Germans are so scared of surveillance they microwave their ID cards

originally posted by: hutch622
a reply to: LoveSolMoonDeath

So having my real name, birth date, address, picture (it's on german's card) en.wikipedia.org... on a chip

Thats why i said bar code . The data can be stored remotely and easily accessed . DNA is the police of the future .

Bar code is already on my driving license and I see no problem what so ever. Just a fast copy/paste of the writings on this document with no attached database on me and no RFID. On the other hand DNA police is fine BUT it must be legally restricted and not widely used on people IMO.

a reply to: LoveSolMoonDeath

It sure as hell beats having to convince us to have a plastic strip under our skin to be scanned each day if we simply carry the strip on an ID card. Perhaps Hrm! revelation 's prophesy is here already in Germany at least.

originally posted by: Phage
Seems sort of pointless, other than an act of protest.
Like burning a draft card.

You are right in a sense that we cannot and won't stop technology no matter how hard we try. But I'm reluctant to put too much infos on a digital card. There's quite a few bad people out there and I don't want to have all my life given to them. Our infos are worth big money for business to get our profile and target us with the 'right' publicity so I feel any security on any portable database on us wouldn't last long.

a reply to: Phage

Microwaving the card should erase the data on the microchip, so it isn't pointless, is it? If this is an RFID chip, it could be read from a distance by an RFID reader, for example.

a reply to: LoveSolMoonDeath

DNA police is fine BUT it must be legally restricted and not widely used on people IMO.

I fail to see how it could be used against you unless you broke the law .

originally posted by: hutch622
a reply to: LoveSolMoonDeath

Just my opinion but i would be quite happy to have all my information put on my car licence . Details like name address etc but also a link of some sort to my fingerprints and DNA . It doesnt have to be electronic , perhaps a bar code . I have not done anything illegal , no need to fear having my details on record . To my way of thinking , if you want to rape , rob , murder etc you better be prepared to walk to the scene of the crime . I cannot for the life of me see the downside of that . Well unless you raped someone .

cool, so you wouldnt mind with that nice clean virgin wrap sheet of yours that you have packaged all into one box with a big beautiful ribbon on it just for me to steal your identity and sell it to someone who really needs a new start at life.
like seriously, come on dude people would be getting killed for that card.

a reply to: PLAYERONE01

The powers that be already know my name , my address , my birth date , my birth place . how much i earn , how much i made last year , where i am employed , the cars i own , the number of my mobile , how much interest i earn on my bank account therefore how much i have in it , if i went overseas and if so to where , in my case they have my DNA and fingerprints ( drink driving ) so please tell me what have i or you got to lose . Identity theft , blah blah blah , if the photo doesnt match your licence photo your safe . Do you really think identity theft will get you in trouble in the long run . Your on the internet , you identity is already at risk .

So people are worried these RFID chips can be activated to track ones movements as they travel around during the day.

Just wrap the cards you carry with you in a couple layers of aluminum foil. The purchases you make will still track what you buy, when and where you buy it, but foil will protect you from card readers that hackers carry and thresholds with readers installed.

Other than that everyone is filed and monitored pretty much everywhere they go and what they do these days.

Smile, you're on Candid Camera.

a reply to: intrptr

So my new credit card is less secure than the old. The company probably know this and don't care. Also it actually puts me at risk of having my identification stolen. In the EU and especially UK we are being flooded with people wanting to live here and obviously, if they are illegal get an identify. Of you can hack into a card with all your information the German guy has a major point which I hope the press and other countries latch onto immediately. Angela is doing a 180' turn on immigration with borders suddenly being discussed in Germany so the government is obviously aware of this side effect to its citizens personal security, but perhaps the horse has bolted already on this one with insecure data on people walking the streets. At least the guy has to be close to you to grab your credit card before he goes shopping - on your behalf.

a reply to: LoveSolMoonDeath

Reminds me of a little something we had once called the "stamp act".

Better not damage "state property".

a reply to: ColCurious

ahhhh. the epicness of deutschland (fps germany anyone?)

but on a serious note, du ist nicht un depp (close enough? i don't want to cheat using a translator)

did you know a temporary (visa) card has a chip, but not a permanent one?

go on....... put a temporary card in and crank her up!

a reply to: darkbake

oh it will erase it alright.

spectacularly, if you know what you are looking at.

originally posted by: Phage
Seems sort of pointless, other than an act of protest.
Like burning a draft card.

You just sound like a stroppy nerd. By doing this [the burning], this guy is in the news and on the internet and we are right now having a discussion about it. None of which would have happened without his doings.
Therefore I wouldn't call it 'useless'. It will reach people and make them think who would have otherwise not done so. In my books that is quite something.
Plus Germans are fortunately very suspicious because of our past. To ridicule our sometimes over the top responses only shows that you have never lived in a truly intrusive society, where you face jail just because you forgot to tell them you have moved house...[personal experience, only got out of it because sister worked for state and changed details on pc]

I don't find this article amusing or useless, I really don't. Please keep your sometimes useless [you can make sense at times] comments to yourself, you ain't all it.

originally posted by: LoveSolMoonDeath
www.washingtonpost.com...

