Understand that but the increase from day one has been so gradual e.g. 500-1000 votes a day which is what you would expect in a UK cross section vote. Certainly be interesting and a post referendum pointer to what was going to happen on the 23rd June if the actual Leave vote is high. Particularly when the odds are 1/3 on in favour of Remain. www.oddschecker.com...
But bookies are shrewd enough to mislead with odds like these when they think there is a chance it will go the other way (they make a lot of money). I am on Leave at 12/5!

From Vote Leave:

Uncontrolled immigration will put pressure on NHS

The unelected European Commission is this week expected to grant visa-free access to the EU’s passport-free travel area to Turkey, Kosovo, Georgia and Ukraine. This means that 127 million more people will be able to travel freely from the Russian and Syrian borders right up to the English Channel.

This is another stark reminder that the status quo is not on the ballot paper in this referendum. EU expansion will put even more pressure on our schools, hospitals and other public services. Five more countries are set to join the EU in the coming years, giving 88 million more people access to our NHS – and we are footing the bill. We are sending £2 billion over the next few years to these countries to help prepare them to join the EU.



Our NHS is already struggling to cope with a lack of funding and huge demand. After we Vote Leave we can take back control of our borders to create a fairer immigration policy which welcomes in the brightest and best from around the world whilst easing the pressure on our public services. We can also spend the £350 million we send to the EU every week on our priorities like the NHS.



Today’s must-reads:

Germany to push for progress towards European army - FT
www.ft.com...=false.html?siteedition=intl&_i_location=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ft.com%2Fcms%2Fs %2F0%2Fe90a080e-107b-11e6-91da-096d89bd2173.html%3Fsiteedition%3Dintl&_i_referer=&classification=conditional_standard&iab=barrier-app#axzz47SM6ExG9

75 million Turks on course for visa-free travel in EU, despite not meeting key targets in refugee swap deal - Telegraph
www.telegraph.co.uk...

EU expansion will open our borders to 88 million from Europe's poorest countries - Michael Gove, Mail (Saturday)
www.dailymail.co.uk...

EU red tape is suffocating UK economy and Brexit can set us free - Allister Heath, Telegraph (Saturday)
www.telegraph.co.uk...

Leaked TTIP documents cast doubt on EU-US trade deal - Observer
www.theguardian.com...

Why it's time to bust the many myths surrounding Brexit - John Longworth, Telegraph
www.telegraph.co.uk...

Trawlermen would make net gains outside EU, says fisheries minister - Times (Monday)
www.thetimes.co.uk...

From a recent article I read which left me of the opinion that the result whether

*IN* or *OUT* our fate may lie in the hands of Youth! .... students.

My opinion of students is there are the *leaders* (militant) and the *followers*

Student union bodies are "deliberating stifling" debate over Europe, campaigners
said last night.
One 'pro leave group' claimed it was told its "students for Britain" name could
cause offence????
The warning came after several instances when student bodies have prevented
"leave groups" from campaigning.
According to"students for Britain"a pro leave campaign group, university lecturers
are telling students to vote to remain in the June 23rd referendum.

At Keele University the*leave group*was initially told by the Union that one reason
it couldn't be recognised as a society was because the word Britain "could be
interpreted negatively on first glance, particularly with our internationally diverse
student body."
However both it and the 'pro remain' have now been allowed to operate as
'temporary campaign groups.'

It was also claimed that Plymouth University announced a *pro EU debate* hosted
by politics professor David Brokington, whilst denying Brexit campaigners
the same opportunity....because the university only hosted *Fair and unbiased*
events.

*Fair and unbiased???



Couldn't make it up

A student in Leeds complained *Students for Britain* was not allowed to have
a stall at the union...because it was a 'single issue campaign' as opposed to a society.
However a *better stronger in Europe* group was allowed because it was
under the umbrella of the Labour Party!!?

*Students for Britain* chairman, Tom Harwood said "We have been seeing example
after example of student bodies and university authorities stepping in
deliberately to stifle a free and fair exchange of ideas.
At some universities student bodies have taken it upon themselves to adopt a
*pro EU*stance .... so you have a situation where a group of 16 NUS students is
speaking for the entire student body

UNBELIEVABLE

We've been receiving examples of university lecturer's encouraging students to
vote to *Remain* during lectures, which is wholly inappropriate.

