Defeat The Right In Three Minutes

a reply to: burdman30ott6

Funny how things are put into perspective when you have facts and educate yourself on what you're talking about.

Well stated....

Hi. Lurker here coming out of the shadows...

I see it this way, OP. Whether it is Democrat vs Republican, Liberal vs Conservative, Left Wing vs Right Wing - They are still wings of the same bird with the same head. It is all a divide and conquer tactic perpetrated upon us all to maintain division among us. If we waste time fighting amongst each other, we have no time left to fight the real monsters behind closed doors. It's futile, and will get us nowhere quickly. Remember the story, The Phantom Tollbooth? - Where the demon makes Milo do all these menial useless jobs to keep him busy. That is the perfect allegory.

Thanks.

a reply to: burdman30ott6

Oh. I see. So it's only the money they take from your paycheck you're raging about then? Just the income tax?

ETA: Charter schools aren't publically funded and require tuitiion where you are?

a reply to: Vasa Croe

The problem is and always will be that, outside of an impossible sterile setting where all variables like humanity's tendency to always take the easiest path possible are controlled completely, socialism doesn't work. That's an absolute fact. It fails due to human nature, among other issues. That makes arguments for socialism completely illogical and nonpragmatic. People are arguing from an emotional standpoint of "but think of the people." Which is fine, but it makes the claims that the TEA Party and Libertarians are making "emotional arguments" such a ridiculously laughable joke that I often wonder if the folks using that old chestnut are just trying to get a rise out of people with it.

"You receive what you have earned" is such a beautifully logical principle and, even more awesome, it depends on nobody but YOU. YOU hold every card and have all the control. But again, humanity's constant wont to take the easiest path they can find and put forth as little effort as is allowable busts into the room and suddenly "personal responsibility" becomes this Frankenstein Monster of a concept. Amazing, really... The same individuals who view personal responsibility as it relates to caring, housing, feeding, and paying for yourself as being such a vile concept and indicative of some manner of greed are often the same who are so quick to apply "personal responsibility" to anyone even remotely associated with their pet peeves... example: EVERY police officer should take personal responsibility for the small fraction of bad cops out there and they should all be held accountable for the failures of the very few... Huh? But a guy who has decided to piss his life away with a needle hanging out of his arm or with his ass firmly planted on a couch in front of a TV collecting government handouts shouldn't be expected to take personal responsibility over something ENTIRELY within his own control?!?!?! Was Earth fully cooked when God removed it from His oven, or did the Big Guy throw us out of his kitchen only half baked?

originally posted by: ~Lucidity
a reply to: burdman30ott6

Oh. I see. So it's only the money they take from your paycheck you're raging about then? Just the income tax?

No, we can sit here and watch me rage over many things...
the stupidity of free trade
international aid
how increasing the minimum wage to $15/hr will crush the feet of the economy
how unions hold 1/3rd of the responsibility for America's production sector having cut the country
how the EPA and other growth unfriendly agencies and government regulation shoulder another 1/3rd of that blame
how the feds have abdicated their Constitutional duty and violate the 10th amendment on a daily basis
how America should never provoke a war or military action unless we're in it to win it AND are going to claim spoils from it
why America's education system is a flop
Why the ACA is total BS
Why the war on drugs is a machine to build boogeymen and should be ended immediately
Why we can't afford any more low skill immigrants in the US
etc
etc
etc

Feel free to pick one, or print out the list, cut each entry out separately, throw them in a hat and draw one for discussion. I'm more than happy to rage on a diverse selection of topics, probably all of them which you and I vehemently disagree on.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: ~Lucidity
a reply to: burdman30ott6

Oh. I see. So it's only the money they take from your paycheck you're raging about then? Just the income tax?

