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originally posted by: blondegiraffe
a reply to: bbracken677
i agree! i also think, since we can't be sure how long they have been cheating for, they should be stripped of the superbowl wins they have gotten under brady, because who knows? he could have been cheating like this since college and just never gotten caught. he thought that destroying his phone would get him out of trouble, but they did pull the phone records, and obviously they found some corroborating evidence or he wouldn't be in trouble for it.
originally posted by: bbracken677
a reply to: OccamsRazor04
First of all, that whole article was about Brady's statement. Brady said this, Brady said that.
It does not say he turned over texts... he turned over emails and "phone records"
I have one question Occam: Are you a Pat's fan? A Brady fanboy?
That article is not evidence...it is hearsay at best centering around a statement Brady made. Period.
Mr. Brady’s certified agents offered to provide a spreadsheet that would identify all of the individuals with whom Mr. Brady had exchanged text messages during [the relevant time] period; the agents suggested that the League could contact those individuals and request production of any relevant text messages that they retained.
His agents also said that the league could attempt to get the actual text messages from the phones of the people with whom Brady communicated, but the league refused to attempt to try, claiming that it would be too hard to track down the various people and to persuade them to cooperate.
originally posted by: verylowfrequency
Brady is just the latest Lance Armstrong. Common sense shows clearly his intent was to hide the truth or perpetuate a lie and common sense shows the lie is in regards to his instructions and ongoing conversation for ball deflation. His only valid argument is whether or not he can be held contractually to oblige for his behavior when the evidence might not be up to contractual legal standards.
If Brady was a good moral man he would of had his phone wiped and recycled after he satisfied the NFL's wishes.
Sure he has no legal obligation to turn over his device, but if he was innocent he wouldn't of hired somebody to destroy it when he knew it was relevant to the investigation.
It is those like Brady that teach children that lying and cheating pays if you are smart enough to conceal the truth. In that way Brady significantly damages our world and precisely why he should be banned.
Last week Judge Berman openly wondered why the NFL would conclude that Brady played some role in deflating footballs when there is no direct evidence of Brady’s involvement
Nash(NFL): "Is there a text in which Mr. Brady instructs someone to put a needle in a football? No there is not such direct evidence."
Published reports of Judge Berman’s remarks on Wednesday reveal a judge deeply perplexed by the NFL’s system of justice. Most notably, Judge Berman sharply questioned why the NFL refused to let Brady’s legal team ask questions of NFL general counsel Jeffrey Pash during Brady’s appeal on June 23. Remember, Pash edited the so-called “independent” report authored by attorney Ted Wells, whom the NFL had hired to investigate the Deflategate controversy. Pash’s role in the Wells Report—the key source of information used by Goodell to punish Brady—made Pash a potentially crucial witness in Brady’s appeal. Judge Berman went so far as to warn the NFL that an arbitration award can be vacated if a key witness was made unavailable in an arbitration hearing.
originally posted by: verylowfrequency
If Brady was a good moral man he would of had his phone wiped and recycled after he satisfied the NFL's wishes.
Goodell now says Wells report not impartial..but it doesn't matter...meaning he was lying before
In its brief, the NFL correctly stresses that Article 46 of the collective bargaining agreement lacks any language that compels an “independent” investigation. Therefore, the NFL reasons, the league had no legal obligation to provide Brady with an independent investigation.
originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: OccamsRazor04
What makes no sense to me is why Kraft? Kraft does have a lot of influence, but prior to him recently holding a "screw the National Football League" press conference, nobody defended the shield as strongly as Bob Kraft. They stuck a knife in the back of their most loyal owner as far as I am concerned.
As to the Pats just being "too good," I definitely think forced parity plays a role here. The Pats are by far the least worsened team under the league's parity efforts. The league has tried, but that damn Belichik meets the challenge everytime and the Patriots keep winning. As I've said, I'm not a Patriot fan or hater... I'm fairly neutral on them because my Broncos have always played them fairly even. If I was a Patriot fan, I think I'd boycott the NFL for awhile.
originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Brady was innocent only Patriots haters did not see it. Anyone who was against Brady in this needs to take a serious look at themselves.
originally posted by: verylowfrequency
I have no skin in the game, I'm not in the NFL, but as a fellow human being and NFL fan I think I'm entitled to my opinion without being called derogatory childish terms such as "hater" nor do I need to be told to take a serious look at myself. Pretty rude statement there.
OJ beat the wrap too, but does anyone really believe he is innocent?
Brady beat the wrap against the NFL because Goodell bungled the entire investigation like a fool or more likely appeared to.
In my opinion Brady did exactly what he is accused of and he lied about it. The punishment and the process is an entirely separate matter.
How the judge rules on the legal matter is between the parties involved, but as an outsider the judge's decision does not effect my opinion and I really don't need to be spat upon by those who disagree with me.
Are you demanding a 4 game suspension for Brady with there being no evidence?
Based on what evidence?
originally posted by: verylowfrequency
That doesn't change my belief that Brady was involved in deflating balls.
Bungled meaning Goodell didn't follow proper legal procedures because he doesn't know how, outlined in the judges ruling.
I have no legal burden to provide such. I agree that enough was not evident for the judge to rule in favor of the NFL. That does not change my opinion that Brady had his crew deflating balls.
The evidence of a court of law and public opinion are two different matters and that's why I made the OJ analogy regarding his not guilty court opinion in his criminal murder case and that of the public opinion. I thought it was common sense which OJ trial I was speaking about that the public disagreed, but apparently you wanted your coyness.
Again, I have no hate in the matter nor for anyone or any organization involved, I only have an opinion of what occurred based on common sense.
Brady did in a manner apologize to everyone for the spectacle in his glee. Even though it was aimed mostly at supporters, clearly he was reaching out to all sides. That was a nice gesture.
originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Based on what evidence?
The thing is, every quarterback likes it a little bit different,” Brady told the Sun-Sentinel at the time. “Some like them blown up a little bit more, some like them a little more thin, some like them a little more new, some like them really broken in.”
Tom Brady was the driving force behind a rules change that allowed visiting teams to provide their own footballs, rather than having both teams use footballs provided by the home team.
The ruling is based on Brady being punished with no evidence of any wrongdoing.
Fact: No balls were tampered with in the Colts game and it's proven. The only ball that is slightly low is the one the Colts had in their possession.
Berman did not rule on whether Brady tampered with footballs or knew that others did or even if it happened, because he was not asked to decide that. He did not proclaim the quarterback’s innocence. He merely ruled that the collective bargaining agreement between the N.F.L. and the players’ union did not give Goodell the authority to rule with impunity.
Again I ask, what exactly leads you to believe Brady did anything?
originally posted by: verylowfrequency
Same answer as the last time you asked. Common sense. A professional knows his equipment like the back of his hand he would be acutely aware of every aspect of every ball he touches. Example: When ex NFL quarterback Joe Montana was asked if Brady would know the balls inflation simply by touching it he smiled and agreed that obviously anyone at that level would be aware of the balls pressure.
If we take the mean of all six hypothetical scenarios, the average Patriot ball is about 0.003 PSI below where it should be at the time of measurement relative to the Colt balls.