A recent YouGov poll revealed 80% of students were pro EU, though only one in
two said they were inclined to vote. BUT this changed after *Leave* groups were
allowed to campaign.

A debate was run at South Bank University going in there was a 30% support, but
afterwards a 60% swing. The level of misinformation by the *Remain* group is
staggering.

Recent research suggests student apathy could lead to a narrow victory for the
*leave* campaign, swinging the vote by .5million in favour of quitting the EU.

The timing of the vote could see fewer student voters. Many universities will hold
graduation ceremonies on June 23rd. Students may also go to Glastonbury or even
away on holiday!

All the *leave* campaigners want is ....PARITY.

originally posted by: eletheia

From a recent article I read which left me of the opinion that the result whether

*IN* or *OUT* our fate may lie in the hands of Youth! .... students.

My opinion of students is there are the *leaders* (militant) and the *followers*

Student union bodies are "deliberating stifling" debate over Europe, campaigners
said last night.
One 'pro leave group' claimed it was told its "students for Britain" name could
cause offence????
The warning came after several instances when student bodies have prevented
"leave groups" from campaigning.
According to"students for Britain"a pro leave campaign group, university lecturers
are telling students to vote to remain in the June 23rd referendum.

At Keele University the*leave group*was initially told by the Union that one reason
it couldn't be recognised as a society was because the word Britain "could be
interpreted negatively on first glance, particularly with our internationally diverse
student body."
However both it and the 'pro remain' have now been allowed to operate as
'temporary campaign groups.'

It was also claimed that Plymouth University announced a *pro EU debate* hosted
by politics professor David Brokington, whilst denying Brexit campaigners
the same opportunity....because the university only hosted *Fair and unbiased*
events.

*Fair and unbiased???

Couldn't make it up

A student in Leeds complained *Students for Britain* was not allowed to have
a stall at the union...because it was a 'single issue campaign' as opposed to a society.
However a *better stronger in Europe* group was allowed because it was
under the umbrella of the Labour Party!!?

*Students for Britain* chairman, Tom Harwood said "We have been seeing example
after example of student bodies and university authorities stepping in
deliberately to stifle a free and fair exchange of ideas.
At some universities student bodies have taken it upon themselves to adopt a
*pro EU*stance .... so you have a situation where a group of 16 NUS students is
speaking for the entire student body

UNBELIEVABLE

We've been receiving examples of university lecturer's encouraging students to
vote to *Remain* during lectures, which is wholly inappropriate.

A recent YouGov poll revealed 80% of students were pro EU, though only one in
two said they were inclined to vote. BUT this changed after *Leave* groups were
allowed to campaign.

A debate was run at South Bank University going in there was a 30% support, but
afterwards a 60% swing. The level of misinformation by the *Remain* group is
staggering.

Recent research suggests student apathy could lead to a narrow victory for the
*leave* campaign, swinging the vote by .5million in favour of quitting the EU.

The timing of the vote could see fewer student voters. Many universities will hold
graduation ceremonies on June 23rd. Students may also go to Glastonbury or even
away on holiday!

All the *leave* campaigners want is ....PARITY.

Its just amazing. Surely educated people with any sense of their own mind will see all of this for what it is and not trust the IN campaign. Also, the fact that the election was set for graduation day and the festival says it all.

The unelected and unaccountable EU commissioners are proposing new asylum policy rules...

European countries that refuse to give shelter to refugees could be forced to pay into the coffers of states that do, under plans to be unveiled by the European commission on Wednesday.

Countries that refuse to take in refugees would be required to pay EU states that are doing more. Although the sum has not yet been finalised, the draft law suggests “a solidarity contribution” of €250,000 (£198,000) per asylum applicant.

Source

We all know that the EU will get more expensive down the road, but this suggested £198,000 per asylum applicant is going to be a massive cost to the UK as I doubt Cameron will accept any refugees that have already made it to Europe.

Let's say 1 million new 'refugees' arrive, so that's £200k times 1 million refugees equals £200 billion!!!
This cost will be divided between the countries that refuse to accept the EU asylum seeker quota's, so not many countries at all.

How did they even come up with £198,000 per refugee? It would take me ten years to earn that much money!

