Texas will Secede from the Union, 81,000 signatures!

originally posted by: Punisher75
a reply to: ManBehindTheMask

Yep cause every Texan has a confederate flag, on their front lawn, along with the Texas Flag they all have 4-wheel drives. Everyone wears a cowboy hat and owns a ranch.
Huge Mustaches are big in Texas.... the bigger the better.
Every man over the age of 50 looks JUST LIKE Sam Elliot.
Every man under the age of 50 Looks JUST LIKE Stone Cold Steve Austin.
And most importantly, All Texans pray three times a day in the direction of, and make a pilgrimage to the Alamo.

That was awesome

originally posted by: sdcigarpig
a reply to: FormOfTheLord
With no airforce, or navy, or any real military hardware, it would be a short fight.

The one thing that no one has considered is this: Texas can split into separate states, and does not need the approval of congress.

actually we build much of the military hardware that the US military uses, you forget Boeing and Lockheed build here, as well as ship yards.......

Oh and lets not forget that much of the nukes the US has were built near Amarillo.......of which we still have a lot of .....

Wrong again about us and military

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: enlightenedservant

you said I havent addressed any of your points.........

but you havent asked any questions, youve just made a series of statements........

what are your questions?

Nice try. I asked why you haven't addressed any of my points, not why haven't you answered any specific questions. My posts have been full of the points I'm talking about. I'm not retyping those long posts after rewording them as questions lol. I barely had the patience to type them once.

everything youve posted so far ive already addressed multiple times in the thread.........

As I seem to keep having to do.....

it seems people are more content to spout off then actually google anything........

or even read whats already been posted

originally posted by: Punisher75
a reply to: FormOfTheLord

Well at least you feel they should be allowed to leave if they want right?
I mean otherwise its bondage.
Might as well put a fence up now around Texas cause apparently there are many who think they should be prisoners.
Texas first Full on FEMA Camp in the USA
Why do I have Hotel California playing in my head?

Yes they should, why not? But it wont ever happen just like nato members cant just leave nato. I think every state is in till the end, no matter what.
LOL I have paint it black stuck in my head stones. If Texas did try and really leave I think war would break out and alot of our fellow Americans would die in a useless long drawn out civil war. I think war is a bad bad thing, I hope we never have to experience it in our lifetimes.

a reply to: muse7

As a Constitutional rule, no. In the United States, cities get their charter or legal status from the State laws.

a reply to: enlightenedservant

We're free to discuss whatever we want as long as it's allowed, right?

Yes of course. The thing I was bringing up was not if it should be discussed, but rather why people are so angry about it.

It's actually the opposite of sanctions. They derive many of their trade benefits from American trade agreements, free trade agreements, American infrastructure, and economic policies

I am not talking about them keeping Americas trade policies with other nations, I am talking about America being in trade with Texas.

I wouldn't! I've said it before, I like Texas for the most part. But politically, it would mean a permanent power shift to the left at the national level. So no "do overs" here.

That would be an unfortunate consequence in my opinion as well. However I suppose I would have apply for a Visa to move to Texas if I thought it was too bad.

If that's true, why are they Americans now? Why not just renounce their citizenships & leave now? If they really don't want to be a part of the United States, there's nothing stopping them from doing so right now

I would guess that perhaps they do not feel, that any other Nation Governs the way they want to govern themselves.

a reply to: Violater1

Good riddance. Texas only has a balanced budget because it gets $238 billion in federal funds. And that doesn't count the income from 6 Air Force bases, 2 joint bases, 10 Army bases, 2 Navy bases, and 10 Coast Guard Stations. And it ignores the expenses to the state of setting up its own postal system by building 743 post offices, buying over 4,000 vehicles and hiring tens of thousands of employees. And how about the cost of setting up its own air traffic control system and its own customs and immigration enforcement agencies. The benefits to the rest of us are manifold. Perry, and Cruz are no longer eligible for POTUS. Their textbooks will no longer be so influential. 34 red state electoral votes go away. I think I'll sign the petition to get rid of these slope-headed, slack-jawed, mouth-breathers

originally posted by: sdcigarpig
a reply to: FormOfTheLord
With no airforce, or navy, or any real military hardware, it would be a short fight.

The one thing that no one has considered is this: Texas can split into separate states, and does not need the approval of congress.

