China not afraid of war with USA - Homeland invasion and occupation now possible!

Lets look at it calmly

Does the US have enough troops to do a boots style invasion of China? Nope

Does China have enough troops to invade the US? Nope

Does China currently have enough financial power to seriously mess with the US? Yep

Does the loss of US (and friends) markets to the Chinese serious mess with their markets? yep

Its just going to be a cold war with rice wine rather than vodka as both sides have nukes and neither's going to get that wound up to start pushing the button.

The main thing is that the US arms industry needs enemies to earn its existence as who the hells going to pay a 100 million for a jet fighter if theres no red under the bed

a reply to: StargateSG7

But, Barack Obama and Democrats have been in charge for the last 8 years. How could we possibly be weak on the world stage???

The Chinese attacking the US military would be a terrible investment considering the fact they are buying skyscrapers here and oil fields and even water.

There is no way China can get to the United States by land or troops period.

The United States have high tech drones that can take out anything without losing a single soldier.

China propaganda is getting a little silly here.

originally posted by: thinline
All the need to do is land in Mexico and the could walk North and right past the non guarded boarder and then they could get driver licenses, vote, and have over one kid. The my could take over without firing a shot

How they gonna get over the Great Wall of Trump?

originally posted by: Daalder
I hope Americans are actually arrogant enough to think the Chinese wouldn't succeed.
Remember: your 'enemy' succeded, with a communist regime, where you didn't.
If you don't believe me. Ask a hungry, homeless Chinese.

I am a centre left socialist not a communist but have you ever heard of the Cultural Revolution, millions starved to death under Mao's policy's, today Communist party lacky's are more like gangsters in the way they treat there own people and corruption runs rife in china, it does everywhere but as a point there system is not better and indeed it is not even communism but it is a coporpate style of imperial control with the supposed communist elite forming the NEW chinese imperial mandarins and nobility.

I do not want to see a war but China is acting aggressively in it's take over of territory, we made that mistake in the past now how do you think the future will view the current chinese imperial policy's and there bullying of other nation's, if the chinese used there intelligence instead and simply bought those nations none of this would be happening but they did not and it is.

I am not saying that america is perfect or that it's foreign policy has not been utterly crap for the past 40 years but remember china too invaded vietnam and they too got there arses kicked, in fact the Yank's did a better job and only pulled out just as they were on the verge of victory over the vietnamese communists as a new president had come to power whom wanted the war over as it was an election promise.

North Korea would not exist as a seperate nation but it was propped up by both the Soviet's and the Chinese, indeed the allies ended up fighting Chinese soldiers disguised as Koreans when china sent there army in just as the Korean communists were about to flee into exile in China.

I know an old SAS man whom knelt in a frozen slushy stream for four days #ing and pissing in his pant's and not moving in order to stay hidden in order to pick off a target behind the lines in Korea during the war, his target was a Russian and I have heard of another whom crept inside a north vietnamese camp in order to take out his target, that is and example not of technological or quantitive superiority but of definite qualitive superiority, cut the head off the snake.

Believe me the US would win but not if they played a namby pamby nice guy and don't tread on the flowers kind of war as they did in Afghanistan or Iraq, no they would need to go in as Soldiers and do the Job they are meant for as Soldiers, war is war not peace keeping or reconstruction.

The chinese WOULD resort to Chemical and perhaps even Biological weapon's if there nuclear capability was nutralized but then that would allow the US and NATO to use our own stock piles, Did you know that the US most definitely already has Neutron bomb's so whom is going to have there power grids shut down? if it comes to a world war typle scenario.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: thinline
All the need to do is land in Mexico and the could walk North and right past the non guarded boarder and then they could get driver licenses, vote, and have over one kid. The my could take over without firing a shot

How they gonna get over the Great Wall of Trump?

There army of wildlings and giants

a reply to: kenzohattori69

Nope, I am not even a yank and I am a Socialist but I can see the writing on the wall and the chinese can become very bad news unless they are curtailed and fast.

originally posted by: crazyewok

There army of wildlings and giants

Not unless Stannis Trump rides in at the last minute with the Oath Keeper Knights and mows them down at the border.

a reply to: schuyler

A billion angry, and hungry, people to worry about.

Not sure how many of the higher ups remember the Long March, but that's the sort of thing they'd be looking at. Personally, I think it's only a matter of time before that happens anyway, but this would really speed that up.

a reply to: Informer1958

So have we the Brit's but we don't hear about it.

