Black hole simulation supports aspects of popular science fiction

originally posted by: Xeven

originally posted by: Triton1128
a reply to: andy06shake

I'm a fan of the white hole theory.. But have we found anything in our own universe that could be portrayed as one?

You would think with the amount of black holes we have in our universe, if each ended with a white hole on the other end, in another universe. We would see as many white holes here as black holes?

Well sun's are just theory how they work. They could be ejection ports from the center black hole.

you are not aware that we can tell the elemental make up of the sun, it's temperature, it's products, it's mass, and even replicate it in labs for long enough to verify it's internal processes. it's not a theory it is very firmly established in the realm of measurement and observation. there is no alternate "theory" that is even close to what we know- yes know; about how stars work.

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
I always wondered what might be so special about rotating black holes.

I mean, the gravitational forces should be equal to a static black hole, but how would the effects change while riding through the grav-tides of a monster like this?


Anyway, would this feel like a very hard *shock* to the whole spaceship? Or would it become (talking SRT now) a frozen *shooooooooooooooooo.. for eternity?

Ive been reading about rotating black holes as possible time machines for 20 years...never understood what makes a rotating BH so different to a static one. If only there was some sort of global network of information i could access at any time to find out...oh well. Ill go to the library tomorrow and read up about it and get back to you.

By the way, that wasnt a joke at your expense, it was at mine, for never bothering to look it up in 20 years.

originally posted by: 3danimator2014

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
I always wondered what might be so special about rotating black holes.

I mean, the gravitational forces should be equal to a static black hole, but how would the effects change while riding through the grav-tides of a monster like this?


Anyway, would this feel like a very hard *shock* to the whole spaceship? Or would it become (talking SRT now) a frozen *shooooooooooooooooo.. for eternity?

Ive been reading about rotating black holes as possible time machines for 20 years...never understood what makes a rotating BH so different to a static one. If only there was some sort of global network of information i could access at any time to find out...oh well. Ill go to the library tomorrow and read up about it and get back to you.

By the way, that wasnt a joke at your expense, it was at mine, for never bothering to look it up in 20 years.

generally it is easier and faster to find such things on the internet. You just need to know how to use proper keywords in your search engine (like google) and if the subject is obscured by junk how to use boolean operators such as - or not to exclude stuff you aren't interested in.

for example if i am searching for information related to gold prospecting in ravia oklahoma and because there is a famous singer (Gene Autrey) from there the search has pages of links to that famous person instead of my topic i can exclude all of the bogus links using booleans or the equivelent:

Search for: Ravia oklahoma gold ballard mine newspaper clippings -"gene autrey"

and the gabillion junk links (pages and pages of them) about gene autrey mostly disappear from the returned results.

there are very few topics you need to physically go to a library for anymore. ancient manuscripts or rare books or the like.

a reply to: Triton1128
This was figured out some 20 plus years ago.

originally posted by: stormbringer1701

originally posted by: 3danimator2014

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
I always wondered what might be so special about rotating black holes.

I mean, the gravitational forces should be equal to a static black hole, but how would the effects change while riding through the grav-tides of a monster like this?


Anyway, would this feel like a very hard *shock* to the whole spaceship? Or would it become (talking SRT now) a frozen *shooooooooooooooooo.. for eternity?

Ive been reading about rotating black holes as possible time machines for 20 years...never understood what makes a rotating BH so different to a static one. If only there was some sort of global network of information i could access at any time to find out...oh well. Ill go to the library tomorrow and read up about it and get back to you.

By the way, that wasnt a joke at your expense, it was at mine, for never bothering to look it up in 20 years.

generally it is easier and faster to find such things on the internet. You just need to know how to use proper keywords in your search engine (like google) and if the subject is obscured by junk how to use boolean operators such as - or not to exclude stuff you aren't interested in.

for example if i am searching for information related to gold prospecting in ravia oklahoma and because there is a famous singer (Gene Autrey) from there the search has pages of links to that famous person instead of my topic i can exclude all of the bogus links using booleans or the equivelent:

Search for: Ravia oklahoma gold ballard mine newspaper clippings -"gene autrey"

and the gabillion junk links (pages and pages of them) about gene autrey mostly disappear from the returned results.

there are very few topics you need to physically go to a library for anymore. ancient manuscripts or rare books or the like.

Dude...that was a joke. I've been browsing the Internet since 1994. I was making a joke.

originally posted by: 3danimator2014


Dude...that was a joke. I've been browsing the Internet since 1994. I was making a joke.

oh.

originally posted by: Phage

originally posted by: Triton1128

originally posted by: Bedlam

originally posted by: Triton1128

I guess the question now is, Where does one go that is unfortunate enough to be pulled into (through) one?!

Hell, of course. Did you not see "The Black Hole"?

No but Ill be looking into it now!

Don't. Awful. Really, really awful.

