German hunter kills biggest Elephant for almost 30 years

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

Here is the actual headline of the Guardian article that you linked to:

Botswana seems to show the way ahead in conservation – but poaching is still on the rise

Sounds like a great start.

Thanks for posting this.
I heard it on BBC radio this morning 4:30 Central time US. I cried.
We Kill Every Thing. I am ashamed.
We murder our environment, our people, our babies. Every thing.

Future generations will be viewing National Geographic on their buts with useless legs muttering "That's cute"

This magnificent being was a Patriarch, a husband, father, uncle, brother in a society as; or more intelligent than humans.
I can't link so thanks again for posting.


Stupid, stupid Humans .

Here we go again... At the rate we’re murdering these magnificent creatures it won’t be long before we’ve driven them to extinction.

I consider these big game hunters to be murderers just the same as if they had mudered another human. It makes me sick every time I read about this sort of thing. The only way I can conceive of how these criminals take such pride in killing a defenseless animal is that they must be deeply demented and psychologically deranged. A well person simply couldn’t do what they do. I’m quite sure that if tomorrow the government legalized hunting and killing certain segments of our population, the hunters would be out there first thing in the morning armed to the teeth. They’d gladly commence the slaughter, proudly posing for photo ops next to slain human corpses, and never even lose a wink of sleep.

Sometimes it’s hard to not take a very dim view of humanity...

a reply to: netbound
When I was in high school a million years ago we read a short story called The Most Dangerous Game

It's a quick read

a reply to: butcherguy

Poaching is still on the rise...

Doesn't seem to be much that can be done about this - and the money from trophy hunting isn't helping. Trophy hunting is widely supported by conservationists. I understand, and can even appreciate this whole approach without actually liking it

Trophy hunting and poaching both mess with natural selection - so, for this reason alone - larger populations of animals won't always amount to healthier populations. Long term - how is this helping to conserve anything?

I understand hunters feel it's natural to hunt, that they have the right to hunt, and they believe they're actually protecting living animals - and in some instances they actually are

Animals are running out of territory all over the world, people don't want them on their land for a variety of reasons - and they're being killed for their body parts. Nasty business - all of it. I don't like it one bit - and I don't intend to defend an individuals need to kill something so they can have their picture taken standing next to it or hugging it - that's not actually hunting - it's just killing

I come from a family of hunters - they killed things for food

Everyone has a different idea about what kind of killing is OK

only the very saddest, most inadequate and pathetic person can take ANY kind of enjoyment from killing any creature for kicks. so they paid for the privilege? i don't care. they had a permit? i don't care. these are spineless cowards playing out their warped interpretation of heroic bravery. does anybody really believe that these 'hunters' give a rat's ass about conservation? because they don't. they are, to a man (or woman) truly vile specimens of humanity. i wish them all an encounter with some big game, without their big guns. see how they like them apples. the word for these 'hunters' is scum. all of them.

a reply to: Spiramirabilis
Poachers kill 20,000 to 40,000 elephants in Africa per year.
They also kill a lot of game wardens and conservation officers.
Hunters kill a very small number of elephants per year.
So here we have it.
One group kills a very limited number and provide money that is used to protect the remaining numbers so that they might increase in number.
The other group not only kills elephants by the tens of thousands each year, but also kill the very people that are tasked with protecting the elephants.
Who shall we focus on as being the real problem?

a reply to: butcherguy

I guess you didn't read my post

No problem - I'm not really interested in yours either

originally posted by: butcherguy

Who shall we focus on as being the real problem?

Humans.
We are selfish, egotistical, homicidal, murdering butchers. We can't even preserve ourselves.
But I do understand your argument. It is logical.

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: butcherguy

I guess you didn't read my post

No problem - I'm not really interested in yours either

Actually, I did read it.
This part tells me that you missed previous posts and links that I put up:

Doesn't seem to be much that can be done about this - and the money from trophy hunting isn't helping. 

