Hudson Valley, Indian Point, Boomerang UFOs & the Stormville Flyers

originally posted by: Bybyots
a reply to: Caver78

...but has anyone slapped together a good reason the Hudson Valley was such a "hot spot" to begin with?

Massive deposits of magnetite?

or, consider that new York is right where the jet stream often rockets through during several parts of the year.

if you were launching a lighter than air craft similar in design to the ones in the links I supplied in my previous post and you ran into some bad weather while launching. would turbulent down pressure from the jet stream force your orbital ascender down into the lower atmosphere? where you might wallow around struggling to get your vehicle to stabilize before you begin to ascend again. consequently lots of people seeing you in the process.

it was at the height of star wars space defence program. what are the odds the military went to strange lengths and designs to get heavy objects, components, satellites, weapons, space station parts, God knows what else, into space clandestinely?

many witnessed reported seeing large craft of enormous size. often with steel girders and semi transparent skins with assortment of lights. sounds like a lighter than air vehicle to me. designed for heavy lifting into orbit.

the orbital ascenders in the links I showed are 6000 feet in length, over a mile long and boomerang or chevron shaped. hudson valley, Phoenix lights, heavy lift space program?

a reply to: BASSPLYR

According to Michael Schratt in his Star Shield Article

These huge craft were part of something called "Brilliant Buzzard"

............. This program dealt with setting up an electro-magnetic “shield” around the United States thereby effectively creating an “iron dome”. This would be accomplished by building gigantic boomerang shaped flying wing craft which could loiter over American cities. By “linking” the aircraft together, these craft would form a protective electromagnetic “umbrella” over the continental United States (something Nikola Tesla proposed over 100 years ago). This “shield” would render enemy ICBM’s ineffective and ultimately obsolete. In addition, directed energy weapons on-board the craft could also be used as an effective defensive deterrence. This system also allowed for real-time tracking of enemy targets as well as covert surveillance missions........

Now I am not saying this is definitely the answer to the Hudson Valley UFO wave. I'll leave that for everyone to make up their own minds on that one.

As stated earlier in the thread. There may well have been a number of different phenomenon being witnessed and this is why the reports are confusing.

a reply to: mirageman

Well, I agree with Schratts theory of the majority of the sightings during the Hudson Valley flap were likely to be some Star Wars era heavy lift Lighter than Air vehicles. I disagree on his connecting the name Brilliant Buzzard to the crafts. As he's previously called brilliant buzzard a bunch of different aircraft and seems like he's grasping at straws in regards to the name usage.

I also question the Iron Shield idea. That would take a lot of power to short out MRV's as they entered the continental US airspace.

But, what about instead of using a pair of triangles that are spread apart so one sits say at the alaska boarder and the other at the southern california boarder and then setting up a passive detection system between the two to see any enemy or unknown incursion to our airspace from other stealth systems?

Or, making a smaller very low observable (read practically invisible to most spectra) long loiter LTA vehicle that sits in the upper atmosphere and act like a data or signals transponder, maybe even do ISR.

a reply to: BASSPLYR

Any of the above look like possibilities. Ive got confused already because I swear I've seen a photo of one of the V shaped inflatables inside a hanger and it was big but not that big. I also recall the name ascender but I'm sure that was more a shuttle type thing. Anyway, the one in the photo was blue if that rings any bells.

The reports of steel girders and tubes and pipework underneath are interesting to me. A semi rigid LTA would most likely have some kind of tubular framework visible from below, maybe?

Another frustration is the triangle shape. It seems that's going to be the shape of more and more new aircraft in the future. Its obviously a good shape so its likely that there's already several different craft in operation. Sometimes when the only similarity is that "it looked like a triangle", I can't help but wonder which one of the fleet they've seen.
No one can agree about what it is because they're all looking for a single aircraft.
It helps muddy the waters too. Its a pretty stealthy craft if no one believes it exists even after they've seen it!

a reply to: Tulpa

I agree with your post. the smaller v shaped craft is the first stage airship. it's the smaller of the duo that will get the cargo into space, being on a few hundred feet across on each side. it lifts the cargo to what's known as the dark sky spacestation. it's several miles across and resembles a inflatable starfish. it hovers at 140,000 feet alt. from there it the cargo gets off loaded and transfered to the orbital ascender which is over a mile long. it then takes the cargo into orbit.

a reply to: BASSPLYR

So I'm not going nuts then. I had a theory that the "oceanic research" mentioned earlier was probably radar and maybe something to do with submarine communication.

I knew the US would never have retired the shuttle without first having a replacement up and running.
I'm pretty ignorant about the space program but I can't help wonder about stealth as a whole.
They've got bombers and fighters but what about placing troops and equipment?
Big LTA speeds in at high altitude, hangs around looking for the right spot and the right time then drops down at night. Switch to fan power so youre nearly silent, make the drop then straight back up?

Just an idea.