Oh, come now. I was pleasantly taken by surprise when Disney had someone buy it with a death chopper to the gut, followed up by running him through a bug zapper. Even though they covered up the actual..um..grinding part.

eta: Do you think there might be any truth to the rumor that Reinhart ending up inside the robot/demon at the end, it was a pun? Maximilian's shell/Maximilian Schell?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the event horizon isn't a real "thing" that could be removed or altered. It is simply the area around the singularity where gravitational attraction (caused by that singularity) is strong enough so that the escape velocity from that area is equal to the speed of light. There's no physical boundary there, like there is a shell around an egg or an atmosphere around a planet.

In order to remove the event horizon, you need to remove the singularity.

The thing I've always found intriguing is the different perspectives of two 'spaceships', one crossing the EH into a black hole and the other remaining outside to observe. Both ships are observing the each other. What they each observe is mind bending and rather chilling. (obviously overlooking all the nasty gamma and x-ray radiation issues, just for the sake of discussion about what each would observe).

originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
The thing I've always found intriguing is the different perspectives of two 'spaceships', one crossing the EH into a black hole and the other remaining outside to observe. Both ships are observing the each other. What they each observe is mind bending and rather chilling. (obviously overlooking all the nasty gamma and x-ray radiation issues, just for the sake of discussion about what each would observe).

Yes, it's quite something out of this world and purely sci-fi.

To an external observer, the traveller will seem to slow down in time and redshift out of sight, even before reaching the event horizon.

To the traveller, the external observer (as well as the rest of the universe) will start speeding up and getting blueshifted. The latter means that the EM radiation emanating from the external observer and the universe will get progressively higher and higher in energy, potentially reaching infinity at the singularity. Or perhaps it will even happen _at_ the event horizon, and crossing it will make your world explode in the immense flash of pure energy.

Perhaps that is what a white hole is.

a reply to: Xeven

Black holes are apparently formed from collapsing stars of sufficient mass. If we were to start to question how we believe stars are formed and/or operate then we would also need to question how singularities are created.

a reply to: andy06shake

Black holes may also be formed out of nothing but energy (see also: kugelblitz) or may occur if too many stars are too closely spaced. And that doesn't mean they have to be a lot closer than a typical dense cluster. Too much mass in too little space, and the whole thing wraps time and space around itself, and bob's your uncle.

One is left to wonder what would happen if the event horizon of one super-massive black hole intersected the event horizon of another super-massive black hole (?) There would no longer be a singularity then, but a 'duality'. Red shift and blue shift can't occur simultaneously.

Time would explode (right after all the theoretical physicists heads exploded) and the universe would turn inside-out.

...unicorns would prance around in the 9th dimension, and ATS'ers would all agree with each other (and if that alone isn't a mind bending concept, I don't know what is!)

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Once they come so close that they cannot escape each other's gravity they will merge to become one bigger black hole.

a reply to: andy06shake

It was a joke.

a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

I was just saying what i think would happen. I suppose even singularity's have there funny side, all trough it would be rather hard to observe.

originally posted by: wildespace
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the event horizon isn't a real "thing" that could be removed or altered. It is simply the area around the singularity where gravitational attraction (caused by that singularity) is strong enough so that the escape velocity from that area is equal to the speed of light. There's no physical boundary there, like there is a shell around an egg or an atmosphere around a planet.

In order to remove the event horizon, you need to remove the singularity.

based on interpretation you use. GR wise it is the point where the space time curvature becomes so great that there is no geodesic that actually leads out. that is a property of the local space time which can be counted as physical in a way. and it can have properties like spin and charge, soooooo.

originally posted by: stormbringer1701

originally posted by: 3danimator2014


Dude...that was a joke. I've been browsing the Internet since 1994. I was making a joke.

oh.

Gilda Radner eh? ..I like you Storm.

originally posted by: stormbringer1701

originally posted by: Xeven

originally posted by: Triton1128
a reply to: andy06shake

I'm a fan of the white hole theory.. But have we found anything in our own universe that could be portrayed as one?

You would think with the amount of black holes we have in our universe, if each ended with a white hole on the other end, in another universe. We would see as many white holes here as black holes?

Well sun's are just theory how they work. They could be ejection ports from the center black hole.

you are not aware that we can tell the elemental make up of the sun, it's temperature, it's products, it's mass, and even replicate it in labs for long enough to verify it's internal processes. it's not a theory it is very firmly established in the realm of measurement and observation. there is no alternate "theory" that is even close to what we know- yes know; about how stars work.

Where did the fuel come from?

originally posted by: Xeven





Well sun's are just theory how they work. They could be ejection ports from the center black hole.

Where did the fuel come from?

initially the fuel was the first hydrogen that congealed in the primordial universe. there were local density differences which led to gravitational attraction which led to accretion which led eventually to self ignition of fusion. then these first generation stars lived their lives and blew up releasing up to 90 percent of their original fuel for larger stars plus more complex elements. these created stellar nebulae from which successive generations of stars acquired sufficient fuel to ignite.

that said; I have since found where scientists have mused about what a star with a wormhole in it would look like. so you were not entirely in stream of consciousness land with your OP about stellar wormholes. bear in mind though that any star with a wormhole in it's center would have a different signature from a star without one and even if there were one the power source of the star would be fusion of the star's hydrogen.