UK Referendum 23 June 2016 - Will it be an EU BREXIT or Not?

a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

I said all polls can be manipulated not that this one was.

Given that you are not impartial it would be foolish to believe that the figures could not be manipulated in the same way any poll can and will be to suit the desired outcome.

originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: nonspecific
I do not trust any polling figures including this one as they can be manipulated so easily.

Also it seems to me that when a big decision is to be made then the projections fall foul at the last minute as many silent voters choos to keep the status quo and many who favour change bottle it at the last minute.

The Scottish referendum went a similar way I think and UKIP got far less support than the polls and ATS suggested at the last general election.

Agreed about the polls at the general election last year, they were way off.
Who knows though?

I am yet to find anyone in my social circles who is voting 'remain', just folk who are either definitely voting 'leave', are undecided, or don't care. The only people I know who would definitely vote 'remain' are my friends who are nationals of EU countries living and working here. They don't have the vote of course so their views are irrelevant.

It could be just a regional thing, I'm on the coast of SW England and the fishing quota rights issue is very much spoken about here. That said, my family and friends back home in South Wales are all voting leave, and tell me that is the sentiment of the majority of folk they know as well.

I do know a few folk who say 'undecided' in public, but privately say they will be voting leave. They have explained that the lame accusation of xenophobia and racist is the reason they are keeping quiet. I wonder how many other 'secret' leave voters are out there?

Again, who knows, but I'm hoping we will have a shock in June with a convincing vote to leave being the result.
Then the fun and games will certainly begin!

I am starting to think that a massive amount of people are simply scared to voice their opinion and just agree with whoever they happen to be with at the time.

Thinking back to the GE last year I remember you saying that pretty much everyone you knew was voting UKIP yet when it came to it they took a drubbing.

Is it possible that they are simply telling you what they want to hear through fear of an argument.

I am pretty sure that people do it to me but then I can be quite opinionated and maybe they just think it's easier to agree than have to listen to me bang on about how they are incorrect.

originally posted by: nonspecific


What would be considered a decent wage for what is although a pretty physical job something that requires little thought or intelligence though?

In my area bin men are all agency staff and get £9.25ph. There is no guarantee of work but if you are up and ready for a phone call at 5.30am and do not get work you still get half a days pay.

I wonder how many on here can remember when a capped overalled man came

through the front gate ... through to the back of the house and loaded on to his

shoulder a heavy metal bin full of ash and rubbish, walked all the way to the

street and emptied the heavy bin into a waggon. He didn't then leave it in the

street.

NO he carried the empty bin right back into the back of the house.

Happy days.........

originally posted by: eletheia

originally posted by: nonspecific


What would be considered a decent wage for what is although a pretty physical job something that requires little thought or intelligence though?

In my area bin men are all agency staff and get £9.25ph. There is no guarantee of work but if you are up and ready for a phone call at 5.30am and do not get work you still get half a days pay.

I wonder how many on here can remember when a capped overalled man came through the

front gate ... through to the back of the house and loaded on to his shoulder a heavy metal

bin full of ash and rubbish, walked all the way to the street and emptied the heavy bin into

a waggon. He didn't then leave it in the street, NO he carried the empty bin right back into

the back of the house.

Happy days.........

My Grandad was born into a very wealthy family but fell in love with one of the house maids, rejected his inheritance and moved into a council house and became a dustman. He was a well known and loved figure in the community and lived a poor but happy life.

SHOCK NEWS!

EUROVISION SONG CONTEST THREATENS UK BAN IF IT VOTES LEAVE!!
Overnight the grand council of the Eurovision song contest proposed a draft resolution to ban the UK from the competition in the event of a leave vote.
The decision is set to spark outrage across the nation and could even influence the vote, such is the strength of feeling...

Eurovision

...nah, I just made that up
Imagine though? I think even I would have to reconsider my vote if such doom was threatened to the UK lol

originally posted by: grainofsand
SHOCK NEWS!

EUROVISION SONG CONTEST THREATENS UK BAN IF IT VOTES LEAVE!!
Overnight the grand council of the Eurovision song contest proposed a draft resolution to ban the UK from the competition in the event of a leave vote.
The decision is set to spark outrage across the nation and could even influence the vote, such is the strength of feeling...

Eurovision

...nah, I just made that up

Imagine though? I think even I would have to reconsider my vote if such doom was threatened to the UK lol

I knew it was made up as soon as I started reading it. Without the B.B.C ploughing vast sums of money into Eurovision it would struggle to survive. Besides, the U.K had representatives in the competition long before we joined the E.U, and have many countries competing that are not in the E.U.

originally posted by: nonspecific
Thinking back to the GE last year I remember you saying that pretty much everyone you knew was voting UKIP yet when it came to it they took a drubbing.

I don't remember saying that fella. Certainly not as I am describing conversations I'm having with people about the EU right now.
I knew loads of folk voting Conservative, Labour, and Lib-Dem so I can't imagine that I said 'everyone I know is voting UKIP' because I don't make things up on ATS, I say it as I see it.
In my constituency UKIP came second after the winning Conservative candidate, and nationally they came third, hardly a drubbing.
Feel free to search for a quote from me to show I stated that "I don't know anyone in my social circles who is not voting UKIP" but otherwise I'd say that is just in your imagination. I know plenty of dyed in the wool tories and redski's.
I may well have said 'all my friends and family' because they did the same as me and voted UKIP.

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978

originally posted by: grainofsand
SHOCK NEWS!

EUROVISION SONG CONTEST THREATENS UK BAN IF IT VOTES LEAVE!!
Overnight the grand council of the Eurovision song contest proposed a draft resolution to ban the UK from the competition in the event of a leave vote.
The decision is set to spark outrage across the nation and could even influence the vote, such is the strength of feeling...

