The Question for which Berenstein Skeptics Have No Answer

Let us address one of the primary issues that needs to be contemplated with these “altered history” anomalies that seem to be infiltrating our reality. Of course, the “poster boy” of this is the Berenstein/Berenstain paradox, but the same point to be made here can be applied to any of these newer ones that have just seemd to “show up” in recent weeks.

Here is the question: Why, or how, is it only now that these things have entered into the mass consciousness? For example, if the skeptics are correct (those who insist that millions simply misread or are “misremembering” the name of the Bears), why was this mistake never an issue throughout the decades of existence of the Berenst_in Bears? Why is there not an overwhelming amount of documented historical evidence showing that there has been a long running “name dilemma” throughout the storied existence of the BB’s? If this is nothing more than a case of mistakenly reading the name, why is it that the masses of people who are so insistent of a “Berenstein” rendering had never been corrected or realized their mistake throughout all the decades?

This very fact actually “self-proves” the legitimacy of the phenomenon, and that something unexplained has been occurring.

The dismissiveness and somewhat condescending attitude of those who are quick to label the situation as a case of “misremembering,” when there is quite obviously something unexplainable happening, gives plenty of reason to be suspicious of their motives.

This entire situation feels much like awakening from a deep sleep, having no memory or recognition of what happened while asleep. How or “when” did the name “change” in such a manner that the “change” seems to have been realized by varying peoples at varying points of “time?”

These issues are undoubtedly biproducts of the battle for individual and collective consciousness that is being carried out in higher realms. If internal doubt can be raised about one’s certain memories, the door is opened to rob one of one’s own very essence; one’s own soul. I don’t believe it is happenstance that most of these “retro-alterations” involve childhood memories – the most innocent of times in one’s life.

All of this is much more than a silly quirk dealing with whether or not one correctly remembers the name of a cartoon bear family.

originally posted by: TombEscaper
Why, or how, is it only now that these things have entered into the mass consciousness?

the internet. In the past, if someone had a drug addled vision that something wasn't as they remembered it, they had to go to a library to check out the facts. Today, you just type it in the Google, and BAM! there was another person who agrees with you, so now it's a conspiracy. The son of the Author offered his views that nothing had changed, only the failing minds of older fans.

Still fascinated all the books, movies, toons, etc changed- PHYSICALLY. to me, its proof positive that MATTER isn't real.

In Government We Trust?

web.archive.org...://www.nsa.gov/academia/_files/collected_learning/elementary/geometry/geo-room_design.pdf

PS:I do wonder if Berenstein Bears' books were in circulation in other countries/languages and what THEY look like now!

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: TombEscaper
Why, or how, is it only now that these things have entered into the mass consciousness?

the internet. In the past, if someone had a drug addled vision that something wasn't as they remembered it, they had to go to a library to check out the facts. Today, you just type it in the Google, and BAM! there was another person who agrees with you, so now it's a conspiracy. The son of the Author offered his views that nothing had changed, only the failing minds of older fans.

Failing minds that all happen to be congruent with one another. The fact that the son said nothing changed is irrelevant, nobody is claiming the government replaced all the books and changed the name, if there truly was some sort of time shift or something like that, being the son of the author isn't going to make you any more of an authority than anyone else.

I wouldn't see this whole thing as being odd if everyone remembered differently, if some people said "bruinsteen" "brownstain" "Barranstein" and so on, but almost everyone remembers the same.

Same for the snow white one, if everyone remembered different versions "Big mirror on the wall" "Scary mirror on the wall" "Shiny mirror on the wall" it wouldn't be that odd, but everyone remembers the same specific thing.

Be dismissive and condescending all you want (just like the OP said you would be) but you aren't going to sway anyone's opinion.

a reply to: TombEscaper

The dismissiveness and somewhat condescending attitude of those who are quick to label the situation as a case of “misremembering,” when there is quite obviously something unexplainable happening, gives plenty of reason to be suspicious of their motives.

^Boldness mine

That was very interesting.
I was one of those who believed it had been BerenSTEIN. I recently found an old book of mine and the author's names were clearly BerenSTAIN. It shocked me to my core. How could me and my children have been mistaken all of those years? I READ from that book to them AND have always quoted the title of whatever book it was and the author before I would begin reading.
Now, I am NOT a genius (obviously) BUT pronunciation and proper use of words in sentences has always been something I try to do correctly. I am not always correct however I do strive to be.
It DOES interest me that the some of the people who are on the "Stain" side of the fence CAN be very hostile at times and so can the "Steiners".
I do find it odd that SO many people have been wrong about the same thing for SO many years...