Yep it would be over before it ever even started. Infiltration and all ya know how it is.

a reply to: Punisher75

So basically they like being Americans and the perks that come with being Americans. But they don't want to be Americans when things aren't being governed the way they want? As in, they only have a problem when they don't want to deal with the ramifications of losing elections; the ramifications of "losing" Supreme Court decisions; the changing demographics or cultural norms, etc?

If that's the argument, I think it's pretty hypocritical. Because they don't have a problem when we lose elections or Supreme Court decisions, or when we don't like certain cultural norms (cough cough confederate flag cough). In other words, they're proud Americans when they get their way over other Americans. But when other Americans get to make decisions, they want to quit being Americans?

Why not make a compromise like this: every American has an opt-out ability of the laws & policies. That way, when they govern things in a way we don't like, we can opt out of their policies & still be Americans. And if we govern in ways they don't like, they can opt out of our policies & still be Americans. Because the whole "hey, we can't rule so we wanna leave America" angle sounds like selfish pouting.

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: enlightenedservant

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: enlightenedservant

you said I havent addressed any of your points.........

but you havent asked any questions, youve just made a series of statements........

what are your questions?

Nice try. I asked why you haven't addressed any of my points, not why haven't you answered any specific questions. My posts have been full of the points I'm talking about. I'm not retyping those long posts after rewording them as questions lol. I barely had the patience to type them once.

everything youve posted so far ive already addressed multiple times in the thread.........

As I seem to keep having to do.....

it seems people are more content to spout off then actually google anything........

or even read whats already been posted

Oh really? Have you responded to this?

But the constant "we're so good we don't need America" crap has to stop. I've lived in the South most of my life & one phrase we hear a lot is "put up or shut up". Don't go around waving the American flag, claiming you're American patriots, then constantly brag you want to secede. Put up or shut up. Either be proud to be an American & quit the secession BS or "walk the walk", renounce your citizenships, and go. Like I said earlier, both sides could finally get past the left vs right crap & go on with their business.

originally posted by: sdcigarpig
a reply to: Semicollegiate
Not according to the Court Case that was mentioned. Now if you can provide legal bearing on such, then it may be something to argue in court. And there would be much to lose. First would be the economic base would take a hit. The state says it breaks away, if the US government does not object, all it has to do is simply cut off the vital resources needed. Divert all shipping away and ultimately put a strangle hold on the state, where it would have only 2 choices, one agree not to, or deal with a country it does not like, Mexico.

And the past few years of drought has been hard on the state, pushing its water resources to the limits. And the state sure seems to need a lot of federal funding every year, cause of the tornadoes hitting it every year, doing alot of damage. Combined with a few other problems brewing in the state, it is not going to be pretty.

There is one other problem and this is one that has been asked time and time again, how does one separate out its economies from a union of other states? No one is sure, and most experts all agree, it could be very messy.

The Supreme Court was formed to offer a service of expert advice for disputes between states.

Any other interpretation of the powers of the Supreme Court is ludicrous hand over of power. No one fights a war for freedom and then gives it away. The 13 sovereign governments entered into essentially a mutual trade and protection treaty. They would not and did not knowingly give up their freedom to the central government. That is human nature.

a reply to: F4guy

Good riddance. Texas only has a balanced budget because it gets $238 billion

actually thats wrong, with our energy production , and trade with that alone, if we could govern ourselves would well compensate for that...

Much of what youre talking about doesnt take into account that we are governed by Washington policies........

With the ability to do as we wish with our resources and trade how we want.......

Youd see a gigantic change in revenue for the state of Texas

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: crazyewok

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: crazyewok
Good for the USA without Texas they may be able to finally teach REAL science in state schools

Wow, that statement is almost as ignorant as you suppose Texans are

Its called humor..............

Insulting a whole group of people is called humor?



Odd that, Im usually pretty spot on with my British humor.......

It's going after the low hanging fruit.

a reply to: enlightenedservant

the "were too good to be americans"

is your own OPINION of the reasons that this is secession is ever brought up, that doesnt make it fact......

The actual REASON this even comes up is because people are sick and tired of the tyrannical US gov.....how are you so short sighted you cant see that?

The REASON, it comes up with Texas, (if you knew history) is that Texas , because of its history and how it came bout, is in a unique position to be able to do something (possibly) that other states cant, altho it wouldnt be easy...

