A quick look at Spirituality/Religion

As humans we strive to make understanding of the world that surrounds us. Many ideas as to our origins, our energy, our coinciousness, and our purpose have risen over time. In any case we seem to embrace ideas which we cannot see as an answer to what we can see.

Now, I do not claim these ideas (Religions, spirituality, ect.) wrong, or right, but there is a pattern here. In the less modern times, we made an external strive for answers. We looked to the skies for answers. We took advice from the land, and nature to guide us. We had faith, and did not question . This type of "guidance" can act as a veil over our true purpose. We wanted to know what was out there, why it was there, and what for. This external strive left us with more questions than answers. Again I repeat that embracing religion is not the issue. But the limitation of knowledge, true answers to life, is.

In more recent times we made an internal strive for answers. We asked ourselves, we meditated, we searched deep within. But same as in religion, we are left with more questions than answers.

Both strives are great in theory, but lack weight. They both paint a beautiful picture of a finner purpose, a dimension of love, of energy. They both generaly teach that we need to be good to one another, love ourselves and things around us. In return, we are seemingly rewarded in the end.

No matter what theology we create, they seem to be attempts at justifying our existance, at looking beyond ones self, or within oneself for answers.

I really am trying not to sound like a negative Nancy, because I do not think these ideals are useless, only over fabricated. Use the tenants to guide you though life, but do not revolve your life around them. Do not blindly accept yet another theology that will mandate how we advance in society.

Right now maybe the world needs some motivation by these theologies. Some "awakening". Some reason to keep on looking for answers. Answers that we can only find though experiencing life for what it is, rather than what it isn't, or might be.

So is the point of life to love one another, to have a clean soul, to elevate to the next dimentions? Or is it just to live, to be, to experience? No other living thing questions why they are. They just are. Maybe we need to do the same.

Thanks for reading, please don't mistake this as me bashing your beliefs.

a reply to: DeadCat

I am not sure but, for me...

While listening to some really good tunes, for me, for a change...

I believe I was born for my Mom then my kids...that's it...

It's a real drawn out theory that I am sure no one has time for, hell I can hardly explain it myself.

Anyway, my purpose is as a "helper"...that's it, I am here for that purpose, everyday, everywhere I go, everyone I meet.

That simple. That's it.

I hope there's something on the other side of this and I hope it involves a beach and lots of alcohol!

There is objective right and wrong that is different than subjective right and wrong.

And many religion suffer from duality separation where you create one group vs another. This duality tool has been used by many souls thru the ages to control other people to do insane things.

The old testament is filed with it and Paul in the new testament is a great pusher of duality idea that following Jesus name will save you instead of being saved by proving what you are in behavior. Muhammad also used this duality tool to say he knew better than anyone else and was the real Prophet.

Politically Nazism and Zionism are also using this tool.

I do not know what you are after and what kind of connections you seek? Are you after few but very deep connections or are you after many easy extrovert connection? Do you want to learn self awareness and becoming self sufficient or do you want to have fun with other soul? You can always go the empath, energy placebo manipulation (Reiki/laying of hands), energetic body bliss state/kundalini awareness if that is what you want to experience.

a reply to: LittleByLittle

I'm after answers that I don't personally believe spirituality or religion help to find.

My main point of this post is that though we have searched for answers, we've come up rather short on answers other than "Be good to eachother." Which we can do without the additional questions, and talk of dimensions and gods.

originally posted by: DeadCat
a reply to: LittleByLittle

I'm after answers that I don't personally believe spirituality or religion help to find.

My main point of this post is that though we have searched for answers, we've come up rather short on answers other than "Be good to eachother." Which we can do without the additional questions, and talk of dimensions and gods.

Is it not enough to treat another being as yourself and want to create a symbiotic bond with another and see the same bond mirrored back to you?

If you do not want to seek beyond religions then don't. From my point off view there is no hurry.

a reply to: LittleByLittle

I believe them both to be distractions from what we consider real. It's all in good faith to treat one another equally, (Motivated by reward, or not.) But there is too much more to life than that.

Like I said, the tenants are unlimitedly useful, but the details are not, in my opinion, anything more than wishful or abstract thinking which hold no real weight in terms of truth than any other theology.

It's all about perspective, train of thought.