Latest from Vote Leave:


Plans for EU army laid bare

A leaked German policy paper has revealed proposals to establish an EU army, clearly advocating plans for a joint headquarters and shared military assets. This would involve the UK surrendering control over our national defence to Brussels bureaucrats. The IN campaign claim that there are no plans for a European army, but this just adds to the evidence which discredits their protestations.

Jean-Claude Juncker has previously called for the introduction of an EU army, while the European Commission itself described EU defence integration as ‘not just a political option but a strategic and economic necessity’. The main party in the European Parliament, the European People’s Party, has now adopted www.euractiv.com... the creation of a single EU army as one of its manifesto goals.

This is yet another example of the EU’s relentless drive towards further integration. If we vote to stay in the EU, it means handing over more money and more power to Brussels. The prospect of having our defence policy dictated by the EU will be a huge concern to British troops as well as the public at large. It is clear that the safer choice is to take back control on 23 June.

Report shows PM’s renegotiation to be toothless

An analysis of EU migrants’ use of welfare benefits confirms that the Prime Minister’s trivial renegotiation will have no impact on migration. The Migration Observatory at the University of Oxford concluded that ‘a large majority of recent EU migrants are not claiming benefits of any kind’, which means that most migrants ‘would not be affected’ by David Cameron’s proposed changes to the welfare system. This echoes the view of Sir Stephen Nickell from the independent Office for Budget Responsibility, who told MPs that the PM’s welfare reforms will have ‘not much’ impact on migration.

The PM’s renegotiation will do nothing to affect the level of EU migration into the UK. Our NHS is already under huge pressure. How will it cope when Albania, Macedonia, Montenegro, Serbia and Turkey join the EU, granting 88 million people access to our public services? It is clear that the only way to take back control of our borders is to Vote Leave on 23 June.



Today’s must-reads

PM's EU benefits deal 'won't cut migration' - Mail
www.dailymail.co.uk... migrants-claim-handouts-arrival.html

EU executive to propose asylum reforms and approve Turkey visa deal - Guardian
www.theguardian.com...

Vote Brexit or we'll LOSE health service, warns top doc - Express
www.express.co.uk...

EU was designed to be United States of Europe, Brussels founder claims - Express
www.express.co.uk...

Computer gap lets 'tourists' disappear forever as EU opens door to 127 million - Telegraph
www.telegraph.co.uk...

Cameron’s deal changed nothing - Gisela Stuart MP, letter to Financial Times

I see my humour was lost on ATS.

No worries

originally posted by: bigyin
I see my humour was lost on ATS.

No worries

Of course not. Humour is always welcome.

Laugh at this is it helps

www.pollstation.uk...

a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

Yes looking good

The poll showing 80% leave is about right with the cross section of people I have spoken to even though that number only runs into the hundreds says that very few people actually want to stay. On a personal note I have a fair amount riding on the decision as I am one of the few Brits comparable to EU workers coming to the UK that "was" looking to relocate in the coming years.

Regardless of this I will not actually be in the country on the 23rd June but I have made certain my OUT vote will count by proxy, OR WILL IT?..

I honestly still see it as a pipe dream that we will leave regardless to what the vote really comes out as unless it is so high that it can't be fudged. It will no doubt lead to other EU countries requesting their own referendums and I can only see it leading to the end of the EU as we know it.

My current personal feeling is that the leave supporters are very active in voicing their opinion and I believe that there is a certain apathy from the stay voters. I can see the turn out for this vote being high as middle England is simply fed up with the "negative" aspect of what the EU has forced onto us. Roll on the 23rd.


RA

a reply to: slider1982

This is exactly what happened in Scottish Referendum. In the months, weeks, days leading up to the vote everyone you spoke to was for leaving UK. I only met a few people against it and they tended to be wealthy people who just wanted to maintain the status quo. Why would they want to change anything. Their lives were going just fine. But most other people wanted to leave. However, magically, the vote turned out slightly in favour of staying. Some say postal votes were tampered with. Ruth Davidson the Tory leader was questioned by Police when she let slip she was able to see postal votes before the referendum took place and new in advance the outcome.

I think the same will happen here. The vote will be magiced into slightly in favour of staying no matter who votes what.