According to a police statement, the man was concerned that his privacy might be violated by the microchip that has been embedded in all German IDs since 2010. The man now faces either a fine or time in jail for the offense of illegally modifying official documents. According to German law, identification documents are state property.

I'm used to casual paperwork, passport, driving license and so on. I'm for a medical 'card' on which my essential would be stored (blood type, allergy, heart disease...) so I could be taken care effectively should I have an accident.

But a chipped ID card, hum...what's on this, to what extend, who can read it/pirate this, can I limit the infos like the one on my passport?

I'd prolly do the same

Yeah! And who is the state, if not the PEOPLE?

a reply to: Shiloh7

At least the guy has to be close to you to grab your credit card before he goes shopping - on your behalf.

That video was from 2013. The commercial for card wallet I saw the other day said that they can now be read from arms length.

Unless you wrap them in tin foil. Gives a whole new meaning to tinfoil hat paranoia, lol.

ETA: RFID chips work by receiving a signal that activates then to send out the card holders private information to a nearby reader. If the initial signal doesn't reach the chip in the card, it can't respond. Several layers of tin foil will accomplish that. I don't know which "card wallets" on the market can be trusted.

originally posted by: hutch622
a reply to: LoveSolMoonDeath

DNA police is fine BUT it must be legally restricted and not widely used on people IMO.

I fail to see how it could be used against you unless you broke the law .

unless you are a abortion provider, and would like to remain discreet about it when you are out and about, because your life has been threatened.....or, are an atheist trying to get a job in a predominately religious part of the country.....or, you're a former drug addict, clean for several years trying to put your life back together, and you apply for a position working in place, where you might have contact with children.....or, after serving 10 years in jail for robbery, that took place in your teens, you're trying to get a job that involves handling money.....or.....

Pointless action. Either the information on the card is only on the card or there is a copy on a computer. If its the card only then only the owner of the card can allow people to access the information. Presumably you wouldn't give it to your local ned! If the information is also on computer (99.9999999999% certain of that!) then destroying the copy on the card achieves nothing.

Either way a pointless exercise.

My own opinion is that a single id card makes sense. Our lives are firmly linked to electronic information and systems so it makes so much sense to have a single id instead of a brand new one unique id for every bank, car,phone, passport, NHS , National Insurance, store card etc etc It's just mental. With so many id's it becomes easier for somebody to fake one or two parts of that in order to gain access to new material. For example a new store card in your name you didn't know about.

With a single ID card you put all your security into it. With the correct controls the single ID can be become a protection against state intrusion and surveillance. Think about it.......

HAH! Too funny, but a bit insane he would be in trouble for that. At worst, he would have to get a new ID because his is broken, and he should not have admitted to it.

I have about $50 worth of Philippine bills my parents mailed me back, burned all on the right half where the metal strip is. Apparently my mother was concerned about chemicals on the bills and microwaved them for whatever reasons I will not understand.

originally posted by: hutch622
a reply to: LoveSolMoonDeath

Just my opinion but i would be quite happy to have all my information put on my car licence . Details like name address etc but also a link of some sort to my fingerprints and DNA . It doesnt have to be electronic , perhaps a bar code . I have not done anything illegal , no need to fear having my details on record . To my way of thinking , if you want to rape , rob , murder etc you better be prepared to walk to the scene of the crime . I cannot for the life of me see the downside of that . Well unless you raped someone .

If you say so.

originally posted by: Hecate666

originally posted by: Phage
Seems sort of pointless, other than an act of protest.
Like burning a draft card.

You just sound like a stroppy nerd. By doing this [the burning], this guy is in the news and on the internet and we are right now having a discussion about it. None of which would have happened without his doings.
Therefore I wouldn't call it 'useless'. It will reach people and make them think who would have otherwise not done so. In my books that is quite something.
Plus Germans are fortunately very suspicious because of our past. To ridicule our sometimes over the top responses only shows that you have never lived in a truly intrusive society, where you face jail just because you forgot to tell them you have moved house...[personal experience, only got out of it because sister worked for state and changed details on pc]

I don't find this article amusing or useless, I really don't. Please keep your sometimes useless [you can make sense at times] comments to yourself, you ain't all it.

Actually I find Phage's post to mostly be a good standard of sanity, though I will disagree with him at times, he usually has a solid platform.

On this "news" item, he's right. It's like burning a flag, cutting an ID in half... Or forbid what I did -- Laminated my Social Security paper card!!! Even though it says not to laminate it on the card!!! Can I get a news article on me now?