What if you're wrong about which deity you pray to?

This recycled argument has recently popped up in another thread and instead of derailing that topic, I figured it was best to make it a star of it's own thread alone.

This is the claim made by a ton of religious individuals worldwide:

If you're right and god doesn't exist, if we believers still believe by the time we die.... oh well.

If the faithful are right and god does exist at the end of it all .... sucks to be you.

Essentially the claim is saying that "you can't win the lottery if you don't play"

To which I say:

On the contrary, if you are only believing because you are afraid that if you don't bad things can happen, then you're only 'being good' simply out of fear, which isn't being a good person to begin with.

Not only that, but you are just as likely to be wrong about all the 10's of thousands of other religions out there, and you're probably worse off believing in the wrong idol than none at all if that's the case.

Plus, what if your specific denomination is the wrong one in your religion? There are 40,000+ denominations in Christianity alone, after all. What if the christian god is super particular and says, "What are you all doing!!?! The only true Christians are part of that really obscure denomination that still believes in a flat Earth, You're all going to hell for your false beliefs!!!"

And then you have all the wasted time praying, or hating on other people (obviously not all religious people are like this, but it's undoubtedly used as a tool by many to act on hate stemming from their religious beliefs), or going to church, or obtaining from learning anything outside of your religion.

In the end, believing in a single religion is not only just as bad as not having any belief at all, but it has the potential of actually being worse.

Food for thought.

a reply to: Ghost147


I think this covers it.

“If I’m wrong about God then I wasted my life. If you’re wrong about God then you wasted your eternity.”

But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

a reply to: Ghost147

I believe that all the major religions, not the nutters at Scientology, are written by enlightened men. But I don't believe in Ritual Salvation.

I believe Hinduism claims One creator and Buddhism claims a connection to One Light source. And the rest also claim One God.

Since they all claim only One source it is more likely to me that the people who are called prophets would all agree, that their is only One source.

This way I am free to believe in All the religious texts having value, and continue to study them All.

But if the One God requires Ritual Salvation then I guess I am SOL.

a reply to: Ghost147

The God I worship would forgive you.

He knows that making mistakes is what makes us human.

If I were a God, I'd be proud of my creations who used common sense, logic and intellect to choose the right deity for them to worship.

I wouldn't feel betrayed if they worshiped that other LAME god down the road... unless I were a jealous, weak, unconfident god... which I'm not... or I'll just flood your land and kill you all!

I'd also respect and be proud of the ones who chose NOT to believe in any deity based on lack of proof of a deity ever existing.

But then I'd kill them in the end anyway for not believing in me!

Carlin puts it in perspective. Don't click if a couple of bad words offend:

i.imgur.com...

a reply to: Ghost147

Personally I like to think that IF there is a god of any kind, he knows what's in your heart when your end comes.
If you tried to do right by him/her throughout your life then all is good.
If you went through life not believing then your reasons why are known to him/her and all is good.

And all that is IF he/she even cares what you do with your life and what you believe.

Can God really blame one for lack of belief in something when no signs or communication is ever given?

a reply to: Ghost147

On the contrary, if you are only believing because you are afraid that if you don't bad things can happen, then you're only 'being good' simply out of fear, which isn't being a good person to begin with.

That covers some percentage. I think I another bigger percentage of believers give lip service to religion because they are keeping up appearances, doing whats expected of them. They would never be honest and say outright they don't really believe like 'real believers'.

Thats the nice thing about belief systems, they don't require any proof, just a belief.

Still another percentage 'practice' religion (going to church) so they don't actually have to help people. They just 'pray' about others problems, convenient that.

a reply to: Ghost147

I had a similar mindset as I was struggling with my faith. It was the point where I simply couldn't believe my religion held the universal truths. My mind said no, but my heart said, "What if you're still wrong? What if you end up in hell because of it?" Admittedly, the way most Christians view hell, doesn't make it out to be a very pleasant place. I resolved my struggle by resigning myself to hell. I figured, this god has no interest in a guy like me. A guy who likes to try peeking around to see what's behind the curtain. I ask too many damned questions! It wasn't long before I just stopped caring either way, and went along in my disbelief. Eventually becoming an atheist.

I truly feel that many religious folks simply can't view the world objectively, in regards to faith at least. For X, Y, and Z reasons. Too many to describe here and now. To each their own. But bet your ass you will get some responses chalked full of confirmation bias in here!

originally posted by: ShadowLink
a reply to: Ghost147

Personally I like to think that IF there is a god of any kind, he knows what's in your heart when your end comes.
If you tried to do right by him/her throughout your life then all is good.
If you went through life not believing then your reasons why are known to him/her and all is good.

And all that is IF he/she even cares what you do with your life and what you believe.

Can God really blame one for lack of belief in something when no signs or communication is ever given?

