Nissan Leaf Can Power Your Home An Electric Car That Can Be A Home Generator!

originally posted by: TinkerHaus

originally posted by: DanDanDat

originally posted by: TinkerHaus


I understand the problem with price. Most people buy cars in the $30k range anyway, no?

The problem with the 30K price tag is not that it’s not affordable. Nissan is a mid-range vehicle manufacturer; they aren’t going to make a car that is “unaffordable”.

The problem is the quality of the car you are getting for that 30K.

Subtract the expensive home power generating electric engine and battery and your left with a car that would sell for far far cheaper with an internal combustion engine.

This is not a problem if it makes the individual consumer happy to be driving a cheap car with an expensive engine (not to mention the hire maintenance and repair costs). If going Green is your thing, and paying a premium on your vehicle in order to do your part is acceptable; than vehicles like this are perfect they are both affordable and move you closer to your goal.

But if going green is not a priority for you; than the 30K price tag (though affordable) may not be appealing due to the quality of car you be getting for your 30K.

This is why it’s important for the cost of these power systems to come down; so that the quality of the overall car can go up at the various price points. This will make buying these types of cars a no brainer; both those who want to go green will buy, and those who want a quality car will buy.

I had the pleasure of driving an “Affordable” prius the other day. It was a nice car that handled itself well. But I was taken aback by how I felt like I was driving the used neon I bought 15 years ago when I was in high school. Don’t get me wrong; I loved that neon; but if someone told me it would cost me 30K I would have laughed at them.

So I drive Priuses, Volts, and Leafs.. None of them feel like the $^tty Neon I owned 20 years ago..

Higher maintenance costs? No - it's more like 1/2 the maintenance costs!

Certainly a Leaf isn't a Beamer, but it's a decent car for a lower cost than a traditional car over the lifespan of the vehicle.

What's the expected battery life of one of these electric cars? I would guess the average car battery is 7-8 years so I was wondering how these compare.
I can't believe they would be cheap to replace either.
Also I have a few more questions since you have an electric car.
How does the heat and air conditioning function and what does that do to driving range?
Also it gets cold where I live, how do these cars fare in frigid temperatures?

originally posted by: Bluntone22

originally posted by: TinkerHaus

originally posted by: DanDanDat

originally posted by: TinkerHaus


I understand the problem with price. Most people buy cars in the $30k range anyway, no?

The problem with the 30K price tag is not that it’s not affordable. Nissan is a mid-range vehicle manufacturer; they aren’t going to make a car that is “unaffordable”.

The problem is the quality of the car you are getting for that 30K.

Subtract the expensive home power generating electric engine and battery and your left with a car that would sell for far far cheaper with an internal combustion engine.

This is not a problem if it makes the individual consumer happy to be driving a cheap car with an expensive engine (not to mention the hire maintenance and repair costs). If going Green is your thing, and paying a premium on your vehicle in order to do your part is acceptable; than vehicles like this are perfect they are both affordable and move you closer to your goal.

But if going green is not a priority for you; than the 30K price tag (though affordable) may not be appealing due to the quality of car you be getting for your 30K.

This is why it’s important for the cost of these power systems to come down; so that the quality of the overall car can go up at the various price points. This will make buying these types of cars a no brainer; both those who want to go green will buy, and those who want a quality car will buy.

I had the pleasure of driving an “Affordable” prius the other day. It was a nice car that handled itself well. But I was taken aback by how I felt like I was driving the used neon I bought 15 years ago when I was in high school. Don’t get me wrong; I loved that neon; but if someone told me it would cost me 30K I would have laughed at them.

So I drive Priuses, Volts, and Leafs.. None of them feel like the $^tty Neon I owned 20 years ago..

Higher maintenance costs? No - it's more like 1/2 the maintenance costs!

Certainly a Leaf isn't a Beamer, but it's a decent car for a lower cost than a traditional car over the lifespan of the vehicle.

What's the expected battery life of one of these electric cars? I would guess the average car battery is 7-8 years so I was wondering how these compare.
I can't believe they would be cheap to replace either.
Also I have a few more questions since you have an electric car.
How does the heat and air conditioning function and what does that do to driving range?
Also it gets cold where I live, how do these cars fare in frigid temperatures?

They do better in warmer climates, to be honest. I live in Utah where it's cold as all hell in the winter and can be blistering hot in the summer.

I think running the heater has a very minor effect on range (~1%) but the AC has a larger impact, something like a 5% decrease in range. Additionally travelling at high speeds or frequent stops has a substantial impact on range as well. A Leaf has a range of about 80 miles when fully charged, but is perfect for commuting around town. A Tesla Model S can have over a 300 mile range on a full charge, which is pretty comparable to many gas-powered vehicles.

I think the Leaf comes with an 8 year warranty on the batteries, and it's expected to last 10 years, which is pretty standard for all electric cars. If you choose to purchase, after 8-10 years paying out a couple grand to replace the batteries is a drop in the bucket compared to the cost of a new car, and the costs you would have paid in fuel if driving a regular car over that same period.

