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originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: Azureblue
At the end of the 19th Century, also known as the 1800's, the individual in every country possessed the money and intellect to be become the master of his own fate.
Jim Crow. Child labor. Tenement life. No Irish Need Apply. Triangle fire. Let's not even look at what life was like in China or Africa. Oh, and passports would come in and out of style depending on the state of international relations. After WWI they became permanent and universal. About the only thing you got right was that Germany was the first state to look after its workers. They still have some of the most progressive non-socialist labor policies.
The US population rose much faster than the world population, passing from only 5 million in 1800 to 23 million in 1850 to 76 million in 1900 to 151 million in 1950 to 281 million in 2000. In other words, the US population has been multiplied by 56 in these 200 years, as opposed to 6 for the world population (from 1 to 6 billion).
www.eupedia.com...
originally posted by: crazyewok
originally posted by: nwtrucker
Much of our Constitution and Bill of Rights originated in France...
Actually wrong.
Most of it orginated here in the English Bill of rights in 1689 even your right to bear arms.
The problem in 1776 was the British were just not following it!
originally posted by: Semicollegiate
originally posted by: Azureblue
originally posted by: Semicollegiate
The Beginning of Socialism
At the end of the 19th Century, also known as the 1800's, the individual in every country possessed the money and intellect to be become the master of his own fate.
few.
At the end of the 19th Century, also known as the 1800's, the individual in every country possessed the money and intellect to be become the master of his own fate.
A very big statement to make???
As big as the Industrial Revolution, the Renaissance, and the Rights of Man.
I wonder what evidence exists to prove that no people of low IQ, people who were 'fringe people' people who for so long as they had their family around them they are OK but left alone in the world, they would not be able to fend for themselves.
No one does well left alone in the world. Individuality is enabled by a diverse, complex, and impartial market economy. Charity has always received more money when gov has demanded less taxes.
Might it be based on "because I did'nt know about it, therefore it didin't exist' type thinking.
Perhaps its just a convienient truth.
Im not sure what drives this 'welfare for individuals is bad'
Transfer payments do not promote the genuine welfare. "Welfare" is propaganda. The poverty rate decreased every year until "Welfare" started. Since "Welfare" began, poverty has increased, mostly due to the economics of guns and butter, but "Welfare" clouds the issue and "Welfare" is used to justify increased State power and control over all human life.
but if people who are anti welfare for individuals only knew that if banks can create money out of thin air so can goverment and create all the money required in the economy, including incomes for all, just by reserving for the people of the nation, through themselves, the power to create credit outa thin air just like the banks do.
I often wonder if people who are anti welfare for individuals are just as anti corporate welfare, that is, even if they are aware of its existence which I doubt because the man and the lady on the TV dont talk about corporate welfare do they?
The Welfare system is part of the Welfare Warfare package deal of modern government. As is the waste of time mainstream media and crony banker capitalism.
Socialism centralizes and sustains power in the hands of the fewest and makes all of the cronyism easier.
The cronies made socialism. Socialism is a con.
originally posted by: Semicollegiate
"been a part of" lacks any relevance. Crony capitalism uses politics. The free market is devoid of politics. Crony capitalism uses Socialism better than socialists do.
There has been, is essence, a free market in newly invented goods. Can't make regulations about them until they take shape and performance characteristics.
During the Industrial Revolution in America, Bakunin said "America already has Anarchism" That means the Industrial Revolution in America happened in a very close to free market.
Wanting is not proving that socialism is more than a dream.
originally posted by: greencmp
Socialism is an economic system which is entirely dependent upon the beneficent guidance of omniscient rulers and omnipotent enforcement.
The U.S. Bill of Rights was heavily contributed to by a collaboration between Jefferson and Lafayette in France
originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: MystikMushroom
a reply to: Krazysh0t
What makes it socialist? Last I checked we had a capitalist economy. Are you going to say welfare? China and North Korea have welfare too.
originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: Krazysh0t
Why are you bringing up their style of government? When I brought up ours you said it's not the same thing. Contradict yourself much?
