Why did Communism fail in Soviet Russia?

originally posted by: nonspecific
Come off it, with your "connections" you would be the supervisors...

Yeah, imagine me and Networkdude running the show.

God help you all.

originally posted by: PublicOpinion
a reply to: optimisitcplanet

Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

The town co-operative does not distribute profits: any surplus is reinvested to create more jobs. Everyone in the co-op earns the same salary, €47 (£40) a day for six and a half hours of work: it may not sound like a lot, but it's more than double the Spanish minimum wage.

Spain's communist model village

So yeah, yes indeed. It would work. It does in Andalusia, though.

The issue with communisim is simply one of numbers.

There are many instances of a communist style communities, many "tribes" work on communist type ideologies and as long as the popultion remains low enough it can work perfectly.

The problem comes when the numbers rise to a point were corruption and greed can flourish.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: nonspecific
Come off it, with your "connections" you would be the supervisors...

Yeah, imagine me and Networkdude running the show.

God help you all.

You would be shot on the first day of the revolution.

originally posted by: nonspecific
You would be shot on the first day of the revolution.

Most likely by myself.

It failed the same way capitalism eventually fails and Democracy’s fails, Monarchy’s fail and Republics eventually fail

Human nature sucks.

It in our nature to corrupt things and screw everything up.

And the more centralised a economic and/or government system is the more easy it is for humans to corrupt it.

a reply to: optimisitcplanet

It's a system that doesn't work and it was applied by men who abused it too. Man*, in his very nature, is not equal with others so trying to bend people to an abstract system cannot work.

Capitalism isn't working that well either, but it's working better than any alternatives I can think of. The pursuit of endless profit isn't good for humanity any more than homogenising us all to a system of imposed equality.

Ironically, the privilege and wealth pyramid is probably very similar in either system.

* Archetypal 'Man' includes women too

Most of you think of Stalinism or Maoism as Communism.

They are so only in name, never in practice.

Stalin was not a true communist; he was an autocrat.

Mao may have been, but then sadly, he won, took over control and became "The New Boss."

True Communism is an socio-economic political IDEAL.

Pure IDEALS don't work in practice.

Balance is the only workable solution.

originally posted by: optimisitcplanet


Imagine a small city with 5000 people.

Thats were you fail.

A small citys yes.

A country of 50 million or a 100 milion? It falls apart as some sociopath will use the centralised systems to climb to power and wreck havoc like Stalin.

a reply to: Gryphon66

originally posted by: markosity1973

originally posted by: optimisitcplanet
Also I love the idea that
1. Everybody is treated equal
2. People would have to work together
3. People would have to give out of their hearts to the less fortunate

Its seems like utopia doesnt it? But i know in history it is told that communism doesnt work. Does anyone want to tell me why?

Because all of the above was a lie.

1)The state was Atheist and iron willed about it.
2) People were reduced to a function
3) People were forced to work together.
4) Those who disagreed with the system were considered enemies of the state and exiled or executed.
5) There was no wealth because all of society was dragged down to the lowest common denominator, while those in power lived in absolute luxury.
6) To keep the lie going, everyone spied on everyone and reported on each other.

But beyond that , yeah communism was great

Star for you, you beautifully nailed it! Nothing for me to add...

a reply to: nonspecific

When numbers are the problem, you only need to decentralize anything into small blocks on regional level.

Corruption and greed is more the individual problem of egomaniacs, humans tend to act different on that occasion. We'll need some checks and balances to work that out, but I guess it is possible.

Humans tend to share and love to achieve things together, al least that's my experience. I can think of many ways how that would play out nicely.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Even anarchy was possible for a short time before the war ruined Spain.

True love is another ideal, which actually works. Doesn't it?

Communism can work on a small scale if you have free will and everyone in the group works together for a common goal. Communal farm communities where people live on land work the farm for food and share the profits equally would work. When greed and oppression take over its over, its no fun anymore, right. In Isreal they have commune Kibbutz that work Amish have communities that are similar to communes so do quakers. Stalin and Mao were psychopaths that wanted control.

a reply to: Kandinsky

Capitalism isn't working that well either, but it's working better than any alternatives I can think of. The pursuit of endless profit isn't good for humanity any more than homogenising us all to a system of imposed equality.

It's working quite great with regards to the destruction of our planet. Yep.

We do have a system of imposed equality, at least we all ought to believe that. Actually some are more equal than others, which makes it rather fascist in some extremes. Just give it a try and get jailed for some minor BS!

I think you didn't even think of alternatives yet. Well... it's without alternatives as Mutti would say. *Raute*

You really start to believe that, don't you?

a reply to: PublicOpinion

Of course I've thought of alternatives. The big thing that messes up ideology and wishful thinking is human nature. We want different things, we have opposing ideas and the 'greater good' is a concept we can't agree upon.

Here you are, prepared to become aggressive because you've projected some sort of mental Gestalt upon me.

a reply to: Kandinsky

Nah, don't get me wrong just 'cause I'm highly provocative whilst poking your opinion with a stick. On a personal note I actually like you, I just happen to disagree with you here strongly.

I can see the common good in wanting different things and arguing opposing views. All we need is a framework to agree upon and real equality (of education, chances and responsibilities) would be a great start. Don't ya think?

a reply to: optimisitcplanetCommunism failed because Russia could not outspend America. Most monies in Russia go to defense spending. President Regan simply outspent the Communist on defense spending and bankrupted the country. With no money to support people the idea of Communism failed.

Technology is slowly coming to the point where you can create abundance with lots of things for all. When that happens greed in power pyramid schemes will at last be unacceptable to all and symbiotic systems will evolve instead of parasitic power pyramids.

Communism in Soviet failed since it became a state controlled capitalistic scheme that did not use the resources well and destroyed it's nature/habitat just like the western world did.

It seems no one here actually read Marx. Communism failed because it was supposed to happen naturally out of the most modern advanced capitalist state. Not a rural peasant culture.

Marx assumed communism was going to happen naturally as capitilism consolidated wealth to less than 1 percent of the states population. At that point the elite would have little understanding of how to physically produce anything by themselves and the workers would revolt and begin creating things for themselves through barter and leave out the wealthy.

This is a simple answer to a massive book in his manifesto but that is the basic presumption Marx made. Since he lived before the height of technology he did not realize the effect and control that could be established by the goverenment through subversive and propaganda techniques and military control.

There was never actual communism practiced. None of the so called communist countries actually did or formed from what Marx described in his manifesto. They were just fascist goverenments in disguise as communism.

And it was probably a pipe dream that would take a thousand years to realize.

The soviet union failed because of the low price of oil in the mid to late 80s. They made a large portion of their economy from exporting oil. They could not afford all their spending. No money, no power.

the one percent run communist countries too and the peon don't have much chance of climbing the ladder.
You better read up real carefully before deciding to favor communism.