The Dangerous Falsehood that Modern Man is Enlightened

a reply to: Itisnowagain

The past is just words? Try telling that to archeologists. If the artifacts they dig up in the ground aren't things that "exist" (according to you), then I'm not sure what to call them.

The past affects you now. Your life is based around things that happened before you and before "right now". The language you're speaking, for instance, and the computer you're using. Even your ideas aren't unique, they most certainly came out of the mouths of others.

I'm not sure I fully understand your argument. You will likely read this post a few hours after I've written it, making it a thing of the past. Does this post not exist? Are the ideas in this post now irrelevant because they're in the past?

originally posted by: Talorc
You will likely read this post a few hours after I've written it, making it a thing of the past.

Reading happens now. Writing is happening now.
Everything happens now - even digging and uncovering of rocks can only happen now.

The past is where? Not here.

Different knowledge and different skills for different times...

Genetically, we are probably not more intelligent than men of 2000 years ago but with the amount of knowledge gathered by our ancestors and people of today, ignorance is mostly a choice or conditioning in the 21st century. Of course, it's always hard to know the "absolute truth" but overally, we have more accessible knowledge today than before.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

originally posted by: Talorc
You will likely read this post a few hours after I've written it, making it a thing of the past.

Reading happens now. Writing is happening now.
Everything happens now - even digging and uncovering of rocks can only happen now.

The past is where? Not here.

Right, past events aren't "here", they're in the past I suppose. The fact that digging up things is happening now doesn't mean that something didn't happen before to put them there. If I move a clock on a table two inches to the left, and then look at it again a few minutes later, that's how I know the past happened. That's my proof.

I think you're making things too complicated. Maybe the question of reality, in as much as it matters to us, is the simplest answer.

a reply to: JAY1980

I can't bring myself to go to the zoo anymore. If you actually try and connect with an animal in the zoo it will just depress you.

The only thing I see modern humans having over its ancestors, is having a larger perception of things, due to the accumulation of knowledge that can be accessed. However, physically and mentally, modern humans are stunted in a lot of ways, with the lack of critical thinking, that only a fear of death probably could teach.

Enlightenment is more or less being wise about things, where experience is the teacher, an can make one humble, which forces them to be honest with themselves about reality. If enlightenment becomes associated with abstract knowledge, then it just as dumb as superstitious religions that it trying to separate from.

Its a lot like a Job interview...Now do I hire the pretty young thing, with a big bust that has an education but no experience but needs training as well as time, or do I hire someone who has less appealing looks, but plenty of experience, has the references and will make you more money due to convenience?

a reply to: Talorc

I wanted to recommend a book, Talorc. It's called "The Angel's of our Better Nature" by Stephen Pinker. He makes the case that life has become better for human beings in terms of violence, disease, war, etc. Of course that is not to say life has gotten better for other beings. It's fairly accessible and a good read.

And since you like Hhistory, try "Sapiens" by historian Yuval Harari. He makes some very interesting points on our history, about human progress, how the idea of "progress" is basically a superstition. Very compelling book and a breeze to read.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

originally posted by: Talorc
You will likely read this post a few hours after I've written it, making it a thing of the past.

Reading happens now. Writing is happening now.
Everything happens now - even digging and uncovering of rocks can only happen now.

The past is where? Not here.

Unless the phrase "Timing is Everything" comes into play.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

Thanks for the suggestions. I'll look for them at the next opportunity.

The Dangerous Falsehood that Modern Man is Enlightened

If you have ever read the political forums people would see what a farce that is.

Mankind is no more 'enlightened' than Neanderthals were.

Modern civilization just loves to think he's come 'so' far.

Yup,you pointed out a very dangerous glitch in our current conciousness. Great civilizations that produced great art, infrastructures,ideas ,philosophers etc.... did not achieve that by having all the "answers" or "truths". They asked great questions instead. They never stated their system is the best, their thinkers were always pondering what could be a better system for the future instead.
Their kings or philosophers traveled the world to collect books from other civilizations to expand their libraries, instead of dismissing outsiders as less civilized for doing things in a different way.