Some triangles are definitely planes. I saw one but I'm saving that for another thread.

a reply to: Tulpa

Pictures of their big balloons

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

yeah I think it's awesome they have a side program involving kids to get them interested in space and science.

originally posted by: BASSPLYR
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

yeah I think it's awesome they have a side program involving kids to get them interested in space and science.

I didn't know that.. that's awesome, to get kids involved with science through "fun".

Kev

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

yeah in one of the pong sat experiments kids donated sunflower seeds. they were flown around in orbit, given back to the kids, and the kids made a garden out of them.

www.jpaerospace.com...

www.jpaerospace.com...

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Thanks for those.
There's a really odd kinda angular, boxy thing that I have seen in the past that would fit the bill. But I'm a twerp and never noted the name.
Cheers.

originally posted by: JimOberg

That remains the key question -- how plausible is it that many many witnesses misinterpreted a group of moving lights as a large structured single object with mounted lights?

It IS indeed hard to believe.

As hard to believe that people see here a boomerang shaped UFO :

a reply to: mirageman

There are a number of articles about alerts at Indian Point on the web but nothing (I could find) about an overflight of something unidentified. That is unless it is linked back to Phil Imbrogno. Although I am not throwing all his work in the dustbin because he chose to misrepresent some of academic and military qualifications.

He did work with Bob Pratt and J.Allen Hynek on the book Night Seige and, whilst some of the high strangeness tales were left out at Hynek's inisistence, the Indian Point incident did make it into the book :

According to that 4 Cessna pilots were arrested according to Carl Patrick the plant's information office. But the police had no record of it.

I gave it a go, but couldnt come up with much either. I found 1 hit for [Gerry Culliton : 89 living in White Plains, NY. Who knows if even the right person. Hynek and Pratt of course wont be talking.

In one report, Imbrogno does claim to have a tape of one conversation, but it wasnt on the cufos.org site(kinda sparse website anyway).

I would say that in this case Imbrogno was reporting what he was told about the incident. But how much of it was actually true?

I agree as well, still it would be nice to have some extra confirmation. If you do accept the story, I dont think it likely that these 6 guards colluded to make up this wild tale though.

a reply to: mirageman

"theses witnesses, who were power station security personnel, have remained anonymous to this day as far as I know. All roads appear to lead back to Imbrogno as a source of this incident."

Weren't the witnesses in agreement, thus corroborating something mutually seen? And of course most ufo witnesses, especially those employed by high-security businesses with government ties, do not (because they cannot) reveal their identities. Thus it's not all down to Imbrogno, and not reasonable to imply that the incident has no evidence to support it.

a reply to: 111DPKING111

I don't have Night Siege but I've just had a look in one of my favourite books and it says the guards had shotguns and were waiting for orders to fire.

Are shotguns normal for defending reactors?

Maybe someone went to get one because they thought they were looking at an inflatable?

I'm still hoping to get round to buying Night Siege so maybe there's more details.
Cheers.

a reply to: 111DPKING111

I agree as well, still it would be nice to have some extra confirmation. If you do accept the story, I dont think it likely that these 6 guards colluded to make up this wild tale though.

Well thanks for the efforts. I would like some corroboration as well. But perhaps it's just not there. Although Imbrogno has been discredited to some extent I still think that Hynek would have said something if he wasn't happy about the report going in the book.

a reply to: Constance

Weren't the witnesses in agreement, thus corroborating something mutually seen? And of course most ufo witnesses, especially those employed by high-security businesses with government ties, do not (because they cannot) reveal their identities. Thus it's not all down to Imbrogno, and not reasonable to imply that the incident has no evidence to support it.

My view is that Imbrogno was told a story by these men. But what if they were secretly feeding false information because the government were hiding something they didn't want Imbrogno and the public to know?

That's why I'd like to see another story from a witness elsewhere other than in Imbrogno's work.

a reply to: Tulpa

I don't have Night Siege but I've just had a look in one of my favourite books and it says the guards had shotguns and were waiting for orders to fire.

You can read the relevant chapter online at Google Books (and help you decide whether to buy it or not)

Night Siege : Indian Point Report

a reply to: mirageman

Appreciate that thanks.
Went through a couple of DVDs today but I've not got anything new to add.
Will look forward to reading that later.
Cheers.

originally posted by: Tulpa
a reply to: 111DPKING111

I don't have Night Siege but I've just had a look in one of my favourite books and it says the guards had shotguns and were waiting for orders to fire.

Are shotguns normal for defending reactors?

I tried an image search for "security 1980s shotguns" and the first image came up with this gun with the subheading, "shotguns for defense". I had a different one in mind, but its close enough.

Main thing for me in the story, if untrue, you have the Sgt, Culliton, and the security guards who worked there all able to pop up and say, "wait a second... we never said that." Much easier for Imbrogno to falsify his education than lie about what other people are reporting.