Well said. This is something I feel as well.

from what i understand, god is supposed to be all loving and caring.
having said that, i see all kinds of suffering and terrible # going down every day.

imo, any god that allows these things to happen to his people is no god i want to follow or worship.

if i end up in the furnace, so be it. not anyone elses problem

a reply to: intrepid

i remember that skit.
awesome
carlin talking about the flood and god..

'but he loves us'
hahahahah

a reply to: Ghost147

I have the same train of thought. I grew up Catholic, attended a private Catholic school and was an alter boy for 4 years serving daily masses, weddings and funerals 7 days a week! I became disenchanted with the religion after noticing the hypocrisy, and how well the priests lived as compared to the people who lived in the poor neighborhood surrounding the church. The donation expectations from the church, and how mean and physically cruel some of the nuns and priests acted toward students was also shameful.

The last straw was when my son was getting his first holy communion. A lot of families were proud to see their kids getting this sacrament and wanted to preserve it with their own personal photographs. The church made everyone aware before the start of the ceremony that there would be no photographs taken because they hired a professional photographer to photograph the event. If parents wanted photographs, they could purchase them through this photographer.

Really? So the church is nothing more than a business. Forget about enjoying the moment, it's all about what the church can get out of it. They not only get donations, but are engaged in numerous fundraising activities, and summer festivals that bring in hundreds of thousands of dollars on the backs of volunteers!

When you have a lot of religions who threaten people with eternal damnation if they don't commit to their religion, and then judge people and go against Christ's very own teachings, it's a logical reason to question where it's origins have originated.

It depends. Do you believe that all of the Gods are the same Holy Father just showing another face or do you think that some of them are works of the deceiver in which case not all gods would be created equal and you could indeed wind up worshipping the wrong one.

And there are different perspectives on salvation and when you can accept it and repent. Some say there may be a last chance just after you pass. But none of us knows. But Christ is pretty clear that however you get there, it's through Him and you have to accept what He offers in humility at some point in some way.

a reply to: Ghost147
But Ghost, the bible says...

I found this amusing:

Atheist's Wager

The Atheist's Wager is a variant of Pascal's Wager that divides the gods who reward faith and the gods who reward works, finding that it is better to not believe and do good works, for maximum benefit. If one takes into account that rewarding and punishing based on faith in a deity without reasonable evidence to believe that a god is evil, then spending your time sucking up to a such a deity is a waste of time. If one discounts the possibility of a god who sends good people to hell for bad reasons, we are left with a completely different payoff table.

(Table at link below)

Regardless of one's belief about a benevolent god, the results still favor a good life. Pascal's Wager relies on the judgments of an evil god who sends good people to hell for not believing in him. Moreover, because there are an infinite number of possible such gods, the odds of getting the right answer are 1 in ∞. Even if a faith-rewarding god existed, believing in an incorrect faith-rewarding god might anger such a god more than not believing in any gods with good reasons.

Atheist's Wager - Iron Chariots

I don't worship God out of fear of going to hell. Sure the thought is scary, but that's not my reason. I worship God out of respect and thankfulness.

If people want to follow other faiths then that is fine by me, I might not agree with their ideas but I can at least respect the fact that they at least believe in a Creator and that we are not just here by chance.

a reply to: Ghost147

Many religions share basic tenets(love for fellow man, do not murder, steal, etc.), and by committing yourself to a certain religion, you accept and live by them. I don't believe there is a "right" religion, nullifying the rest. Any religion that preaches hate, or violence to validate their ideology violates those basic tenets IMO. I believe that man's interpretation of religion has created many of the negative views of that religion, and can't comprehend why followers would over ride a base sense of right & wrong to enact that agenda.

Not belonging to any church, but being spiritual in nature, I grew up Catholic, belonged to both denominational and non at one time, and I left for various reasons. I feel that personal faith and prayer are not wasted efforts if they bring balance and solace to one's life. The emphasis of tolerance of others is missing from many organized religions, especially those that embrace violence or hate as a means of expression or validation.

a reply to: Ghost147

Christian denominations are not mutually exclusive. For example, a Lutheran Christian is just as Christian as an Anglican Christian, as is a Baptist Christian.

The mode that they express their Christianity does not change the fact that they worship the same God, namely, Jesus Christ.

The variety is due to issues of human culture, tradition and usually fairly minor doctrinal issues (they still all hold core beliefs of the deity of Jesus Christ and how we may be saved through repentance and acceptance of His sacrifice on our behalf).

In the plethora of expressions of faith, there are those that see things in an "us and them" way that may not always accept traditions other than their own. This is a human failing and not a true reflection of the Christianity of denominations.

One may be a member of a particular denomination without being a Christian. Christian faith is personal, between God and the person directly.

Groups that attempt to 'proxy' access to God through themselves are likely to have few Christian members and are more like a club than a faith.

a reply to: Ghost147

The flaw in your logic is that believing in God is about being good. Its not. Believing in God is about having a personal relationship with Him in which the byproduct is good.