My hope is that religion and spirituality will become irrelevant, as we would be motivated by truth rather than reward. They do help people understand how to be a decent human being, but I hope that will be second nature in the future.

a reply to: DeadCat

Here , let me help you. You were put here on earth. They gave you this thing called religion, but was NOT called religion back then , it was referred to as the teachings or blessed. It was used as a TOOL to help humanity guide themselves thru lifes
Troubles. Thru the years the teachings have changed and stuff taken out and replaced to fit the times. The writings are a good TOOL to follow, it helps us thru our troubles. To change or alter the teachings will alter the perception of your lives in general and your children of the future. Something the Vatican will never tell you.

originally posted by: operayt
a reply to: DeadCat

Here , let me help you. You were put here on earth. They gave you this thing called religion, but was NOT called religion back then , it was referred to as the teachings or blessed. It was used as a TOOL to help humanity guide themselves thru lifes
Troubles. Thru the years the teachings have changed and stuff taken out and replaced to fit the times. The writings are a good TOOL to follow, it helps us thru our troubles. To change or alter the teachings will alter the perception of your lives in general and your children of the future. Something the Vatican will never tell you.

I agree. It's almost like we are looking too much into things. We are over analyzing our existance, or making radical claims of our reality based on these two things. Is it so hard to believe that we are here with no purpose but to live our lives? Is that idea not farfetched enough to be considered? It does leave a bland impression compared to god, or dimensions, but makes more sense in a way.

a reply to: DeadCat

Is people that are working hard on bringing this word and Its human habitants into another level of enlightenment. Humanity is not stagnant it has developed steadily since humans came to be.

The only reason we humans look for anything that helps to justified our existence is because we need reassurance that death is not the end of everything.

The only way to find about our own mortality beyond death is not from external forces, but from within, we only need to ask and the answers will come, depending how much information we can take as per individual.

As more human beings find the truth about themselves and life the world will become a better place.

We come a long way, we as humans has been around for a while, but our souls are eternal.

"I have tried in the last 45 years to preach the gospel in a way that makes sense to a spiritual seeker" says Reverend Richard Rohr.

I think the world could change direction if this 'stuff' is spoken in all 'religious' arenas - it points to the one 'god' everyone is seeking.
Here is the first talk that I saw the other day (for anyone who is interested).

It is well worth a listen but is a hour long.

originally posted by: LittleByLittle


Is it not enough to treat another being as yourself and want to create a symbiotic bond with another and see the same bond mirrored back to you?

Before you can treat another as 'yourself' - you must know what you are - if you have 'yourself' in mind as a symbol then you will have another in mind as a symbol. Both of these images (symbols) are untrue - they are assumptions of the mind.
When you know what you really are - you will not have any symbol in mind of what you are and no symbol of what the other is - there will be no conflicting images happening and there will be harmony.

a reply to: DeadCat

Experienced based spirituality will never become irrelevant since souls will have their own experiences of Synchronicity and non local information exchange thru entanglement and achieving the bliss state (called holy ghost/anointment in some religions). But it will one day be quantified how the mysteries are manifested in quantum physics. Spirituality and objective science do not need to be opposite and real spirituality from my point of view, is to seek "what is" on all levels of creation even if it is not the dogmas we are taught by many illogical humans.

Duality based religions will hopefully die out as souls become self aware and see the logical flaws in them. It is easy to see the flaws in the Abraham religions. Harder in other religions that are duality based.

I will give you an example of where Ghandi did not think his ideas thru:

An eye for an eye only ends up making the whole world blind.

If you do have a direct karma retribution for the actions someone do to another, it will evolve souls quickly to not take out another bodies eye since you will know that you will lose your own eye in the process. So the idea that the whole world would become blind is flawed since it does not take self awareness and self preservation into account. Some souls do think before they act and do look at the consequences of their actions.

I think Ghandi was a good soul but that do not mean he always got it right.

originally posted by: TNMockingbird
a reply to: DeadCat

I am not sure but, for me...

While listening to some really good tunes, for me, for a change...

I believe I was born for my Mom then my kids...that's it...

It's a real drawn out theory that I am sure no one has time for, hell I can hardly explain it myself.

Anyway, my purpose is as a "helper"...that's it, I am here for that purpose, everyday, everywhere I go, everyone I meet.

That simple. That's it.

I hope there's something on the other side of this and I hope it involves a beach and lots of alcohol!

And they are here to help yourself and others, some of critical important whether you've met them yet or otherwise. We all are any way we slice.

a reply to: TNMockingbird

Anyway, my purpose is as a "helper"...that's it, I am here for that purpose, everyday, everywhere I go, everyone I meet.