No, we can sit here and watch me rage over many things...
the stupidity of free trade
international aid
how increasing the minimum wage to $15/hr will crush the feet of the economy
how unions hold 1/3rd of the responsibility for America's production sector having cut the country
how the EPA and other growth unfriendly agencies and government regulation shoulder another 1/3rd of that blame
how the feds have abdicated their Constitutional duty and violate the 10th amendment on a daily basis
how America should never provoke a war or military action unless we're in it to win it AND are going to claim spoils from it
why America's education system is a flop
Why the ACA is total BS
Why the war on drugs is a machine to build boogeymen and should be ended immediately
Why we can't afford any more low skill immigrants in the US
etc
etc
etc

Feel free to pick one, or print out the list, cut each entry out separately, throw them in a hat and draw one for discussion. I'm more than happy to rage on a diverse selection of topics, probably all of them which you and I vehemently disagree on.

Ha...if I could make this entire post my signature line I would. Now that is some cold, hard facts....

Again...educated on the subject and well stated!

originally posted by: TechniXcality
a reply to: xuenchen

Alright, alright guys pack it up. We were defeated three hours ago now.

The only defeats there are in politics are at election times.

Opinion boards on the 'internets' not so much.

originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: kaylaluv

Why ask me? I'm not in poverty either. (if it works for you, I might as well use that lame excuse too)

Then what the hell are you complaining about? How did you make money? were you given handouts and charity? Are you just lucky? Or did you work for it?

I was indeed lucky. My parents paid for my college education. They also helped me financially once I graduated until I could adequately support myself. I wasn't born in poverty and neither were my parents. That doesn't mean I can't have some empathy for people who are born in poverty, with multiple generations of poverty, where college is just a pipe dream, and the only perceived way out of poverty is a life of crime.

Wow, way to miss the point. You worked. You went to school. You did that to better yourself and so you didn't have to rely on Mommie and Daddy to hold your hand all your life. You now take care of yourself.

Would you rather have all those people living a bare minimum life, because they CHOSE to do the bare minimum? Why not embower them/force them to go out and fight for it, like all those who do it, but don't come from silver spoon land?

Give a man a fish and all.

ETA:Oh and you just have no clue about the education. If you are on welfare, you qualify for Grants and assistance so you pay nothing. And you can get child care too.

a reply to: Vasa Croe

Right - their mistake that they were told they were worthless. Let 'em starve. Just like I said. You want to ignore them, because they truly are worthless in your eyes. Just admit it.

a reply to: network dude

And you miss the point. I had help, and someone to encourage me. People in poverty don't have a mommy or daddy to pay for stuff while they are getting started.

What if you make just enough not to qualify for welfare? I've never heard of getting college completely free while on welfare anyway. Grants pay for some of it, but not all.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: Vasa Croe

Right - their mistake that they were told they were worthless. Let 'em starve. Just like I said. You want to ignore them, because they truly are worthless in your eyes. Just admit it.

Seriously? Because someone I don't know was told they're worthless by someone else I don't know, I should be responsible for their well being?

Sorry, but there are a LOT worse things that happen in the world than someone's feelings being hurt.

They are definitely not worthless, but I also don't feel responsible for anything that happens in their lives....that is ridiculous.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: network dude

And you miss the point. I had help, and someone to encourage me. People in poverty don't have a mommy or daddy to pay for stuff while they are getting started.

What if you make just enough not to qualify for welfare? I've never heard of getting college completely free while on welfare anyway. Grants pay for some of it, but not all.

Why does everyone think a college degree is some magic bullet? My wife never graduated college and makes a nice 6 figure salary...

The argument that college is the be all end all is so over used and moot.

The fact is that if you want to succeed you will...if you want to put your hand out, and someone gives you something for free, human nature makes it easy to continue doing so.

One of my favorite quotes..Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.

a reply to: introvert

Thanks for your post, this one of the most illuminating and educational posts I have seen in all the years I've been coming to this site .... under various names as they thow me out every so often.

cheers

originally posted by: network dude
a reply to: introvert

All democrats are weak homosexuals, the only difference is weather they are in or out of the closet.

Generalizing an entire group is way easier than discussing individual points.

It's sad, election time seems to make everyone a wee bit stupider.

