NYT: Exodus of Syrians Highlights Political Failure of the West

i suppose its always easy for some critics to take any source (NYT, WSJ, etc) and just label it as 'biased' without digesting the article.

www.nytimes.com...

“The migrant crisis in Europe is essentially self-inflicted,” said Lina Khatib, a research associate at the University of London and until recently the head of the Carnegie Middle East Center in Beirut. “Had European countries sought serious solutions to political conflicts like the one in Syria, and dedicated enough time and resources to humanitarian assistance abroad, Europe would not be in this position today.”

what goes around, comes back around? karma's a what? sure seems the west brought the syrian crisis - and the domestic bloodshed it will end in - upon itself.

a reply to: Sovan

Yah, failed Western Interventions. If you ask me they aren't failures, conquest and subjugation is about breaking things, not fixing them.

They hide the destruction behind benign sounding terms like "Humanitarian Intervention".

Bombs for peace… lol.

So as a leader of a country...especially a military or intelligence agency head. You should have had plenty of analysis of this type of thread due to war and famine and drought. Basically they should have expected it and been prepared for it.

originally posted by: amazing
So as a leader of a country...especially a military or intelligence agency head. You should have had plenty of analysis of this type of thread due to war and famine and drought. Basically they should have expected it and been prepared for it.

I think the veto of resolutions to humanitarian intervene in Syria (like libya) has caused delays with their plans to "humanize" Syria, for instance.

Syria is not Libya, Assad maintains control and the support of the people. Can't expect every country to just roll over on command. The longer it takes to subjugate, the more blood is shed, the more refugees seek shelter elsewhere.

Wallah. Great big monkey wrench to gum up EU works.

originally posted by: intrptr

originally posted by: amazing
So as a leader of a country...especially a military or intelligence agency head. You should have had plenty of analysis of this type of thread due to war and famine and drought. Basically they should have expected it and been prepared for it.

I think the veto of resolutions to humanitarian intervene in Syria (like libya) has caused delays with their plans to "humanize" Syria, for instance.

Syria is not Libya, Assad maintains control and the support of the people. Can't expect every country to just roll over on command. The longer it takes to subjugate, the more blood is shed, the more refugees seek shelter elsewhere.

Wallah. Great big monkey wrench to gum up EU works.

Yeah, but you should still have contingency plans. If we know there is drought and famine and war and the possibility of a mass migration, we should plan on what we will do. Meaning:

Where are people likely to leave and where will they go...and how, by land or sea. If there is a closed border, do we have plan on what to do with a huge camp of hundreds of thousands of people at a border crossing. We don't plan things very well and we don't consider these things very well.

originally posted by: Sovan
what goes around, comes back around? karma's a what? sure seems the west brought the syrian crisis - and the domestic bloodshed it will end in - upon itself.

Yes it is.

Now that this thread is less Putin is Good, Obama bad, I find myself agreeing with you. There are many of us who support helping Assad find a political solution i.e. Power sharing.

America and it's allies need to back down and work with Putin on this i.e. compromise and work together to eradicate ISIS and let Russia, Iran etc have their way with keeping Assad and letting the nation speak for itself through an election.

The people of Syria should be the focus of our attention, not two superpowers having a pissing contest on foreign soil.

a reply to: Sovan

what goes around, comes back around? karma's a what? sure seems the west brought the syrian crisis - and the domestic bloodshed it will end in - upon itself.

How is this the West's fault again? I thought all the lefty hand wringers want us out of other peoples politics? What was that outburst of freedom called? The Arab Spring a western plot? When did the uprising begin? Some of you need to read more and yap less. Googles yer buddy.


V

originally posted by: markosity1973

The people of Syria should be the focus of our attention, not two superpowers having a pissing contest on foreign soil.

Well said.

In addition to the focus on the people of Syria, there must be a clear western focus on eliminating Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi and destroying ISIS.

Al-Baghdadi and Daesh/ISIS are the nightmare that keeps on giving sending Iraqi and Syrian refugees in every direction. And, of course, al-Baghdadi and his ilk are "coming to a western city near you".

a reply to: amazing

Best laid plane? Who would have though that Greece would be immersed in Austerity (debt) so bad they could;t afford to patrol there ocean front to prevent the stream if refugees.