That simple. That's it.

I hope there's something on the other side of this and I hope it involves a beach and lots of alcohol!

See why I love you??

We're twins.

a reply to: DeadCat

Greetings,

The difference between most of the other "living things" on this planet and the Human entity is the aspect of self-awareness.

To attempt to rationalize a notion by comparing self-aware beings to beings who are growing and learning to become self-aware isn't very efficacious.

If you want to rationalize think about this, the point of life - as given by your scientists - is to reproduce and survive. You could say it is rational that the human body is programmed to have DNA mutations, cell death, etc... and inevitably death. If the point of life is to reproduce and survive then why is the body programmed to grow old and die? Could it be that it is efficient for life as a whole to keep going by making sure resources and space is plentiful and mutations and evolution continues onward? Sure, but why, then, is the design at that point a collective design of the whole? If it is collective then there must be a mindfulness or a overseer that has created a design that outstretches the confinement of a single body or cell and instead life as a whole - in order, of course, to see that this design is the most useful. What is this consciousness or this observer that see's the macrocosm so that the microcosm is efficient?

Likewise, if the body is made to live for a duration of time and then die then it may go against the notion that the point of life is survival and reproduction. There's a purpose for this duration, for this small blip of existence. Science can explain the point of life as survival but without purpose. Science can explain how and what but never why.

The reason there is a subtle, and obvious, attraction to spirituality, divinity, or metaphysics is because there is something there but what is it? Isn't there something you were supposed to be doing? Did you forget? Hmm.

Ego vobis valedico.

a reply to: DeadCat

We have to accept that we don't know how existence came to be. Religion is good when good people lead, but that is rare. They preach faith, which is like abandoning logic. I say that if you want to learn, you have to admit you don't know much and be willing to be wrong. We need to believe that something comes after death. But we won't know until we die. Hell is a scare tactic invented by Christianity. We shouldn't have to be afraid of punishment to be good people. Atheists who are good people are good for the right reasons. Religion should be an independent relationship with God, not a public display of righteousness. Good insight on Paul btw. Check out the thread Paul, a man used of God. I documented his deceitfullness quite well.

I agree that the morality of it is genuine and in no way stagnant. But to jump to radical conclusions like hell, purgatory, other dimensions, ect without some logical reason is what makes these conclusions purely theoretical, and why I feel like they shouldn't be treated as more than that.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

My aspiration would to be like you!
Souls of a feather transcend even the internet to search one another out for that feeling of community.

I am flattered my lady!

Stay warm!

a reply to: DeadCat

That was a nice read, Deadcat.

For me, the issue is also whittled down to the most important element: how we treat one another. Relational reality - or how we think, act, and otherwise understand ourselves (in light of our evolutionary and cultural history) is what ultimately matters.

The problem is, some people can't see this. The "original sin" could perhaps best be thought of as the way "social reality" has supervened upon 'dyadic reality'. The evolutionary psychologist Michael Tomasello developed the important idea that the human "psychological self" has two basic aspects. The older aspect evolved some 400,000 years ago in the transition from Homo Erectus to Homo ergaster. This period constituted the "dyadic consciousness", or what Tomasello calls "joint commitment". Our sensitivity to unconscious affective information developed during this period, so that each "I" functioned in terms of what would maintain a shared "we". Human beings are fundamentally controlled by a higher ontological substrate, a "we" that coordinates the placement of our awareness in terms of the "coherency" of the interaction. Each person 'searches' for a common ground, unconsciously, when interacting with the other. By doing so "shared meanings" consolidate, thus linking the body's of interacting biological systems.

But on top of this is culture. Culture developed more clearly about 150,000 years ago, and sped up 12,000 years ago at the start of agriculture. It has also transformed. Culture, originally, must have been symbolically contiguous with the underlying relational "homeostasis". When languages developed more fully, they gave expression to what they felt in the immediate interactions they had with one another. So the "symbol" system of early small band hunter gatherers must have been something like the fairy tale garden of eden; socially astute, attuned to relational cues; and fiercely egalitarian. Empathy emerged as the primary attractor, although, of course, being primates, there were bound to have been disputes from time to time, but they would be settled amicably and in terms that acknowledged the sanctity of the group.

Anyways, no, I very much enjoyed your post because you sound eminently sane to me.