Refugee Apocalypse

originally posted by: blacktie
there are only a few options for them today

Every night I sit there and try to figure out how all of this is going to unravel.. a muslim takeover, contained nonetheless by UN Troops operating alongside communist Russian Chinese troops..? Isn't that right?

I am of the opinion that Russian and Chinese are not about to submit to any Sharia Law..anywhere in the world..

originally posted by: johnwick

originally posted by: angeldoll
a reply to: masqua


If there is a bus crash, and all passengers are taken to a hospital, the first thing the emergency department will do, is set up a triage, to determine which patients are in the most need, and who will get treatment first.

I've wondered myself why this isn't being done in Europe. The Syrians are clearly the most needy, and should be given first dibs at assistance, you would think. They could easily show proof of Syrian citizenship. Make it mandatory.

Most discard their IDs so they can't be identified..... Exactly the type folks want around right?

Why would one discard their identity documents while searching for asylum? They would be able to utilize phony names and data..

a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

Not sure where this has been posted in the thread, one of the links had a pretty good section on it, but here is a quick over view of where they are headed;

10,000 Syrians Are Headed For The Following 180 US "Refugee Processing Centers"
For the past several weeks it seemed as if Germany had truly become the promised land for Mideast asylum seekers, primarily those seeking to escape the Syrian civil (and global proxy) war, but according to various media reports, also a material number of "ISIS-linked terrorists." Then it all came crashing down earlier today when Germany's beloved by all refugees "Mutti" said genug, and with one decision shut down the border with Austria in the process unraveling decades of customs-union progress (following promptly by the Czech Republic doing the same, with Italy expected to follow suit in the hours ahead).

Ironically, just as Europe is shutting its doors to Syrian refugees, the US is opening its own.
It is not clear how much the screening process for Syrians costs, but the US government spent $1.1 billion last year resettling 70,000 people from around the world, or almost $16,000 per head.

www.zerohedge.com...

Check your State:
www.scribd.com...

a reply to: tony9802

In mimicking those who have successfully entered into the UE/US through the refugees programs, the truly needy and righteous fled with nothing more than the clothes upon their backs. Not the high dollar Nike's and designer handbags and smart phones seen by many of the recent mobs of healthy, well kept males. These same males are the ones we are questioning in this thread, why do they not all have family, children, elderly beside them? it is about the survival of the vulnerable after all not the prime aged physically fit men who obviously did not suffer and starve from the wars and displacements in their home countries.

As has been stated in this thread and imo rightfully so, why do these men flee rather than standing firm upon their lands and defend them? If war comes and it seems it is, to the EU countries, and america, you will not see the men fleeing but rather standing their ground to protect their families and country.

Too many questions and too many hidden powers ruling over the sovereign citizens of the free world with this emergency.

a reply to: eletheia

I have just watched the news and its frightening ... the "refugees" 

are not asking for help they are demanding their rights.

Do their rights take precedence over the rights of the citizens of the host country?

The rights they should be demanding are the rights they have earned in their own country. If they are so willing to fight, kill and die for their rights, then they need to turn around and return to their homes.

I hate how horrible I sound, but I owe the immigrants nothing. I have not been handed anything in my country. I worked harder and longer than many, because being a woman in administration, automatically meant I had to prove I deserved my position. I made a lot of sacrifices, and I am paying for most of them now in my old age. I earned through blood, sweat and tears, everything I have in my possession. Please notice that I say what I have in my possession, because "things" are not permanent and can't be owned. If anything, things have a way of owning you. Regardless, what little I have, it is "my" right to decide with whom and how much I share.

I have always been a live and let live kind of person. A borderline bohemian, country gal, that believed in God, family, community and country, in that order. I was a military brat and I actively served in the military. I don't have a xenophobic bone in my body, especially since my family is pure Heinz 57. I am religiously tolerant as my family is Jewish, Catholic, Baptist, Protestant, and I had a family member that was 7 day Adventist for a while. I have friends that are Buddhist, Muslim, Atheist, Wiccan and Agnostics.

My fears are for the safety and well being of my country and community. Where do we go when there is nothing left for the citizens of the host countries? The government claims it doesn't have enough money to provide adequate medical care, housing and food for its Veterans, let alone the poor, homeless and disenfranchised in our country. Where are they going to get the means to care for thousands of immigrants, hostile immigrants, demanding immigrants?

What do you think is going to happen when immigrants are provided for, while citizens sit hungry in the cold? I just don't see this working at all. Unless the government has been lying all along about the lack of funding. Then it will be much worse. How does it look that a government is okay with their citizens being hungry and homeless, but suddenly finds funding to provide for hostile immigrants?

I am looking for someone to come along and tell me how foolish I am. Someone to show me that I am just being a silly old lady, and show me why my fears are foundless. Otherwise I am going to remain skeptical and not very charitable.

a reply to: antar

These same males are the ones we are questioning in this thread, why do they not all have family, children, elderly beside them? it is about the survival of the vulnerable after all not the prime aged physically fit men who obviously did not suffer and starve from the wars and displacements in their home countries. 