It's definitely more up front cost, but it ends up paying for itself in a couple of years. In my case my company pays for the car, so I don't have to deal with any of that - but after driving an electric for awhile it's made me very much want one as a personal car.

So essentially a Leaf owner would just need to come up with some ways to power the Leaf off the grid and wala your home would be powered 24 hours a day!

originally posted by: olaru12
Sorry that technology will never be allowed in the US; Not enough profit for the energy and oil companies that rule our world.

In some states it's illegal to capture rain water from your roof.

Land of the free.......

originally posted by: olaru12
Sorry that technology will never be allowed in the US; Not enough profit for the energy and oil companies that rule our world.

In some states it's illegal to capture rain water from your roof.

Could this have something to do with Tesla starting to manufacture in China?

www.bloomberg.com...

Musk Says Tesla Will Make Cars in China in Next 3-4 Years

Tesla Motors Inc. Chief Executive Officer Elon Musk, who’s preparing to begin deliveries of the Model S electric vehicle in China, forecast the company will be making cars in the country in the next three to four years.

The company is also building a “big” network of battery-charging stations in China, including superchargers in Beijing and Shanghai, the billionaire said at a packed Geekpark Conference in the nation’s capital yesterday. Today, he told reporters in Beijing that the company plans to invest hundreds of millions of dollars in the country

So I am wondering where is the American equalivent of this car here in the USA? Why cant we make the same types of technology?

originally posted by: TinkerHaus

originally posted by: greencmp
a reply to: Bluntone22

Yeah, a home fuel cell would be a lot cheaper.

This isn't meant to be a full-time home generator, it's just a feature for emergency use.

Might be but the chance you're ever going to need 2 days worth of emergency house power is pretty low in most places. You can pretty much set a basic power backup for your house for a few thousand. Might not be green but it works and it's cheaper. Let the rich eco snobs pay for early adoption of this kind of tech. Most like it'll be obsolete before it's close to paid for. Bad investment for the average person.

originally posted by: BrianFlanders

originally posted by: TinkerHaus

originally posted by: greencmp
a reply to: Bluntone22

Yeah, a home fuel cell would be a lot cheaper.

This isn't meant to be a full-time home generator, it's just a feature for emergency use.

Might be but the chance you're ever going to need 2 days worth of emergency house power is pretty low in most places. You can pretty much set a basic power backup for your house for a few thousand. Might not be green but it works and it's cheaper. Let the rich eco snobs pay for early adoption of this kind of tech. Most like it'll be obsolete before it's close to paid for. Bad investment for the average person.

There is no such technology in America it is not allowed but it may be comming to Europe. As for the price monthly it costs the same as any other new car. However it has perks like it can run your houses electricity for 2 days on a full charge. Anyone with a brain could just buy a solar generator with a few extra batteries and be able to live off grid and never have to pay gas or electric bills again.

Which is cheaper free transportation and electricity forever or paying monthly bills to power companies and weekly gas prices which amount to hundreds every month?

Battery longevity suffers depending on the climate, battery chemistry, and cooling design. As far as the Nissan Leaf goes it uses a battery chemistry that is somewhat sensitive to higher temperatures and it doesn't have a cooling system either. How long the battery lasts depends on what percentage of capacity loss is deemed acceptable.

Here's the best source on the Nissan Leaf I've found:
www.electricvehiclewiki.com...

Another source:
insideevs.com...

The short answer is the battery probably will reach 30% degradation in less than 5 years. I don't think this is acceptable.

Other electric vehicles use active cooling like the Tesla Model S and fare far better:
steinbuch.wordpress.com...

The good news for Nissan is they have a prototype battery which may go into the 2nd generation Nissan Leaf, which should have a calendar life (till 80% of original capacity) of around 10 years. It also has double the capacity of the existing battery in approximately the same footprint - so that means 200 mile range. After 10 years when it has 160 miles of range, the battery will still be useful too.

dailykanban.com...

If the battery goes under around 32 F / 0 C, battery performance suffers (longevity does not). But if you park in a sheltered garage, keep the car plugged, AND have a car that can manage battery temperature, it should be fine.

a reply to: FormOfTheLord

I don't see any reason why this would not be allowed in the US, the only issue is the regulations possibly have not kept up. I suspect the reason Japan gets it first is because Japan is rather disaster prone (i.e. this would become very useful after the 2011 Tsunami). It might also be a case of the regulations not having caught up with the technology - solar inverters for example must shut down when the grid goes down, to prevent powerlines from being energized while they are being worked on (obviously if disconnected from the grid entirely this is not an issue).

The technology isn't particularly complex, plenty of battery powered inverters around, it's just someone actually doing it.

Also Tesla isn't manufacturing in China, Elon is planning to manufacture in China when future models have launched and demand outstrips supply of its California factory. It might also avoid taxes in China from having to import cars.