Since you can't even spell whether right I assume that last comment also applies to yourself?

a reply to: introvert

I respect your position but there is a problem. The world isn't black and white, its in color. There are MANY people who have both conservative and liberal positions on different respective issues. Personally I don't want a society that is all the way to the right OR the left, I want a society in the middle, where ALL ideas are listened to. We have let the internet polarize our society because like minded people tend so only seek out others with like beliefs both on the left and the right. So both sides are getting the viewpoint that the other side has NO good ideas or viewpoints of merit. IMHO that is the biggest problem our society has today, ideological polarization. So no, I dont want to silence anyone on the right or the left, it only hastens our slide towards mass civil unrest in my opinion. So many people are talking now, and SO few are listening.

originally posted by: tinymind

originally posted by: sirlancelot
a reply to: introvert



Makes you wonder why the conservative's in the GOP are winning! Sadly the conservatives help to maintain majority in the house, help to get majority in the Senate, and the leadership in both sides of congress doesn't do what they say they will do. We need to get rid of progressives and Rhino's in the White House, Senate, and House and then we can get get somewhere.

This sounds like the kind of thinking which was pointed out in the OP.

It would seem to be one or two of the points mentioned does fit quite well into the main right-wing agenda.
The elimination of social security, and the whole new deal, would but those who are most dependant on assistance back into the same conitions as were present in the early 1900's.
The elimination of any wage and work condition regulations would do the same for every working person in the country and allow employers to treat their workers with the same distain as they did then.
Of course, even though wages would go down to the lowest possible levels and the needy would not have any income what so ever; prices for food and shelter would likely rise to new highs and those living accomidations, which were available, would not be good.
The only real problem most of the right-wingers I know would have is; you will be around to bury all those who starve to death because of these conitions.

Im confused. So you have associated conservatism to mean the following:

1. Eliminate Social Security. (Obamacares re routed plenty of social security funds)
2. anti minimum wage increase at acceptable incremental levels. (news flash $15 min wage will greater greater unemployment and that not rhetoric its happening In Seattle. Google it. Not to mention many getting their new higher wage are realizing they cant qualify for food stamps and other govt handouts so they are reducing their hours)
3. Food cost has gone up dramatically under Obama's watch so not sure where you where going there.
4. The problem is lack of jobs and wage stagnation and with all the taxes and regulatory fee's businesses export those jobs. Unlike Rhino's and Obama who want the TPP. Conservatives are against this as it ships jobs offshore!

Get a clue!

I for one am not looking forward to a right-wing take over of the government.
Their attitude and agenda are just not acceptable to me.

originally posted by: lucifershiningone
Want to defeat them...state facts.

I notice they have a hard time with those and base everything they debate on emotions and bias.

FUnny SO do democrats. Example Harry reid,and th elady from arizona who was shot.

a reply to: introvert

Judging by 10 pages deep into this thread the Right wasn't defeated within 3 minutes?



The part I don't get is why the Democrats think they can fix THEIR problems by exposing the problems of the Republicans and vice versa.

Its like Kim Jong-un* blaming America when his people are starving with no jobs. Don't worry about America , get your sh1t undercontrol first. it like kids trying to pass blame when they are wrong.


*[or insert any other deflection strategist or country here ]

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: Vasa Croe

Not everyone is as fantastic as you. Some people need a little extra help. Maybe they aren't as smart as you. Maybe they have been told all their life that they are worthless, stupid and won't amount to anything, and they ended up believing it. Maybe as a teen girl, they had little self-worth, so they slept with some guys and got pregnant a few times. Now those men might have disappeared and the teen grows up with a family of her own to take care of, no support, trying to feed 3 or 4 kids, and no clue how to get herself out of poverty.

Not everyone is you. Not everyone has had or will have the same experience as you.

Exactly, so why do I have to pay for their mistakes?

Wow, another typical ignorant right wing response.

I'm alright Jack!

a reply to: ~Lucidity

For your very excellent, fact-based post that cuts right to the heart of the matter ...