Channel Tunnel: '2,000 migrants' tried to enter

I don't know if anyone has posted this yet, didn't read all the posts, its a long thread.

According to international conventions, a refugee has to claim asylum in the FIRST safe country they arrive at. If they pass through a safe country without claiming asylum, and go to a second country to claim asylum, their claim can be arbitrarily rejected on the grounds that they failed to claim in the first country, and therefore are not a true refugee, just a migrant.

So why isn't the UK arbitrarily rejecting their claims and deporting them?

Another thing that gets me about this crisis, is the UK's policy of fining drivers who, unbeknown to them, picked up a migrant or two. They are hacking off padlocks, and entering trucks. The driver then reports this to the authorities, and gets hit with a fine, per person.

This stupid policy is only going to make drivers NOT report them.

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: Soloprotocol

You're ignoring the fact that Ed Miliband and The Labour Party put a halt to Cameron and The Tories desire to get involved in Syria.

You are ignoring the fact that your comment is complete BS. look up the facts before you make erroneous claims. The Tories were ball deep in Syria back then and now.

originally posted by: Soloprotocol

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: Soloprotocol

You're ignoring the fact that Ed Miliband and The Labour Party put a halt to Cameron and The Tories desire to get involved in Syria.

You are ignoring the fact that your comment is complete BS. look up the facts before you make erroneous claims. The Tories were ball deep in Syria back then and now.

Come back when you have something interesting to say.

www.bbc.co.uk...

Where are they getting the idea they will get free housing and money in the UK? What media are they accessing which promotes these myths?

When I was volunteering with young homeless people non of them got free housing or free money, very few private landlords accept housing benefit and getting a free house isn't as easy as some would have you believe. It was a daily struggle trying to find a bedroom for some cases and that was in a small town.

a reply to: woodwardjnr

Were your young people illegal immigrants though? Just asking out of curiosity

originally posted by: MrCrow
a reply to: woodwardjnr



Were your young people illegal immigrants though? Just asking out of curiosity

No they were all British

originally posted by: woodwardjnr
Where are they getting the idea they will get free housing and money in the UK? What media are they accessing which promotes these myths?

Daily Mail

Daily Mail

Daily Mail

Daily Mail

Daily Fail

Daily Heil

Ever get the feeling the Headlines designed to grab your attention and enrage you are the same headlines that encourage Illegal immigration into the UK. Ever get the feeling you are being played because you are too stupid to know otherwise.

originally posted by: woodwardjnr

originally posted by: MrCrow
a reply to: woodwardjnr



Were your young people illegal immigrants though? Just asking out of curiosity

No they were all British

Even the ones who came from Jamaica, Pakistan, India, Hong Kong etc etc etc..Hmmmmm

Zimbabwean refugees to Botswana and caned and sent back.
www.herald.co.zw...
Not one word from the UN.

While I'm not suggesting that Europe should cane illegal immigrants, the UN's double standards and expectations between Western (and white majority countries) and fairly successful non-white countries is unacceptable.
The constant castigation of Europe is starting to seem like anti-Western discrimination and albophobia.
Why penalize and hammer the currently successful countries in favor of ideologies that are miserable failures?
Equal rights and responsibilities should be expected of all countries, not only Europe, or Europe would be quite justified in telling the UN to get stuffed.

Europe should give the UN an ultimatum to enforce equal global standards regarding refugees, or they can expect to be ignored, and seen as racist.

The rich Islamic Gulf States and billionaire African dictators should also help to pay or have their assets frozen.
For example, if wars between Sunnis and Shiities cause their populations to flee, then countries like Iran or Saudi Arabia should pay Europe per refugee from those ideologies, or the money should be deducted otherwise.
That's only fair.
The US should help to pay for refugees from Afghanistan, or take them in.
Countries with entire fleeing populations (from a socialist type of forced labor) like Eritrea should either reform or face military UN intervention.
Their leaders have become a menace to the security of other countries, and should face the consequences.