I agree the whole situation is fascinating from either perspective!!

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: TombEscaper
Why, or how, is it only now that these things have entered into the mass consciousness?

the internet. In the past, if someone had a drug addled vision that something wasn't as they remembered it, they had to go to a library to check out the facts. Today, you just type it in the Google, and BAM! there was another person who agrees with you, so now it's a conspiracy. The son of the Author offered his views that nothing had changed, only the failing minds of older fans.

The internet in it's current incarnation has been around over a decade. Hell ATS has been around nearly that long.Plenty of time to discover this type of thing. in 2005 and earlier I was on message boards just like this one chatting about my various hobbies of the time. Websites may be flashier but the internet isn't "new"

Before that we also had friends, family, and random people you could ask to see if you were remembering something differently.

False memories are one thing, but when everyone is sharing the same false memory it starts to hint that something else is going on, whatever it may be.

a reply to: network dude

I hope your argument isn't based on feeble minds. This topic was brought up in a workplace where the oldest person was 25, most in late teens. They all remembered it as Berenstein and were shocked it could be any different. One 25 year old learned to read on those books and remembers sounding out the "ei" repeatedly and inquiring as to if it was an "eye" or "ee" sound. I couldn't convince her the "stain" thing isn't some internet troll job. None of these kids had ever heard of "magic mirror" or "THIS neighborhood", either.

This has nothing to do with age.

a reply to: TombEscaper
I'm sure there were quit a few Ham Radio discussions going around back in the day, but the internet is barely 20 years strong,
It took a while to calm down and get to brass tacks what with all the suddenly free boobies that we could browse for free.

Then the very important work cut out for us with 911.

Its really only now, now that we've figured out the world is an evil conspiracy wrapped in an eviler conspiracy, that we have time to piece together our missing and altered past and all of the different dimensions that we could have crossed in and out of to ponder our memories of Bernstein and New Zealand being on the west coast, as it was when I was younger, so I remember.

Indeed, I find it confuzzlingly awkward that the first reply in the below blog was just within couple hours' of its creation, and already a thorough explanation of the spelling:

woodbetweenworlds.blogspot.com...

AnonymousAugust 23, 2012 at 3:44 PM
I normally don't comment on blogs about our family name but yours was so unusual and imaginative that I thought it only appropriate to add my thoughts. "Berenstain" according to our family lore was an attempt by an unknown imigration officer sometime in the late 1800s to reproduce phonetically a highly accented version of the tradtional Jewish name "Bernstein" as pronounced by my Father's grandparents when they came to America from the Ukraine.
In that linguistic region, the name tended to come out sounding something like, "Ber'nsheytn". Since that's how the name was originally documented, it has always been spelled that way by our family and it has always been misread and mispronounced by nearly everyone. It has always been "The BerenstAin Bears". Your parallel reality theory is very resourceful but, unfortunately, by applying Occam's razor, we arrive at the explanation that most people have just misread the name.
Mike Berenstain (Son of Stan and Jan)

originally posted by: 0001391
a reply to: network dude

I hope your argument isn't based on feeble minds. This topic was brought up in a workplace where the oldest person was 25, most in late teens. They all remembered it as Berenstein and were shocked it could be any different. One 25 year old learned to read on those books and remembers sounding out the "ei" repeatedly and inquiring as to if it was an "eye" or "ee" sound. I couldn't convince her the "stain" thing isn't some internet troll job. None of these kids had ever heard of "magic mirror" or "THIS neighborhood", either.

This has nothing to do with age.

This weekend I was at a rather large gathering of people and asked tons of random strangers. Every single one remembered STEIN, MIRROR MIRROR, and THE neighborhood. Without a doubt. About half of them refused to believe me when I told them the "true/current" way they are supposed to be, the other half seemed to be in existential crisis.

There's something here, I wish we could figure out what it is.

Disclaimer: I am fascinated by alternative realities, timelines and by actual cases where we seem to experience different pasts. However, this specific bears name issue is not one of those and I feel that all this attention on this matter and others like mis-remembered song lyrics, celebrity facts and the like take away legitimacy to what may be a real phenomena. So I am not being dismissive or condescending, but I do believe that when statements are make like this, if you are interested in the real issues of reality shifts, you have to engage in a rigorous examination of claims and eliminate the cruft.

originally posted by: TombEscaper

Here is the question: Why, or how, is it only now that these things have entered into the mass consciousness?