Drones have limitations and can be hacked, EMP can disrupt there command and communications as can standing radio frequency blocking systems meaning even a shielded drone has to then rely on it's programing.

There is no substitute for human intelligence (And lack of it or we would not be in this potential scenario in the first place).

I wan't peace but in order to have it one side has to back down or surrender, backing down is not always the correct course of action as the bully then just comes and takes MORE.

Homeland invasion and occupation possible?

Well.... I guess it's possible. It's not at all likely to succeed even if it were tried. I don't think the Chinese and Russians would be very optimistic about the outcome either.

Here's the thing. You can have all the fancy looking equipment and personnel numbers you like. But there's one walk you can't fake, and that's experience at the ground level. The U.S. trumps every other nation by a mile in this department. Every single generation in the U.S. has at least some kind of war time experience.

Myself being an OIF / OEF guy can easily assimilate with any Desert Storm or Vietnam guy and we'll have at least some form of cohesion. We'll understand call signs, basic TTP's and SOP's, and, in general, how combat actually works at the ground level. This is something Russia and China don't really have.

I believe this is a common attribute of empire building. You do whatever you can to ensure that every generation has their war time skills honed and it makes it very difficult to unseat you as a dominant power. It may or may not be a conscience decision, but it seems to be a theme easily observed.

And let's not forget the massive amount of weapons and ammunition in this country. If any country were to even attempt to actually pull off an invasion and subsequent occupation, they'd be setting their land forces up to be swarmed and slaughtered. Period.... End of story.

originally posted by: Tiamat384
a reply to: StargateSG7
I'll need sources for those pieces of information please, otherwise this is just doom porn.

----

Here some pretty good General and Academic
resources used for my estimates:

"...China has done it again. In early March,
it released its defense budget for 2015,
and as in almost every year for over
almost two decades, it increased its
military expenditure by double-digit
percentages. This year, the Chinese
defense budget will rise by 10.1
percent, to roughly $145 billion.
And it seems likely that the trend
will continue, much to the concern
of Washington and regional capitals. ..."

Source:

Foreign Affairs Magazine Weblink:
www.foreignaffairs.com...

----

China’s Defence Spending Almost Doubles by Close of Decade, IHS Says

"... China is forecast to spend $260 billion
on its annual defense budget by the end
of the decade, according to a study
published on Wednesday ahead of a
spectacular military parade this
week in Beijing. ..."

Source is IHS is Republican-oriented think tank
that owns the following publications and
political information depositories:

Jane's Information Group
Cambridge Energy Research Associates
Carfax
RootMetrics
IHS Global Insight Inc.

IHS 2020 Forecast Weblink:
press.ihs.com...

---

A Peek Into the 'Black Box' of Where China’s Hefty R&D Budget Goes

"...The amount of money China spends annually on research and
development has tripled since 1995—reaching $163 billion
in 2012, or 1.98 percent of GDP. ..."

Source is Bloomberg Business Story Weblink:
www.bloomberg.com...

---

PLEASE NOTE: A very general comment from current sources
within my own personal HumInt network (which won't be
disclosed here!) is that from 8% to 15% of the general
(i.e. Chinese Business and Government-sponsored lab)
budgets is comprised of PURELY PLA (People Liberation
Army aka the overall Chinese Military) expenditures
that is "Off-The-Books" and are NOT part of the
official budgets as detailed in my earlier outlines.

That would make it from $13 BILLION to as much as
$24.45 BILLION on absolute US dollar terms for the
Chinese "Black Budget" which must be ADDED to the
official $145 Billion 2015 Military Budget which
make the actual military budget of China around
$170 Billion on absolute US dollar terms.

...BUT...you must also take into account
statistical methods used for the accounting
of country vs country US dollar equivalencies
for specific areas of a given economy.

Using methods from global accounting firms such
as KPMG and even the US General Accounting Office,
(i.e the GAO) Salaries of mid-level Chinese reseachers
and engineers as of 2015 are still 1/3rd of
the US salaries. Operating costs of enlisted
personnel and low-level technicians, fuel
costs and capital costs of running China's
military systems such as ships, planes
ground vehicles is STILL only 1/4th of
the US operating cost levels.

And due to LOCAL MATERIAL COSTS and China's
current economic lock on certain militarily
sensitive metals, minerals and construction
materials, those costs are up to 1/6th of
those in the USA!

That averages out to about
a 1/4.33 cost advantage which
is then converted to a US
dollar true equivalent
output formula which
means that for every
ONE BILLION DOLLARS
spent, China get 4.33 times
the number of goods than when
the USA spends ONE BILLION DOLLARS!