Eurovision

...nah, I just made that up

Imagine though? I think even I would have to reconsider my vote if such doom was threatened to the UK lol

I knew it was made up as soon as I started reading it. Without the B.B.C ploughing vast sums of money into Eurovision it would struggle to survive. Besides, the U.K had representatives in the completion long before we joined the E.U, and have many countries competing that are not in the E.U.

Is it any more absurd than some of the fear mongering being put forwards by both sides though.

There are some wild claims being made by both the "In" and "Out" camps and a lot of gullible people out there...

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978
I knew it was made up as soon as I started reading it. Without the B.B.C ploughing vast sums of money into Eurovision it would struggle to survive. Besides, the U.K had representatives in the completion long before we joined the E.U, and have many countries competing that are not in the E.U.

LOL!! Its like the EU over rated, out dated, over subscribed, and xenophobic.

originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: nonspecific
Thinking back to the GE last year I remember you saying that pretty much everyone you knew was voting UKIP yet when it came to it they took a drubbing.

I don't remember saying that fella. Certainly not as I am describing conversations I'm having with people about the EU right now.
I knew loads of folk voting Conservative, Labour, and Lib-Dem so I can't imagine that I said 'everyone I know is voting UKIP' because I don't make things up on ATS, I say it as I see it.
In my constituency UKIP came second after the winning Conservative candidate, and nationally they came third, hardly a drubbing.
Feel free to search for a quote from me to show I stated that "I don't know anyone in my social circles who is not voting UKIP" but otherwise I'd say that is just in your imagination. I know plenty of dyed in the wool tories and redski's.
I may well have said 'all my friends and family' because they did the same as me and voted UKIP.

Maybe I got that wrong then, no intention of putting words in your mouth.

I just remember that a lot of people were convinced that UKIP was going to do a lot better than they did because of conversations they had had and were surprised at the actual outcome.

originally posted by: nonspecific
There are some wild claims being made by both the "In" and "Out" camps and a lot of gullible people out there...

True, and it's cool that those gullible folk are reading newspapers which are strongly in favour of leaving the EU.
Murdoch may well swing it for us

What?!

Still no links to any threads with Bernard in them?

Come on people, cough up those links.

a reply to: grainofsand yeah good to have a tax avoiding non uk resident have so much influence on British politics. So much for uk sovereignty lol, but your not really concerned about that. I imagine.

originally posted by: woodwardjnr
a reply to: grainofsand yeah good to have a tax avoiding non uk resident have so much influence on British politics. So much for uk sovereignty lol, but your not really concerned about that. I imagine.

You are correct, I don't really care as I legally avoid as much tax as the law allows me to. Change the laws and I'll adapt.
...I'll take assistance from Satan if he/she were pro leave

a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

I voted early on in the thread. Perhaps my new avatar made you think I was new to the discussion.

a reply to: RP2SticksOfDynamite

I'm for Out...
You can't see the eyes of the demon.. until him come callin'.

a reply to: visitors

I don't see that - I see that those who don't like Europe really are just racist, and that is the core reason.

You cannot equate Europe and the EU. One is a land mass and the other is an undemocratic political union. I have worked in Europe and have many European friends. My concerns regarding the UK apply to other European citizens as well. I love being European. I loathe the EU.

I think they realise that the 'real' EU is actually something that won't let them get away with the evils they have been getting away with all along.

Please state what these evils are bearing in mind that they are purely subjective. Being forced to do anything without democratic process and transparency is tyranny.

That said (the sad truth that so many people are so bad, that they need things like being microchipped just to stop them

So you believe that any individual who does not meet your own perception of 'good' should be micro-chipped? You also mentioned going to hell so would your perceptions come from a religious stance?

Who does what good with all that data and all those numbers on people? It's just nosey for all the wrong reasons. You can't ever build a society worth living in on those sorts of basis'.

You are showing your ignorance. To dismiss Demography you would need a a sound knowledge base and the ability to critique. Yet you dismiss it out of hand with a simple subjective statement.

You don't know what paradox means if you think it applies to that situation.

It is a simple paradox. Some individuals refuse to take employment beneath their skill level as they think it is undignified. Not taking this employment as a temporary measure (until something more appropriate comes along) and relying on the state instead is actually far more undignified. I fail to see why you cannot comprehend that as a paradox.

The rest of your post is purely subjective, emotive, distorted and based on sentiment. Not really worth responding to and this would also derail the thread.

From all your posts, the only thing I agree with is that immigrants are not the cause of infrastructure disintegrating. You have the conservative austerity agenda to thank for that. The infrastructure is at a point where we cannot sustain a large influx of immigrants as this will cause a tipping point in the immediate future. The signs are already there, particularly with the NHS.

Rather than subjective and emotive arguments condemning Brexiters as racists, why not try to contribute as others have done. If you feel leaving the EU is a bad idea, provide some substance or articles which we can all read and comment on. I have done this several times. You can start by attempting to demonstrate how the EU is transparent and democratic.

a reply to: Morrad

Yep, out is good)

a reply to: grainofsand

a reply to: Morrad

Not sure if I'll be bothered reading all that - sounds like you have nothing better to do than ignore all the replies from the person you're replying to, and asking them to write them out all over again.

Most Euroskeptics are just racists.

Most stirrers in threads like this (see: the weird unexplained Bernard stuff) are astroturfers.

Your attitude smacks of holier than thou - you ain't holier than me. Don't post down to me, I've just been standing up against more tree murdering scumbags in my local council and their butchering prole workers that carry out their nazi-israeli oppression, noise polluting my neighbourhood and destroying what's left of the ecosystems.

If everyone was like me, the world would be prefect. No lowlife scum doing jobs that shouldn't exist - such as tree surgeons and butchering the environment.