NOW,we only have demagogues telling us what to believe in,convincing us that the opposing ideologies are dangerous and is the cause of human misery。 we even have demagogues of SCIENCE now like Dawkins (spends more time and energy ridiculing religious people instead of contributing to scientific work). Neil de grasse tyson encourages scientific wonder and interest but discourages philosophy,believing its danger of causing NIHILISM. LOL.

Other cultures are viewed as backwards,thus we have to teach them. People selling themselves as advocate of society and justice,are convincing others that there is racism ,sexism,oppression in the most frivolous things. Any attempt to disagree with them is equal to being branded as a person with dangerous ideologies that should be silenced.

PSYCHOPATHY is now synonymous with religion just by adding "extremist" to it. Undiagnosed and brilliant psychopaths are now the only ones that has the energy and strength to win an election.

Skeptics are now "deniers". Ridiculing deniers instead of providing proof is now rhe way.

I'd say it is too late. The trend for the last few decades is irreversible. The only way to stop this by encouraging everybody to wake up and see what we have become. But then, just by naming you as a conspiracy theorist,moralist,conservative or an ideological extremist, nobody will even consider listening to you.

I totally agree with the OP.

I use to argue with the Ken Wilber followers, who believe in developmental evolution, who have the mistaken notion that modern man is a step above the pre-modern…though he may be in scholastic ability and technological areas, in morality he may be worse or certainly no better


Why…because look at the fact that were still sitting and doing nothing as genocide after genocide takes place and the advanced modern man does nothing.

Actually what they think is an advance science and technology may be in the end our demise

Native Indians, wow, that was some enlightment, nowadays its just a tragic.

Great post! Look to Germany in the early to mid nineteen hundreds. We hadn't seen anything like that since the Renaissance! People were looking forward to abandoning outdated belief systems and government systems, and replacing them with modern enlightened systems from such intellectual giants as Nietzche an Marx! These new philosophies were adopted by various states who followed them about as well as the old kingdoms and empires followed Christianity and other religions. You might think modern societies following the philosophies which emerged from the apex of modern western culture would be far less barbaric than the ones from the medieval era, but they weren't.

The problem is that the operand is human nature not beliefs


The human nature must progress along the line of love and other positive attributes of beauty and truth in order to transcend the lower nature


Something must get in our DNA and grind out all that selfishness, ignorance and greed.

originally posted by: Willtell
Something must get in our DNA and grind out all that selfishness, ignorance and greed.

Yeah, billions of years of evolution, see it simpler, you have two people in your head, one of them is you, the other is a reptilian, the reptilian drives your instincts while you try to be human. Without the reptilian you would die. So good luck driving him away and still survive as a specie.

a rely to: Talorc
Excellent!

I war with this everyday. I [re]discover so much knowledge daily, that I am never truly sure what was lost and what is 'enlightened'.

I can't tell if the Dali LLAMA is enlightened WE SURE AS hell aren't.

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
Enlightenment has to do with spiritual awareness, technology has to do with carnality. For the most part, modern humans are not spiritually aware because they are so focused on the outer world and how to manipulate it to gain better technology that they forget that what truly matters is the inner world and making yourself better.

So I agree, technology does not make man smarter. S&F

Spiritual Awareness is held back as much as the Sciences.

I am continuously spellbound at how easy it really was added to the designers to backdoor insert Trojans into all the spiritual seekers.

Funny how you believe the Inner World is safe from the tampering, and that the Outside is the only manipulative order.

I can guarantee that almost no one on this World has fully gone to EITHER world because he is not ALLOWED TOO, or simply does not have the gall to do so.

If you did, you would know that the SPIRITUAL ENLIGHTENMENT, is as much a foolish mantra as the rest, and indeed the traps are just far bigger and more fierce there.

The same elements ride across all of the realms, for indeed they were all constructed together, by a whole band of misfits that we can see now, are the BANE of us all.

a reply to: ParasuvO

What elements are in charge of policing that?