Indeed, because they are not who and what they say they are.

If it is so plainly clear to the most common of us, then the governments are fully aware they are opening the gates and sacrificing the villagers.

Now we have to ask why?

a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

WEll I was in a rush to make that last post without looking back in the thread to properly give YOU credit for putting it into words. Several of your thoughts on this were well accepted by the readers and myself. You brought up the fact that all the countries accepting the refugees are doing so at the peril and further down fall of their own people. Furthermore the refugees will not have to wait or go without as born citizens do in order to get their papers, ID, birth and SS information together. Waiting lists to get into GOV housing, checks etc can simply be bypassed in this situation.

Box people, homeless, hungry, unable to get into shelters even in extreme weather as we have always seen during storms and heat waves where they find them dead or dying.

My sister who lives in Florida said that several months ago INS did a 'sweep' of the town and emptied out several blocks of apartments 3 stories high and higher of illegal immigrants (all on welfare, food stamps and medical coverage) sent them back to mexico, and the southern countries. I asked her recently if they had been refilled and she said no, still empty.

Soooo, my best guess is that places like these apartments, the abandoned, foreclosed homes, older FEMA trailers will be filled soon.

Thank you for your contributions to this subject.

I've just been catching up with Aljazeera News on the latest events on the Hungarian/Serbian border, it doesn't look good.

The migrants/refugees have twice tried to break through the border fences in the last couple of hours, and were met with Hungarian riot police alongside regular police who pushed them back with tear gas and water cannons, some were hitting the refugees with batons.

The refugees then began attacking the police and throwing rocks and other similar missiles. Shocking behaviour on both sides IMO.

It's a bit calmer at the minute but likely to kick off again, they're very angry.

a reply to: antar

The fact that you are now comparing women and children fleeing war to Nazis shows how insanely disgusting this far-right propaganda has become.

These people are running away from the extremism you blame them for.

I'm done ATS. This place is becoming a right-wing cesspool of ignorance, with some of the most disgusting attitudes.

Most of you are echoing exactly what Anders Behring Breivik preached, and you don't even see how disturbing this is.
I'm more scared by you far-right ignoramuses than I am a refugee fleeing war, and I hope our governments are watching all of YOU very closely.

Well done ATS mods, you're allowing these radicals to destroy this forum with their bs

a reply to: Rocker2013
You've simply attacked your opponents without making any legitimate points about the real issue, and in my opinion your accusations are antagonistic - possibly deliberately so. Along with claims of selflessness, this seems to be a key element of one side of this argument. I can understand the point of wanting to help, but can you not see the other side? Can you really not understand the very obvious potential problems with this mass-migration?

a reply to: Rocker2013

@Rocker2013, you may be the person we have been looking for.

Most of us here are very aware that the media has its own agenda, and we are at the mercy of the information that is available to us. I for one, and I am sure there are many others, want to know the truth. I know what I see every day where I live, and there have been those that are in the middle of some of what is happening, also posting their concerns.

Yes I fear the anger and the hostility that I see, especially when it seems so misplaced. We don't see frightened people that are fleeing war in fear for the lives of their children and families. We don't see peaceful people in need, seeking assistance.

I see you are angry and disgusted, but with your post you have done nothing but accused us of ignorance, which I openly admit. There is much I don't know. Obviously, you know something we don't.

If we are being misled and the information coming from the host countries is one-sided, then show us what you see. Show us where we are unfounded in our concerns.

Is anybody else thinking that these events may be the necessary end to freedom of religion?

Unless we want Islam taking over, religious freedom may have to end.

Sharia law for instance, there ought to be a law. (against it)

In a world where cannabis is illegal, is banning some religious freedoms such a big step?

a reply to: antar

This is interesting that before the Obama administration it was only 70 to 80 thousands refugees taking every year to the US

This news is alarming, we have now a nation that can not even take care of its own citizens and tax payers have to support now refugees.

originally posted by: doobydoll
I've just been catching up with Aljazeera News on the latest events on the Hungarian/Serbian border, it doesn't look good.

The migrants/refugees have twice tried to break through the border fences in the last couple of hours, and were met with Hungarian riot police alongside regular police who pushed them back with tear gas and water cannons, some were hitting the refugees with batons.

The refugees then began attacking the police and throwing rocks and other similar missiles. Shocking behaviour on both sides IMO.

It's a bit calmer at the minute but likely to kick off again, they're very angry.

Time to do like th ecountries below mexico do. Start shooting the ones who touch the fence. OR Elctrify it and let them electorute themselves till they get the message to leave.

originally posted by: NightSkyeB4Dawn


Do their rights take precedence over the rights of the citizens of the host country?

The rights they should be demanding are the rights they have earned in their own country. If they are so willing to fight, kill and die for their rights, then they need to turn around and return to their homes.

For everyone screaming for their *rights* ... there is usually another who's

*rights* will be being infringed by theirs ... It seems the first thing learned

these days is "Its my right"

I hate how horrible I sound, but I owe the immigrants nothing.