We even have a name for this.. internet memes.. ideas, rumors and speculation that go viral. Without social media this sort of spread is very difficult to achieve. We do see rumors go viral in the past but without the reach of social media, the "memes" are usually confined to a specific community,

This very fact actually “self-proves” the legitimacy of the phenomenon, and that something unexplained has been occurring.

Nope. First of all the statement made is not proof of the legitimacy of a reality shift, as you imply, but it is proof that ideas can be passed quickly and widely on the internet. And there is no such thing as "self-proof".

The dismissiveness and somewhat condescending attitude of those who are quick to label the situation as a case of “misremembering,” when there is quite obviously something unexplainable happening, gives plenty of reason to be suspicious of their motives.

Expecting proof of claims beyond "everyone feels or knows it" is not being dismissive or condescending. Instead it is a statement of where your claims are weak. Now you should provide your proof and empirical arguments for your position. I dearly would love it if you could change my mind.

This entire situation feels much like awakening from a deep sleep, having no memory or recognition of what happened while asleep. How or “when” did the name “change” in such a manner that the “change” seems to have been realized by varying peoples at varying points of “time?”

These issues are undoubtedly biproducts of the battle for individual and collective consciousness that is being carried out in higher realms. If internal doubt can be raised about one’s certain memories, the door is opened to rob one of one’s own very essence; one’s own soul. I don’t believe it is happenstance that most of these “retro-alterations” involve childhood memories – the most innocent of times in one’s life.

This is a battle in the higher realms? What exactly does that mean? Who or what are these higher realms? And why are they so interested in the name of child's book?

All of this is much more than a silly quirk dealing with whether or not one correctly remembers the name of a cartoon bear family.

Then please elaborate on this and explain what that "more" is.

Most people do not have the time to bother trying to figure it out. In my experience they warn me do not DWELL on these little changes, and remind me that spelling nowadays is very liberal so anything goes.

originally posted by: Milah
Still fascinated all the books, movies, toons, etc changed- PHYSICALLY. to me, its proof positive that MATTER isn't real.

In Government We Trust?

web.archive.org...://www.nsa.gov/academia/_files/collected_learning/elementary/geometry/geo-room_design.pdf

PS:I do wonder if Berenstein Bears' books were in circulation in other countries/languages and what THEY look like now!

I don't think you understand the concept of the dimensional shift, nor do you understand that the title of a book series would be the same name in any country.

If it was Sammy the Squid it would be Sammy el Calamar in Spanish. Still Sammy though, cause thats like not up for translation or debate, its his actual name. Geez...

a reply to: 0001391

I hope your argument isn't based on feeble minds. This topic was brought up in a workplace where the oldest person was 25, most in late teens.

There's no age limit for a feeble mind.

Just saying.

There's a massive thread about this here on ats already.

OK, so anyone else think this possibly, somehow, in some way, is related to jacques vallee and his control system hypothesis?

Last I checked he was into the "testing" phase of his theory about (in short) that reality is a construct that can be manipulated through thought (far far more complex idea from him, this is very basic)

Maybe he somehow figured out a way to hack the matrix (excuse the buzzwords) and this is one of the effects.

Just an idea.... the monster thread about jacques vallee here on ATS should be a good start for anyone interested in the idea.

originally posted by: Brotherman
There's a massive thread about this here on ats already.

Not exactly.
This thread seems to be in response the the pro steins of that existing thread.
Totally unique in its own right.

originally posted by: NowWhat

If it was Sammy the Squid it would be Sammy el Calamar in Spanish. Still Sammy though, cause thats like not up for translation or debate, its his actual name. Geez...

I should specify non-Romanized languages.

Wonder how it would be spelled when objectively transliterated back to a Romance language? Would provide some insight, even if not conclusive.

a reply to: NowWhat
Everything in the op has been covered a lot of times over in the other thread, whether pro or not doesn't matter. I didn't know conclusions drawn from something already here warrants new threads. It is my opinion of course though.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: metamagic

Proof is impossible to provide and you know that. But that doesn't mean nothing is happening.

If we are discussing the flexibility of reality and the fabric of existence then the idea of mundane pieces of evidence is pretty silly.

What evidence would make you happy? There is none. Because if we are talking about reality changing on the fly then the evidence isn't going to be there, because reality is changing. That's the whole idea being proposed.

This isn't something that is going to get understood with historical documents and microfiche.