A new prototype of China's J-20 has rolled out and taken flight

Folks,

We have a new prototype of the J-20 rolled out.

I'm a bit too tired to go digging into the photos right now to see what has changed. I suspect there are some nontrivial changes though. Anyone here up for doing a quick and dirty eyeballing?

That the Chinese invested into another prototype goes along with the Su-35 implications we were discussing before: they need more work before the J-20 is ready for prime time and needed the Su-35s to bridge the gap.

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8 flying now, Seems the canopy has gotten a coating?

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a reply to: FlyingFox

Looks like they found out that inlet shape is pretty important.

Wow. That's not a small change to the inlet area. It looks like a total redesign.

What it looked like:



What it looks like now:

a reply to: Zaphod58

Do you think some of these changes were planned, as in get the first ones out there to show they can do it, then later on fix up the rcs/engines/etc.?

a reply to: Bfirez

It's possible, but based on the time it has been and the lack of news I'm leaning towards finding something and having to do a redesign. That's not going to be an easy retrofit by any stretch of the imagination if they go back and fix the others.

a reply to: Zaphod58

Definetly seems to be a fly first, finalize later approach. Wonder whether that's on purpose or not though.

a reply to: Bfirez

If it is on purpose, this is one of the biggest changes I've seen.

a reply to: Zaphod58

....not seeing a whole lot of difference
can you point them out for me?

a reply to: fartlordsupreme

Just forward of the inlet, below the canopy there's a sensor or something that has been added or altered.

a reply to: Zaphod58

yep see it now

not necessarily a huge change or even a permanent one though (i actually really doubt that whatever it is will be permanently located there)
youve got way more experience though so if you disagree why?

a reply to: fartlordsupreme

You usually see minor changes as different prototypes roll out and better ways are found, but not changes like this.

Usually when a program is this far along the design is pretty well locked. Generally things are placed where they're going to be on the final design. You don't normally see changes this significant, because it's going to be difficult to go back and install it on the earlier platforms, unless they're not going to be brought up to production standard and are only test articles.

The Chinese has still a problem they don't have a very performant engine in it.

a reply to: Zaphod58

yeah but you dont even know what it is
it could just be there for testing purposes and isnt actually intended to be on the craft period when all is said and done

a reply to: fartlordsupreme

In all the years I've been watching development I've never once seen something temporary put on an aircraft at this point. The first or second aircraft, early in the program yes. The 8th aircraft, this late, never.

It appears that they redesigned the DSI bump to make it more effective and give the engine better performance.

a reply to: Zaphod58

They may realize they have problems and are going to take the time to fix them.

It would also explain why they are buying the Su-35s.

a reply to: anzha

The EOTS aperture looks to be not installed yet either. In all the recent pics I've seen it looks to be painted the same as the rest of the aircraft and like Zaph mentioned I'll bet they are trying to get as much out of their Russian engines as they can with the DSI mods.
Looks like they have a long list of things that aren't ready for prime time on that aircraft.

Looks like they re designed the body of the fighter too.

it looks different. there around the intake.

One thing is clear... They are learning really, really fast. And they're clearly willing to throw manufacturing capacity at it to try new things. That's a recipe for rapid improvement.

They've got some serious challenges to overcome. I don't think this actually have an RCS that small, I think they are using this as a development platform. The engine nozzles are still round and appear to have no scattering geometry nor Low RCS coatings. That alone makes this a pet project. Perhaps they're waiting to pop in a different powerplant all in one modular replacement, but the F-22 has a RCS of a pinball. This aircraft with those nozzles is like two airborne 55 gallon drums. Plus, their is a canopy bow. It looks like they have tried to emulate the geometry of the F-22 without fully understanding how to drive RCS down to bird-sized levels.