Touche! I am in total agreement with you, and It really is your right to

feel whatever you want to feel ... and let no one tell you otherwise.

I have not been handed anything in my country. I worked harder and longer than many, because being a woman in administration, automatically meant I had to prove I deserved my position.

LOL!! Been there ... done that ... got the T shirt

Regardless, what little I have, it is "my" right to decide with whom and how much I share.

TOO RIGHT Its yours ... you earned it, no need for apologies.

I have always been a live and let live kind of person.

And tolerant Best kind to be.

My fears are for the safety and well being of my country and community. Where do we go when there is nothing left for the citizens of the host countries? The government claims it doesn't have enough money to provide adequate medical care, housing and food for its Veterans, let alone the poor, homeless and disenfranchised in our country. Where are they going to get the means to care for thousands of immigrants, hostile immigrants, demanding immigrants?

With you on this one too

What do you think is going to happen when immigrants are provided for, while citizens sit hungry in the cold? I just don't see this working at all. Unless the government has been lying all along about the lack of funding. Then it will be much worse. How does it look that a government is okay with their citizens being hungry and homeless, but suddenly finds funding to provide for hostile immigrants?

I don't know where you live, but for me my government takes its orders

not from its people ... but from the United States of Europe. So the

sooner we're out the better!!!!

I am looking for someone to come along and tell me how foolish I am. Someone to show me that I am just being a silly old lady, and show me why my fears are foundless. Otherwise I am going to remain skeptical and not very charitable.

You're not silly or foolish and your fears are not foundless. I think we're all

in for a scary ride, just hope the all the governments stand firm and find a

solution.

a reply to: Rocker2013

How would you handle this? What are your solutions to the millions flooding borders from not only Syria, but every other conflicting country in the world. Are you behind a full blown Jihad against the evil western world, except china, Russia etc.?

a reply to: Toadmund

Religiosity implodes, failed experiment goes awry... we have seen where a one world religion has been discussed, it is called politics.

a reply to: tony9802

The reason why they throw away their passports is ...

1) you cannot expell someone witout a passport (to where?)
2) so you first have to find the country of origin AND this country must be willing to issue new papers (some aren't)

By doind so, even the ones who will be identified and expelled later gain a couple of months, maybe even a year or two a free ride (social welfare plus housing).

>
As has been stated in this thread and imo rightfully so, why do these men flee rather than standing firm upon their lands and defend them?
<


It is not like you think it is, because ...

a) Many of those "men" are rather boys of 18, 20, 22 years of age. They might be tough, but not really experienced for fights. Rather, they "flee" from the draft anyway.
b) Many do not come from war areas but safe areas (though in a war torn country where it will sooner or later reach them). So, the family sits in a refugee camp eg. Lebanon, Turkey or Jordania or even keeps living in a safe part of the homeland.
c) Families put their money together and give it to the fittest person, so this person can get to another country and gain asylum. THEN, this person is supposed to pull the family over (which, in the case of Germany, is easy to do for the wife and children because someone who gains asylum is entitled to it). Such a journey can cost up to 20,000 USD, so they choose carefully whom to send.

Now, since the trick works so nicely for Syrians, some nationals of other countries also try it out, throw away their passports and simply say "I come from Syria" ... or buy for about 1000 USD a real syrian passport complete with their very own pictures, available eg. in Turkey. Those passports are real ones, not fakes ... they come directly from IS (or other factions) occupied territories, when, along with the occupation, they seized the documents.

The route via Hungary is dead for now, people have already started to leave Serbia for Croatia and will reach Germany via Austria.

BTW - Germany did not "close" the border, they only want to see who enters the country and ask for identification (before, there was no border check and everybody could come in). Now, whether you have papers or not, you can simply say "Asylum" and will be detained, put onto a train and send to a registration center. After that, the normal asylum procedure will start (and this takes currently between 3-24 months). During this time, they get free housing and social welfare, free health care and a few more things. After 3 months, they are allowed to work under certanin conditions, after 15 months, without conditions.
If they gain Asylum (for Syrians, it is 99% likely), they can stay for 3 years, after 3 years, if the situation in their homecountry is unchanged, they will gain a permanent residence. If they won't, they still can walk the judicial system for years, or are accepted on the grouns of humanitarian reasons. In effect, only less than 10% of all people, who make it to Germany, have to leave the country.

The problem they face, though, is missing language skills and also missing job qualifications. This means that they will have to stay 1-4 years in various courses and qualifications before they can really start to work (unless they prefer to work with no qualification for minimum wage and less, but with that, one can only pay for ones very own expenses, too little when one is married or has 2, 3 4 and more children). So many of them will stay for years to come in the social welfare system, which basically feeds, houses and clothes them, but they won't be able to contribute to the states system themselves ... = for now and the years to come, a bad deal for Germany and its tax payers. How it looks in the long run, depends on so many variables, that it is impossible to say how it will work out.

double post