In South Africa we've already got millions of refugees, and there are frequent and violent outbreaks of xenophobia, which is an inevitable consequence of uncontrolled illegal immigration.

Fair is fair, and either Botswana must take Zimbabwean refugees, or Europe owes the UN nothing on the refugee crisis.

Just because these people from various source countries chose to pitch in Europe shouldn't make it just Europe's sudden responsibility, but a global one.

originally posted by: halfoldman
Zimbabwean refugees to Botswana and caned and sent back.
www.herald.co.zw...
Not one word from the UN.

While I'm not suggesting that Europe should cane illegal immigrants, the UN's double standards and expectations between Western (and white majority countries) and fairly successful non-white countries is unacceptable.
The constant castigation of Europe is starting to seem like anti-Western discrimination and albophobia.
Why penalize and hammer the currently successful countries in favor of ideologies that are miserable failures?
Equal rights and responsibilities should be expected of all countries, not only Europe, or Europe would be quite justified in telling the UN to get stuffed.

Europe should give the UN an ultimatum to enforce equal global standards regarding refugees, or they can expect to be ignored, and seen as racist.

The rich Islamic Gulf States and billionaire African dictators should also help to pay or have their assets frozen.
For example, if wars between Sunnis and Shiities cause their populations to flee, then countries like Iran or Saudi Arabia should pay Europe per refugee from those ideologies, or the money should be deducted otherwise.
That's only fair.
The US should help to pay for refugees from Afghanistan, or take them in.
Countries with entire fleeing populations (from a socialist type of forced labor) like Eritrea should either reform or face military UN intervention.
Their leaders have become a menace to the security of other countries, and should face the consequences.

In South Africa we've already got millions of refugees, and there are frequent and violent outbreaks of xenophobia, which is an inevitable consequence of uncontrolled illegal immigration.

Fair is fair, and either Botswana must take Zimbabwean refugees, or Europe owes the UN nothing on the refugee crisis.

Just because these people from various source countries chose to pitch in Europe shouldn't make it just Europe's sudden responsibility, but a global one.

Nice idea, but you missed the fact the its been the dream of Islam to take over the world for a very long time, and by pushing refugees in vast numbers to Europe they are taking the first big steps, thats why the rich ME countries dont help.

a reply to: woodwardjnr

I really can't say much about the UK. But in Australia when a asylum seeker's given permission to live here, I'm pretty sure they hook them up with like 10 grand, government housing and welfare payments. Doubt it's much different in the UK, I mean, I doubt they just drop them off on the streets of London with one change of clothes and say, "good luck mate"!.

It's a major source of resentment in Australia that they get all that.

But on the flip side, we've been given a chance our whole lives to shine though and succeed in life. It's only fair they get a few grand and a house to have there chance.

Besides, if some 3rd world immigrant been given 10 grand and a commission house is that much of a source of resentment & jealousy to you, then maybe it's time to realize that you messed your own chance up and have no one else to blame but yourself, for your own short comings.

a reply to: Soloprotocol the ones who came to us were mainly young British homeless, mostly kicked out of their family homes no family support. There's quite a large Eastern European community, but they don't normally use our services. It's a social hub where people come to get some help, use the food bank and have a sandwich.

originally posted by: BMorris
According to international conventions, a refugee has to claim asylum in the FIRST safe country they arrive at.

I believe most of them do. Often that's Italy. To understand how it is that these people end up in Calais and why they behave like they do, allow me to provide some background.

Typically these people were born in some poor and/or unstable nation in middle-Africa. It are mostly younger men that went to the North of Africa to try to find work there and support their families. They might, for example, end up in Libya. Many in here do not realize this, but Libya had a working economy. There were jobs there. They allowed foreigners to work there. The African refugees hence found a job in say Libya and earned decent wages, enough to support their families. No need to go to Europe at all, and much closer to their families too. The money they sent home was sufficient to keep their families alive. So, all in all - no problem.