One other thing is that academic levels
have been rising on a STEEP SLOPE in China
in the last 15 years which means those
military students and enlisted personnel
AND research and development personnel
are getting better and better each year
on a qualitative level

No, just no. China does not even have the ability to invade Taiwan, and as of right Japan's Navy alone would be an even fight for China. Their are certain realities on the ground.

1. To invaded the US you would need a ton of air support. As the US Air force is the largest in the world and the US Navy has the second largest air force in the world. China would need 20 to 30 real aircraft carriers to even try something.

2. China would need a new fleet as the Chinese navy is mostly made up of smaller older ships, its sub fleet would require heavy modernization so that these ships could said to US and engage and defeat the US Navy.

3. Logistics, China would need to build a massive amount of logistical ships and aircraft, far beyond what the US currently has.

4. Military is to small. China has about 2.3 million active duty forces. On China's borders are the hostile states of India 1.3 million men, Vietnam 482,000 men, and Burma 406,000 men. It also has borders with unstable states like North Korea, Afghanistan and Pakistan. It also has another dozen states on its borders that have be secured and internal troubles in both Tibet and Xinjiang, Along its coast it also has not friendly states like Japan, Brunei, Taiwan, and the Philippines. China's military is stretched thin just defending China.

5. China's Army in need of reforms. China has a large, mostly non mobile Army that is for the most part out of date and poorly trained. The problem for China is two fold. Corruption, China's military for a very long time was require to run business to support itself. Companies to farm and supply food, equipment, housing etc. This created a problem where Chinese officers were more interested in making money that they were the good of the military. This lead to overcharging the military and providing it with shoddy supplies. China ended this practice but, retired Chinese officers took over the companies and the practice continued as the work with active officers to defraud the military with the promise of high paying job at the company when they retire. China has tried to crack down on this, even with executions but it is simply to wide spread.

China's Army has also suffered from brain drain. The Army is mostly made up of poorly educated peasants from the country who are to poor to buy out of military service, while the educated men needed for using modern equipment live in the cities and have the money to buy out of service. This has caused massive training problems in China.

China has a plan to cut its Army size massively and go for a smaller professional force as found in the West but, the high cost with along with economic problems seem to have put this plan off for now.

6. The US has mutual defense pacts with 50 nations through things like NATO, the Rio Pact and ANZUS plus individual mutual defense pacts.

7. The main driving force behind China's economy is trade with the US. A war with the US would economically disastrous for China.

8. None of this will change much in the next 5 years.

The reality is China is in a poor strategic position to begin with. Surrounded by hostile states with large armies or unstable states. Its Navy need updating, it Army needs massive reforms non of which China can not afford at the moment and with the economic down turn will likely not be able to afford in the future. China's focus has been on its missile forces since with its Navy and Air force out classed by the US and it allies, missiles provide a cheap and effective way to try and defend China's coast. China will not be able to invade even Taiwan in 2020 much less the US.

CAnt find this in the source

There will be DIRE CONSEQUENCIES if the USA does not fix it's current educational, economic and military standards with regards to quality of people, and quality of equipment and the POLITICAL WILL to use vital resources when necesssary.

a reply to: StargateSG7

I laugh at the idea of a foreign invasion

originally posted by: seagull
How are they getting here?

They haven't the airlift, or sealift, capability to anything of the sort to Taiwan, muchless the United States. Please take the fear mongering down a notch or five.

They're going on a floatilla of all of the plastic bottles we shipped back over there for recycling...once they get halfway, they'll let loose the trashbridge.

originally posted by: Hyperia
CAnt find this in the source

There will be DIRE CONSEQUENCIES if the USA does not fix it's current educational, economic and military standards with regards to quality of people, and quality of equipment and the POLITICAL WILL to use vital resources when necesssary.

That was written by ME on purely politically speculative level
but based upon the experience of ROME, the Austro-Hungarian
empire and even further back into the Sumerian empires
history is a GOOD TEACHER of what happens when
basic economics and education of teh citizenry is
left to lapse and decline! Your empire crumbles
and gets INVADED and OCCUPIED !!!

Bring it. I'm ready.

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: thinline
All the need to do is land in Mexico and the could walk North and right past the non guarded boarder and then they could get driver licenses, vote, and have over one kid. The my could take over without firing a shot

How they gonna get over the Great Wall of Trump?

The same way Mr. Garrison made his way into Canada...and some random Chinese guy will # President Trump to death in similar fashion because life imitates art.