Like, what would happen in America if the Border Patrol all went home? What happened to the east west border (Iron Curtain) and the Berlin wall when the people in the east found out they could cross without getting shot?

If people are desperate they will find a way, they will find an opening in the fence, wall, border…

a reply to: Sovan

Exodus of Syrians Highlights Political Failure of the West

- It also highlights their own failure to resist the US meddling in their own back yards.
- It s the price they pay for being slave states to the US.

Interfere = fault of the West
Do not interfere = fault of the West

Do something = fault of the West
Do nothing = fault of the West

It's never the fault of the people who have had generations to create an atmosphere similar to that of the West (that they hate but want to live off of).

It can never be the fault of a backwards mindset that keeps them rooted in barbaric customs the West left behind.

Far, far easier to simply blame the West every time no matter what while holding out a hand.

originally posted by: amazing

originally posted by: intrptr

originally posted by: amazing
So as a leader of a country...especially a military or intelligence agency head. You should have had plenty of analysis of this type of thread due to war and famine and drought. Basically they should have expected it and been prepared for it.

I think the veto of resolutions to humanitarian intervene in Syria (like libya) has caused delays with their plans to "humanize" Syria, for instance.

Syria is not Libya, Assad maintains control and the support of the people. Can't expect every country to just roll over on command. The longer it takes to subjugate, the more blood is shed, the more refugees seek shelter elsewhere.

Wallah. Great big monkey wrench to gum up EU works.

Yeah, but you should still have contingency plans. If we know there is drought and famine and war and the possibility of a mass migration, we should plan on what we will do. Meaning:

Where are people likely to leave and where will they go...and how, by land or sea. If there is a closed border, do we have plan on what to do with a huge camp of hundreds of thousands of people at a border crossing. We don't plan things very well and we don't consider these things very well.

I think it's looking more and more to me like all this is the plan.

Not one leader of any of the member nations has objected to, nor complained of, the fact that Merkel is guilty of seriously breaching international agreements on immigration laws, and placed every nation in the Union at risk. Not a word from the media either. Not even a criticism. Why? Is this not a serious matter? Is it not this illegal act by Merkel that has turned what was a crisis into this catastrophe?

When leaders of nations all stay quiet after one of them creates such unprecedented chaos for all due to blatantly and unilaterally over-turning internationally agreed immigration laws, it's a deafening silence.

Maybe the reasons will become more apparent once all EU nations are bound by the soon-to-be-born 'mandatory quotas' trap .. . i mean, agreement.

It's all dodgy if you ask me.

I'm watching closely.

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: amazing

Best laid plane? Who would have though that Greece would be immersed in Austerity (debt) so bad they could;t afford to patrol there ocean front to prevent the stream if refugees.

Like, what would happen in America if the Border Patrol all went home? What happened to the east west border (Iron Curtain) and the Berlin wall when the people in the east found out they could cross without getting shot?

If people are desperate they will find a way, they will find an opening in the fence, wall, border…

They will find a way, that's true. But instead of just saying no, we should have contingencies. Just like in US...we have a closed border with Mexico, supposedly, but yet we know thousands of immigrants will cross every year, especially into Texas and Arizona...they should expect that and plan for that. Do they have an increased police presence? Are they prepared for an influx children into the school system? Have they planned for healthcare? Housing?

Not saying you should just give that stuff away, but there will be pressure on infrastructure and those that do not prepare, must pay the consequences of that failure.

a reply to: amazing

Lol, thanks for overlooking my spelling nightmare, I forgot to proof read my post. Must have been late.

I believe in contingencies, but even those go out the door when it comes to war and conquest.

The worst case scenario wasn't figured into nuclear reactors in Japan, either. In case of mega earthquake, Tsunami and power back up failure…. run.

No one thought the destruction of the Syrian government and military would take this long. The contingency is let the refugees in. What choice is there? Machine gunning then in the Mediterranean isn't allowed.

Another reason why we should leave the Mid East and let the people kill each other. We can't fix the place because it can't be fixed.