China and north Korea have social services JUST LIKE WE DO. So they are socialist too. You can't go one way when you want and another when something else throws a wrench in it.
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
originally posted by: Semicollegiate
"been a part of" lacks any relevance. Crony capitalism uses politics. The free market is devoid of politics. Crony capitalism uses Socialism better than socialists do.
This sentence isn't really saying anything. Crony Capitalism has been with us since the founding of the country. That simple fact says that we've never had a totally free market. So your claim about such things is false.
There has been, is essence, a free market in newly invented goods. Can't make regulations about them until they take shape and performance characteristics.
True, but that isn't the entire market. Just that one product. Plus it'll be regulated eventually as soon as unscrupulous businessmen use it to exploit the public and get caught. That's usually how those things come about.
During the Industrial Revolution in America, Bakunin said "America already has Anarchism" That means the Industrial Revolution in America happened in a very close to free market.
Starting with the Excise Whiskey Tax in 1791 the government has been meddling in the economy ever since. Alexander Hamilton created the First Bank of the United States? Do you know what that was? It was the first Federal Reserve.
First Bank of the United States
Bakunin was CLEARLY exaggerating about anarchism because you cannot have a totally free market with a government in charge. It is simply something you'll have to get your head around.
Wanting is not proving that socialism is more than a dream.
Do you have anything to say about Socialism besides empty rhetoric that sounds insightful but really isn't? You can't just say that Socialism doesn't work and be correct. You actually have to demonstrate it.
originally posted by: Semicollegiate
a reply to: Krazysh0t
we actually performed better economically while under a stronger Socialist net.
Empty rhetoric, the call to arms of the socialist.
originally posted by: Semicollegiate
a reply to: Krazysh0t
we actually performed better economically while under a stronger Socialist net.
Empty rhetoric, the call to arms of the socialist.
That was due to an increase in population which was only averted from mass famine death by the industrial revolution. That is the efficient distribution of essentials that would have been impossible before cheap steel structures and faster transportation.
There was no need for passports before WW1 so there was no need for passports after WW1 unless the peace was screwed up by centralized power. What is the need for passports in peace time?.
Progressive non-socialist is an oxymoron. Please explain the distinction without a difference.
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: Krazysh0t
Why are you bringing up their style of government? When I brought up ours you said it's not the same thing. Contradict yourself much?
China and north Korea have social services JUST LIKE WE DO. So they are socialist too. You can't go one way when you want and another when something else throws a wrench in it.
China and North Korea are Communist. Like I said, there is some overlap but there IS a difference, even if you don't want to see it.
originally posted by: Vector99
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: Krazysh0t
Why are you bringing up their style of government? When I brought up ours you said it's not the same thing. Contradict yourself much?
China and north Korea have social services JUST LIKE WE DO. So they are socialist too. You can't go one way when you want and another when something else throws a wrench in it.
China and North Korea are Communist. Like I said, there is some overlap but there IS a difference, even if you don't want to see it.
And in which case makes us a capitalistic constitutional republic, not a socialist state.
originally posted by: nonspecific
originally posted by: Semicollegiate
a reply to: Krazysh0t
we actually performed better economically while under a stronger Socialist net.
Empty rhetoric, the call to arms of the socialist.
So do you have any evidence to suggest that Krazyshot is incorrect or do you just dislike socialism?
originally posted by: Vector99
originally posted by: nonspecific
originally posted by: Semicollegiate
a reply to: Krazysh0t
we actually performed better economically while under a stronger Socialist net.
Empty rhetoric, the call to arms of the socialist.
So do you have any evidence to suggest that Krazyshot is incorrect or do you just dislike socialism?
Pointed out that China and North Korea have social services as well. Krazy is saying that is what makes us socialist, so by definition then so are China and North Korea.
Neither is true, Those are communist governments and we are NOT a socialist society.