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originally posted by: Reallyfolks
But is the push in aa towards God if one exist more along the lines of maybe you need to talk more than in a meeting so the push maybe talk to a higher power and don't think you are going crazy in the process? Again don't know but I assume in therapy the push is always talking, if no one is available still talk, but don't think your crazy for doing it?
originally posted by: C21H30O2I
a reply to: Reallyfolks
That's interesting. You know, if I talk out loud, to myself. Sounding out things, you know, it helps. But If I think, myself or people in general, talk out loud, to God I think that's crazy. I haven't tried to talk out loud to any type of God, for a long time mind you. I think that's crazy. hehe I don't know, It's something, that from an early age, for me. I cant do religion/god, in any shape or form. Nothing crazy happened to me, Just like, one day a light came on and well, It's just not for me.
Besides, isn't praying, just talking to oneself, kinda like positive thinking? Boosting yourself up and just thinking a god, is helping? never mind, I'm no good at religion talk. Just ends up a big mes.
The court insists that it does not direct citizens to sessions with religious themes, but as Americans United’s Sarah Jones points out, even the most cursory look at Pepper’s background would suggest that her counseling is far from secular:
She is a conservative Catholic who once taught at a Catholic elementary school and volunteered for Project Defending Life, a Catholic anti-abortion group. In a 2014 interview with the Albuquerque Journal, she insisted that couples who cohabitate before marriage have a higher risk of divorce, a statement that conforms to Catholic social teaching, but not to evidence. On a Facebook page, Pepper posted repeated rants about the evils of Planned Parenthood and abortion, as well as marriage equality and gay rights.
...
This is how Christian privilege works. The same privilege that led Kim Davis to think it’s okay to use the government as an extension of her religious beliefs is the privilege that allows Mary Pepper to counsel under the assumption that you can’t be a good parent without her particular understanding of how Jesus wants her to live — with the endorsement of the court system.
Court-ordered clients make up a significant portion of Pepper’s business; she told the station that approximately 50 percent of her clients are referred to her via family court. And there’s evidence that Pepper may be profiting from her relationship to the court in questionable ways because she holds her counseling sessions in public libraries.
There’s no overhead cost to Pepper, but she’s legally prohibited from accepting money for her services in public libraries.
...
KRQE confronted Pepper about the practice. She responded by ending the interview.
originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic
a reply to: C21H30O2I
Well, thanks. You're not too bad, yourself.
A little more about Mary Pepper, the counselor...
Source 1
The court insists that it does not direct citizens to sessions with religious themes, but as Americans United’s Sarah Jones points out, even the most cursory look at Pepper’s background would suggest that her counseling is far from secular:
She is a conservative Catholic who once taught at a Catholic elementary school and volunteered for Project Defending Life, a Catholic anti-abortion group. In a 2014 interview with the Albuquerque Journal, she insisted that couples who cohabitate before marriage have a higher risk of divorce, a statement that conforms to Catholic social teaching, but not to evidence. On a Facebook page, Pepper posted repeated rants about the evils of Planned Parenthood and abortion, as well as marriage equality and gay rights.
...
This is how Christian privilege works. The same privilege that led Kim Davis to think it’s okay to use the government as an extension of her religious beliefs is the privilege that allows Mary Pepper to counsel under the assumption that you can’t be a good parent without her particular understanding of how Jesus wants her to live — with the endorsement of the court system.
Source 2
Court-ordered clients make up a significant portion of Pepper’s business; she told the station that approximately 50 percent of her clients are referred to her via family court. And there’s evidence that Pepper may be profiting from her relationship to the court in questionable ways because she holds her counseling sessions in public libraries.
There’s no overhead cost to Pepper, but she’s legally prohibited from accepting money for her services in public libraries.
...
KRQE confronted Pepper about the practice. She responded by ending the interview.
originally posted by: Lilroanie
Quick note to the AA thing.
ETA: As I understand it the mother ASKED for help?