Then we barged in. We removed the ruler of the land and withdrew, leaving the country in chaos. Our so-called "War on Terror" destroyed many of the jobs in Libya, but even worse: it created an hostile environment in which the ones that still had jobs were robbed by competing gangs. Now, what do you think that a young man, that has to support his family and is either out of a job or is routinely robbed from his income to "voluntarily" support some armed gang will do?

Then he meets some guy that says he can help him get to Europe. Going south is not an option, staying isn't either, so he takes the offer. It will typically depend on the amount of money somebody still has, but you can get a place aboard one of those "ships" for roughly an weeks salary. So, the story they all have had to pay 10.000 pound or thereabout is nonsense, if they had that kind of money they would be able to support their families for years.

So, they embark. During the trip, some die of suffocation, some fall overboard and drown. Sometimes the entire "ship" disappears in the waves. But thank Goodness - most make it alive.

They are then sent to Lampedusa and after some time may be allowed to enter Italy. Many of the refugees try to get a job in Italy first, but Italy has been in a crisis and many Italians go to the North to try to find a job themselves. As we do not have internal border controls in Europa anybody, legal or not, can freely go wherever they want to, and they do. Not having internal borders anymore is what European nations decided on and so it now is not a national problem anymore.

So, say they arrive in France - the will try to get a job there. But even if there is sufficient work, they aren't allowed to take it, as they do not have the proper documents. So, what are they supposed to do? I think it is of some importance to note they mostly had jobs and are here to try to get a job, it's not that they expect to be supported.

So why isn't the UK arbitrarily rejecting their claims and deporting them?

Free travel of people and goods, that's also what the UK decided on. Actually, it is bizarre that the UK / France still have these ridiculous border control routines in place; I can travel from Danmark to Greece, zigzagging my way right through most European countries and never be stopped once, but if I have to go to the effin' UK they nearly strip me naked..

Another thing that gets me about this crisis, is the UK's policy of fining drivers who, unbeknown to them, picked up a migrant or two. They are hacking off padlocks, and entering trucks. The driver then reports this to the authorities, and gets hit with a fine, per person.

I can't image that it is like you say it is - but if it is, it's just British Law, I guess.

a reply to: ForteanOrg

This i do not understand.

Libyans are crossing The Med on boats, then landing in Southern Europe to eventually make their way to Calais. Once there they try to cross into The U.K. Illegally.

However if they paid for a flight to London from Libya, once arriving in London they could ask for asylum. The cost for a flight to London is £425.00 ( i have just checked the cost)

Something just doesn't add up here.

a reply to: alldaylong

Not everyone has the privilege of a passport that allows them to travel all over the world.

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
a reply to: alldaylong

Not everyone has the privilege of a passport that allows them to travel all over the world.

If you have a look at Europe at the moment seem 10,000 without passports are doing just that

a reply to: Subaeruginosa


Some of The Libyans at Calais are stating they are Doctors, Dentists Teachers etc. You are telling me that those type of professional people do not have a passport ?

I don't buy it.

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: ForteanOrg

This i do not understand.

Libyans are crossing The Med on boats, then landing in Southern Europe to eventually make their way to Calais. Once there they try to cross into The U.K. Illegally.

However if they paid for a flight to London from Libya, once arriving in London they could ask for asylum. The cost for a flight to London is £425.00 ( i have just checked the cost)

Something just doesn't add up here.

Exactly - for the cost many of these migrants are paying the traffickers, they could get a 1st class ticket from anywhere in the world and do as you say, claim asylum upon arrival. Christ, they could get a world cruise on a luxury liner, wait until they arrive at their country of choice and still have change to spend when they got here....

originally posted by: imod02

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
a reply to: alldaylong

Not everyone has the privilege of a passport that allows them to travel all over the world.

If you have a look at Europe at the moment seem 10,000 without passports are doing just that

But apparently, many of these migrants actually give their documents to the traffickers as part of the deal, or in fact get given wholly new identities in return.

And, as stated earlier, many are not fleeing from War or persecution, so they certainly had time to pack their things before they left.