The problem with your whole premise is that your injecting your own opinion and not actual facts into it......

You can be a proud American and still not be happy with your government..........ask any voter (or non voter).....

Your emotional response to the topic of secession does not constitute as the truth of the matter

Nothing will come of this.

originally posted by: Bloodydagger
Nothing will come of this.

nope it wont

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: enlightenedservant

the "were too good to be americans"

is your own OPINION of the reasons that this is secession is ever brought up, that doesnt make it fact......

The actual REASON this even comes up is because people are sick and tired of the tyrannical US gov.....how are you so short sighted you cant see that?

The REASON, it comes up with Texas, (if you knew history) is that Texas , because of its history and how it came bout, is in a unique position to be able to do something (possibly) that other states cant, altho it wouldnt be easy...

The problem with your whole premise is that your injecting your own opinion and not actual facts into it......

You can be a proud American and still not be happy with your government..........ask any voter (or non voter).....

Your emotional response to the topic of secession does not constitute as the truth of the matter

[snipped]

If Texas is in such a special position, then why won't they quit yapping and actually leave? I've already said I'm cool with that. I have no problems with Texas as a whole. But if they seceded, it would be magnificent for me politically. I thought we were in agreement on that. Instead, it seems like you just want bragging rights & for everyone else to kiss up to you because of your broad collection of misleading facts about how great you supposedly are.

However, if you're facts are correct, why would you even want to be with America? Just follow the legal procedures & go. You seem to think you're doing us a favor. But clearly, most of us don't want that favor. So show us why we should've been so grateful. Not with weak words but with actions. That was the whole "put up or shut up" part you conveniently ignored.

As a Texan...little stuns like this threatening to secede just give Texans a bad name.

These people are not brave and they are not standing up to anything. What they are making clear though is that they are cowards...that they'd rather run from their problems instead of working alongside other Americans to fix them.

Shame that this secession attitude is still prevalent among many.

a reply to: enlightenedservant

LOL In other words, you ignore everything you can't refute? You couldn't even respond to the entire sentence I made, much less the entire paragraph. That's pathetic.

i addressed exactly what you copy and pasted me to address........and my response was longer then your one paragraph ...

Then you say I cant refute you?

You would actually have to have a valid argument to begin to refute anything.........

But keep up the personal attacks....

I have facts to back up my claims, which I have actually posted multiple times.......

Again your emotional response does not = truth

Instead, it seems like you just want bragging rights & for everyone else to kiss up to you because of your broad collection of misleading facts about how great you supposedly are.

Your accusation your burden of proof, please provide evidence that they arent true..........

originally posted by: enlightenedservant
a reply to: Punisher75

So basically they like being Americans and the perks that come with being Americans. But they don't want to be Americans when things aren't being governed the way they want? As in, they only have a problem when they don't want to deal with the ramifications of losing elections; the ramifications of "losing" Supreme Court decisions; the changing demographics or cultural norms, etc?

If that's the argument, I think it's pretty hypocritical. Because they don't have a problem when we lose elections or Supreme Court decisions, or when we don't like certain cultural norms (cough cough confederate flag cough). In other words, they're proud Americans when they get their way over other Americans. But when other Americans get to make decisions, they want to quit being Americans?

Why not make a compromise like this: every American has an opt-out ability of the laws & policies. That way, when they govern things in a way we don't like, we can opt out of their policies & still be Americans. And if we govern in ways they don't like, they can opt out of our policies & still be Americans. Because the whole "hey, we can't rule so we wanna leave America" angle sounds like selfish pouting.

Well I personally think you are touching on something, however my view does not paint them of being pouty.
My best guess would be that State Rights is really the "larger issue" and the reason for any talk of secession rather than only being American when it suits them.

So far as changing cultural norms go and not liking it... well this is a part of the reason why states were supposed to have more power than the federal government to begin with.
You know, so that if you did not like the way the state was run or did not like the cultural norm of that state you could live someplace else and still reap the benefits of being a part of a Union.

So no I don't think they are being selfish at all, they just want to be able to do what the constitution allows for without federal interference in attempt to keep them from doing it.
I would imagine that if the Federal Government would allow States to have their State Rights with all the power that goes along with it, as the Constitution dictates then there would be no talk of secession at all.