I will never identify myself or anyone else by ANY label other than HUMAN, period. The hatred humans have for one another and our world makes me sick frankly. Sigh.
originally posted by: Lilroanie
The higher power we were taught back then was simple. It could be God or a tree or a rock, it didn't matter. It was just something outside of yourself, you could talk to, to talk yourself out of taking that first hit or drink or whatever. Even writing stuff down in a journal was something encouraged. The higher power thing was only ever meant to be a coping mechanism outside yourself when you have no access to a human to help you get through whatever is troubling you and to help you keep clean. Not to become a bible thumper.
Holly Salzman went to a New Mexico District court for help co-parenting her children with her ex-husband.
originally posted by: Lilroanie
Quick note to the AA thing. 30+ years ago, here was the thinking I got from it when I attended meetings with a friend to support her and ended up realizing I was REALLY close to going down "That road" and stuck around for 5 years. Alcoholics/addicts are weak willed. They have no strength inside them to either A) stop after a drink or 2 like a normal person or B) are unable to say no in the first place to whatever they are addicted to.
When you are in rehab you have counselors and people around you can talk to. When you get out in the real world and are all alone you need someone to talk to that isn't you cause you are the problem. The higher power we were taught back then was simple. It could be God or a tree or a rock, it didn't matter. It was just something outside of yourself, you could talk to, to talk yourself out of taking that first hit or drink or whatever. Even writing stuff down in a journal was something encouraged. The higher power thing was only ever meant to be a coping mechanism outside yourself when you have no access to a human to help you get through whatever is troubling you and to help you keep clean. Not to become a bible thumper.
Hell, I went to meetings in Malibu that were Wiccan and really cool, and I'm not Wiccan. If you have any or no belief there IS a meeting group out there that shares or complements whatever you want.
There's such a thing as a 'dry' alcoholic/addict too. In other words you quit the addiction of choice and are 'clean' but you still have the same addict personality that comes out in other ways. Like bad social skills, unable to hold a job because you can't cope, or a plethora of other ways. The 12 step thing is a fairly good mechanism to change the actual thinking that makes you an addict or alcoholic. Because if you don't change the way you cope and think about things you will always struggle with it.
It wouldn't surprise me to find AA has, as an organization, become more religious. However, I do know that even now there are AA groups that are, christian, Buddhist, agnostic, atheist etc etc, in most areas. So if you are ordered to AA classes (which is stupid to begin with, because until YOU decide you have a problem and to fix it, no amount of rehab or meetings will 'fix' you) there are meetings you can go to without the religious theme. Personally my higher power was my Dog She helped me a ton lol.
Lil
ETA: As I understand it the mother ASKED for help? Am I wrong? So why couldn't she choose what counselor she went to? That's definite BS. But I would have gone to keep my kids or gone straight to the press or something. Family courts are ridiculous now adays. Keep kids in abusive homes and remove them for stupid # like breast feeding 'wrong' (is there a 'wrong' way to breast feed?) I dunno what's happened to humanity, but I'm not impressed. I will never identify myself or anyone else by ANY label other than HUMAN, period. The hatred humans have for one another and our world makes me sick frankly. Sigh.
originally posted by: harvestdog
a reply to: Annee
AA is a highly religious organization which uses fear to coerce its members to stay.
With contributions from other group members, including atheists who reined in religious content (such as Oxford material) that could later result in controversy, by fall 1938 Wilson expanded the six steps into the final version of the Twelve Steps, which are detailed in Chapter Five of the Big Book, called "How It Works.
" Wilson later wrote that he found the Oxford Group aggressive in their evangelism. He objected to the group's publicity-seeking and intolerance of nonbelievers, and those alcoholics who were practicing Catholics found their views to be in conflict with the Oxford teachings. On a personal level, while Wilson was in the Oxford Group he was constantly checked by its members for his smoking and womanizing.
originally posted by: harvestdog
They have a saying for anyone who thinks they may just graduate out. It goes a little something like this:" The only alternative to AA is jails, institutions, or death".