There are places in Africa that have stable governments that are using money from sanctioned hunts to promote the increase of animal herds. There are areas where they have used the money to pay for drones which are used not only to keep track of animals, but also to locate and intercept poachers.
Theodore Roosevelt was the man that put out the call to save the American Bison when it was on the brink of extinction. He killed quite a few bison too. He was a hunter. Conservation and hunting go hand in hand.
To say that there doesn't seem much that can be done is a cop out.
Things have been done. The ivory ban did have a good effect, but nothing is perfect, so it also caused the price of ivory to skyrocket, thereby giving poachers an incentive to risk life and limb to get illegal ivory.
The thing to do now is to combat poaching at a level that they understand. Many countries shoot to kill poachers now.... as they should, imo.

a reply to: butcherguy

To say that there doesn't seem much that can be done is a cop out. Things have been done.

Poaching is now believed to account for 65 percent of elephant deaths each year. A decade ago, that number was 25 percent, according to the AP.

South Africa which has by far the largest population of rhinos in the world and is an incredibly important country for rhino conservation. However rhino poaching has reached a crisis point, and if the killing continues at this rate, we could see rhino deaths overtaking births in 2016-2018, meaning rhinos could go extinct in the very near future. Figures compiled by the South African Department of Environmental affairs show the dramatic escalation in poaching over recent years - see graph below.

Illegal poaching in Africa is at an all-time high, with elephants and rhinos targeted by well-funded, -trained and -equipped poachers who are motivated by a lucrative illegal wildlife trade. The poaching of rhinos has increased nearly 3,000 percent since 2007 and demand for ivory is also ever climbing. If poaching does not stop, these species could become extinct within our lifetime.

Wildlife Trafficking

Statistics released by the United Nation’s’ Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species (CITES) showed that 1,215 rhinos were killed in South Africa in 2014.

The number of rhinos killed for their rhino horn was a record high.

1,004 rhinos were poached and killed in South Africa in 2013.

668 were killed in 2012.

341 were killed in 2011.

333 were killed in 2010.

122 were killed in 2009.

Things have been done - yes. If you had read my post you would have understood that I understand this. What I'm saying is - it hasn't been successful - and poaching continues. The money isn't slowing it down

I went on to say that I don't actually care and can't support this position. Trophy hunting is abhorrent - regardless

a reply to: deadeyedick

umm the dentist was cleared of all charges (usa and africa) and was found i think that the land owner was found liable and jailed but not the doctor

www.cnn.com...

a reply to: RalagaNarHallas

Wonder if having a good lawyer helped out there...
The people you paid and the guy guiding you got in trouble but the dentist walks free.

a reply to: Spiramirabilis
Notice that your second link says that if the current rate of increase in poaching continues... rhino deaths will overtake births.

You know what that means... right?

The population is stable, even with the poachers doing what they are out there.
South African white rhino population 20 years ago was 7,095.
15 years later it was 18,780.
That is quite an increase in a short time.
Maybe they need to keep doing whatever it was that responsible for that recovery.

a reply to: butcherguy

You really don't get it do you?

I don't care

I'm not sure what you think you're trying to prove - to me

I do understand what you're trying to prove to yourself

Get out there butcherguy - butcher away....evidently nature's bounty is there for you to harvest

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: RalagaNarHallas

Wonder if having a good lawyer helped out there...
The people you paid and the guy guiding you got in trouble but the dentist walks free.

It is because of the financial impact charging an American would have on the industry.

If they were to outlaw today hunting there for sport then the animals would suffer greatly. The black market would open up even further. I would like to see a bigger tourism industry that does not include hunting but currently the gap left by not having a bigger tourism industry is filled by conservative hunting. Like other posters have pointed out hat gathering meat is really here to stay and putting more pressure on the black market while increasing sanctuaries is the way to go.

I would make the bastard eat it....Every single pound, right down to the toenails.

a reply to: butcherguy

The thing to do now is to combat poaching at a level that they understand. Many countries shoot to kill poachers now.... as they should, imo.

Bingo
I think we can all agree that we need some private black ops co. on the job of ending the unnecessary killings. If we put the right people in the right place then this ends.

a reply to: RalagaNarHallas

It doesn't matter, dude. Facts have no place once the self righteous peacocks start posturing and preening for the peahen gallery. No amount of fact, logic, or common sense will prevail in these types of ridiculous arguments.

To those peacocks, try to change the laws if you're so venemously opposed to them... just don't feign indignation when those of us who hunt fight back against those law changes and remember that hunters have far deeper pockets than antihunters do. Money talks...

a reply to: burdman30ott6

...remember that hunters have far deeper pockets than antihunters do. Money talks...

Money makes it possible to do whatever you want to do - whenever you want to do it

It's almost like being right